Posted by Tsepz_GP
Sony Mobile Communications is a brand new company formed after the Sony Ericsson split, but it has the Sony brand and the ambition to become the world’s third largest phone maker “not in 10 years’ time, but a lot sooner.” Currently, Sony Mobile has a 6.5% to 7% of the market by value.
Sony head of sales and marketing Dennis van Schie hopes the company would be able to capture 20% of all Android sales, currently dominated by Samsung, with a huge combined presence of ‘other’ Chinese white box makers.
All of this will allegedly be possible because of the huge synergies emerging after the Sony Ericsson split. The Swedish Japanese joint venture existed from 2001 to 2011, and brought some iconic handsets, but could not leverage Sony’s key technologies.
The situation has changed radically since the new company was formed.
“Even if we thought we were part of Sony, all the hard-core technological assets that were available—applications, services, the hardware, like the sensors—were not really made available to us,” van Schie said. “It was not a competitive advantage at that time. Now it is. It clearly is.”
The executive said a screen made for Sony’s TV business “was optimized for mobile” just six months later. Also, Sony Mobile now allegedly has early access to its parent company’s camera sensors used by many in the industry.
“Where we leverage—and this is a big change from the past—the sales and marketing infrastructure of Sony. For example, in India. I was responsible for product development on the technological side at Sony Ericsson. We had a team of 25, 30 people, and to get to the mom-and-pop stores out there in a massive, complex and vast country like India is very risky.”
With those R&D and sales synergies, Sony Mobile might well achieve its goal. It’s scored solid growth in the past few quarters, and in just a couple of weeks we’ll see how it did in the third quarter of 2013.
PhoneArena
Posted by bart
Ericsson was nr 3 and on its way to become nr 2.
But then the CEO and some board of directors said its better to make a jointventure with Sony, they promis us money and technology. Technology like MSD and we can use their branding (for a price)
Posted by hihihans
There is no reason to look back to the ericsson days, just look at all the brands that came and went.
Sony wants to be at Nr;3 that's an ambition we can only encourage.
Posted by Bonovox
IMO Sony is better now than Sony Ericsson was. Yes SE made great devices but they went through a bad time with their buggy phones and poor build. Sony seems to be improving their quality from what I see. Why do people keep harping back to the SE days?? It's over move on nothing you can do about it now.
Posted by etaab
Are you nuts ? the quality has done nothing but dropped since they dropped Ericsson. Sony, which have always been one of my favourite brands simply put made terrible phones before they got into bed with Ericsson.
I don't know about you, but I don't remember having a "screen lottery" with SE. I also remember getting better firmware updates with SE.
Sony I would love to see in a top spot. Id love to see them best Samsung, but I have no faith in them as they make continuously bad mistakes. The fact they let their Playstation Network get hacked with careless security measures illustrates their poor decision making.
Ive not seen a Z1 yet, but from the amount of complaints and problems ive read on this site and others again doesn't give me much confidence in them.
Posted by Bonovox
DELETED
[ This Message was edited by: Bonovox on 2013-10-07 09:58 ]
Posted by reeflotz
@ etaab
calling someone nuts is uncalled for just because they don't agree with your opinion, that's just utter disrespect. Plus you are calling someone nuts when you yourself admittedly haven't even seen or tried a Z1, yet you have so many bad things to say about it already
SE getting better updates? proof please? During SE their Android phones were even late to support multitouch afaik.
Sony has been decent with the updates ever since the Z released, plus most of their midrange handsets got updated too, my Xperia Go runs Jellybean smooth and stable and guess what the Xperia Go is the cheapest waterproof smartphone from Sony yet it's updated nicely.
Furthermore, try reading the Z1 thread, complaints came from people who does not even have it. The esato members who now have Z1 says otherwise and proves that the negative points about Z1 are just exaggerated and are not literally as bad as it sounds. Even in the Z1 photo thread you can see that it takes great pictures conflicting other reviews from review sites stating otherwise.
What's the playstation network getting hacked got to do with Sony smartphones? Guess what, Microsoft's Xbox live accounts got hacked too. Anybody can hack into anything if they really want to. So does that mean Microsoft too have "careless security measures" as you said?
There's just one thing that I agree with your post and that is the screen lottery, but that has also been exaggerated imo, even if you got the bad panel, it's not bad, in fact it is still better than the Z. You still get accurate colors with a much wider color gamut, sharp display. Only thing you don't get is wide viewing angles.
[ This Message was edited by: reeflotz on 2013-10-07 06:36 ]
Posted by bart
There's nothing wrong with calling someone nuts
The quality of Sony phones isn't as good as SE (or Ericsson), this is just a fact.
Don't all focus on the Xperia Z, they sell a lot more phones, and appart from being overprised they all look the same.
Sony is boring and i'm not seeing any innovation, back in the old days they brought new things every year, but now... nothing.
I think he pointed out the Sony playstation network as an example of a half finished product. Ever since the company changed in the early 2000, Sony has never been the same.
And as for the updates, well the last update i had for the Xperia T made the cam quality bad and the phone a lot slower.
I'm hoping the new upcomming update (when ever that is) will improve that.
Posted by reeflotz
On 2013-10-07 09:39:12, bart wrote:
The quality of Sony phones isn't as good as SE (or Ericsson), this is just a fact.
Sony is boring and I'm not seeing any innovation, back in the old days they brought new things every year, but now... nothing.
Can you please elaborate more on this? I would be glad to be proven wrong. I had an
Hazel, in two years it got bricked for no reason, so I wouldn't exactly say has better quality than Sony, plus Elm/Hazel has both the lines issue in lowlight picture which was quite annoying, even though it did take good pictures in daylight, it was horrible having those lines issue taking lowlight pictures. Those are present in every Elm/Hazel handset.
What kind of innovation are you looking for in Sony? Right now there's Triluminous screens and finally flagship specs on an android phone, also including better sensor tech, to be able to produce comparable images against 1020 especially in lowlight while all in a slim waterproof smartphone is impressive and innovative in my opinion.
During the days of SE, their flagship phones like the X10 and Arc are quite behind the competition, the X10 not even having multitouch which is important for android apps. The Arc having specs inferior to the competition which was important back then because Android was still a little bit heavy for a single core phone during it's days.
If you're referring to the days of cameraphones k800, k810, c901, c905, then true those were the golden days of SE, but after that nothing innovative came from them either. SE cameraphones were great in taking pics but lacks good video recording, even the Satio only records in VGA while the competition already has HD recording.
There's also k850 getting bricked, and initially the software was not fine tuned, causing pics with Xenon flash being underexposed because of wrong flash timing. Although it was fixed later on, SE also had it's share of problems during it's time.
Now I'm not against SE, I actually miss my
Hazel, but still overall I find Sony right now is in a right direction, we will see what will happen.[ This Message was edited by: reeflotz on 2013-10-07 11:15 ]
Posted by goldenface
I too think Sony is moving in the right direction. I'm impressed with the Z and while I too like SE, I sometimes felt that they didn't have the full might of Sony behind them.
Now, with Xperia, we have access to Sony's imaging and screen technologies and Playstation mobile too, which has some good quality mobile games. They're using good quality materials and introduced waterproofing as almost a standard feature on its higher end phones.
Posted by bart
There's no need to look at the smartphones that SE produced during the final days. They had to launch unfinished products to keep up with the others.
Reason for that was they ended symbian UIQ instead of pushing it forward.
The glory and innovation days started with the T610 and continued for a long time, but every time Sony was holding them back. They couldn't ge the latest sensors or cam modules, they had to use MSD and later on M2.
At the end they didn't really know which direction they wanted to take, thats why they launched products with unfinished UI's and firmware.
I right now have an Xperia T for less then a year, and the screen is full of scratches, i really take care of my phones, i used a P1 for many (many, many) years and the screen still looks fine. Even my P800 was still good, even though the buttons pressed down on the screen.
So in terms of quality they aren't really trying enough. I agree having phones which are ip57 is good, but thats easely done because they are so thin.
What kind of innovation am i looking for? Well everything they launched so far excisted in the early 2000's. Ericsson had more (working) prototypes then phones. So what they had back then excists now.
What do we need imo, the next gen of battery's or we might even skip that part and go to the gen beyond that. An AI so the phone will be more then just a tool, an really screen based on (a nokia pattent) that will repair itself. Flexible phones (like samsung is finally launching), better cams (quality, amount of mp, infra red filming, ...), there are so many things that can be improved.
And while Sony seems to be on the right track i would say, look to the others, none of them is really pushing hard.
Small company's like Jolla, and Yota, they are still pushing hard to get a phone on the market with some innovation.
Posted by Ranjith
I wouldn't agree that SONY is as bad as etaab states it is.I do understand his POV though..for someone who respects SONY its sad to see that they aren't as good as SAMSUNG.
BUT SONY is making some beautiful phone with great specs..all they are lacking is that X factor..that 100%.Screen lottery is an issue.i would like to see SONY make a phone with every one having an equally good screen and acceptable by all.That's when SONY will have gone one step forward.Right now they are making nice phones but are a step behind SAMSUNG.But they are on the right path and they have the potential to get right on top in a very short time
Posted by MyP910
I 100% agree with reeflotz. Sony is getting better and has shown tremendous innovation in all their products. Is it a surprise when PSN being hacked? No. Every single software can be hacked. It is just a matter of whether you want to hack or not. Hey, adobe just being hacked. Saying adobe is unfinished product is absurd.
In terms of innovation, I think Sony is the only company that innovate.
QX10 and QX100 are innovations.
Triluminous display that uses quantum dot technology is innovation
Able to use pencil on capacitive touchscreen is innovation
Able to squeeze in good lens in a slim profile is innovation
Vaio tap 11 with Intel haswell processor in a slim profile is innovation
Smartwatch is innovation
PlayStation 4 is innovation
.....more. I don't see any other company that innovative as Sony. Most of them just recycle their products.
and, I'm puzzled when people say Samsung is ahead. What has Samsung done that make them ahead in terms of innovation ? AMOLED is not that great. The screen is unusable under bright sunlight and the colour is not accurate. Sony OLED screen as seen on PS Vita is much better. Samsung camera is even worst compared to Sony. Samsung design is also not good (not beautiful). ( I know this is subjective, but I believe many people agree with me on this). Samsung smartwatch is way behind Sony. Sorry, I couldn't find any innovation from Samsung that make them ahead of sony.
[ This Message was edited by: MyP910 on 2013-10-07 12:52 ]
Posted by reeflotz
@bart
I agree on that MSD and M2, I also hated it, although I think Sony seemed to realize now that it's better to stick with microSD and MicroUSB instead of the annoying fastport
. Anyway MyP910 summed up the innovation nicely on what Sony has currently brought to the table and slowly integrating it on the Xperias.
@ranjith
I also agree that Sony needs to iron out the remaining problems/complaints on their mobile.
On the other hand their Playstation seems to be perfectly ironed out right now, they literally fixed everything the PS3 was lacking and I'm waiting for the same thing to happen with their Xperias.
Posted by Tsepz_GP
I can't really agree or disagree with most here, whole lot of good points made BUT:
MyP910
Rather just say you are blind to any other innovations other than Sony's, rather than say nobody else is as innovative as Sony. We've got Samsung creating ever faster, more efficient memory chips going into many manufacturers phones, we've got both LG and Samsung working on Flexible displays which could bring us a whole new generation of devices, especially wearable devices. Nokia making ever more brilliant Camera advancements.
We've got Apple, Samsung, Google and Microsoft all taking huge leaps to bring Education to developing countries using mobile (smartphones and tablets) through innovative ways with their SW and HW-this is MAJOR! I could go on as if you really open your eyes you'll see plenty of innovation around.
You are actually so naive it's unbelievable and rather sad. I know you seem to totally dislike and dismiss anything not Sony, but you simply can't just try dismiss other company's efforts.
Don't bother to reply to this, I'd be better off talking to a brick wall it seems.
The rest
We actually had a good discussion going here. I have to agree that Sony in some aspects have made great improvements from SE, I'm glad that Sony do actually update their phones, as compared to the X10 days, and their design and build quality has seen a great overhaul from the days of the SE W850, with cracking keypads and so on. Sony are headed in the right direction but I'd like to see some major fixing in the following before I get another Sony phone:
1. No more screen lottery
2. 32GB flagship variants
3. Easying on the post processing in pics
4. Launching with the very latest available Android version e.g. I wish the Z1 And Z Ultra came with 4.3 out-the-box
Sony have the potential, I wish they'd just go all out and blow us all away as they did with SE with the P800, the K750/W800, K800 etc... I'd happily comeback.
Cheers!
Posted by MyP910
@Tsepz_GP,
Personally I don't consider improving semiconductor speed according to Moore's law is innovation. Its a given due to the scaling down of transistors. Everybody in the semiconductor businesses will do the same. While, flexible display can be considered as innovation, I will reserve that until it is released. After all, there might be some other companies doing it including Sony. Finally, smartphones and tablets are made by so many company including Sony. To me, innovation is something more than that, some breakthrough. Yeah, flexible display is innovation, but still in prototype stage.
btw, I'm not dislike of dismiss anything but sony, I'm just pointing out the innovations brought by Sony. The list that I provided is just a few from many more innovations made by sony (some even not successful due to various reason).
[ This Message was edited by: MyP910 on 2013-10-07 13:50 ]
Posted by false_morel
Did I miss something or comparing SE to Sony doesn't make sense at?
Same team and engineers are still making doing the same work..
Had they kept doing it under SE or now under Sony makes no difference to the end consumer I think.. We'd still get the Xperia Z and Z1 and Z Ultra..
Acquiring Ericsson and taking full control over the mobile department had a business motive as far as I know..
Same as it stands now with Nokia and MS.. Same people will keep doing what they have been doing.. Maybe in this case with an exception that Nokia's team will get full access to WP code and permission to do more with it..
Posted by randomuser
Well not really. You wouldn't get the Z Ultra, Z1 if it was still SE.
It's been a little over a year since all product R&D has been moved to Tokyo, Japan. The "old" SE team in Sweden only takes care of software now.
Posted by false_morel
On 2013-10-07 15:14:25, randomuser wrote:
Well not really. You wouldn't get the Z Ultra, Z1 if it was still SE.
It's been a little over a year since all product R&D has been moved to Tokyo, Japan. The "old" SE team in Sweden only takes care of software now.
Yeah moved meaning, new labs same people or new team as well?
Because I doubt the engineers working on hardware R&D in the SE era are now all gone and a new team in Japan deployed..
Posted by randomuser
A new team as well. Plus a lot of people from other Sony electronics division are also involved in phone development now.
Most of the SE hardware team was laid off in Sweden soon after the SE acquisition. Only the software team remains now. There was even a thread on that news here I believe.
[ This Message was edited by: randomuser on 2013-10-07 18:24 ]
Posted by etaab
@ reeflotz - I must assume that Bonovox deleted his posted because he reacted negatively to my choice of words, of which no offence was meant. Its just a saying, which often I forget a joke or light hearted comment can be misinterpreted when reading simple text on a screen as there is no emotion involved. If so im sorry to him for him thinking it be that way..
However I still stand by everything I said. SE used to fix firmware issues in their phones quickly if it was a problem which could potentially present itself as a bad bug. Also they started to receive good quality updates when the fast port came about. I understand Android is much more complicated than my K750i was, but then also that it should technically be much more easier to fix issues or deliver updates. But Sony struggle to do so, often delivering Android updates many months after their competitors and often barely in time for the next Android release.
So Sony has had a decent run of updates since the Z ? so we're talking less than a year then. That's not a long time to evaluate Sony in comparison to a company like Samsung which actually do release timely updates.
As for complaints over the Z and Z1, I do read those threads daily and they are full of people with complaints, or hopes of updates which never come, or hopes of getting a phone with a good screen. Ergo the screen lottery. Those that do own the phone do moan about it and hope they get an update or are considering exchanging their phone for another in the hope of getting a better screen. As for pictures from the Z1's camera, ive seen those samples and not been impressed once. They were really that bad.
Regarding Sony as a whole, they have always charged more for their products than other companies. A flat screen Sony tv usually costs about 25% more than a competitors equivelant, usually has less features and is of poorer quality. My local TV repair store which is owned by a man who has fixed tv sets for about 30 years who is on the edge of retirement, well his opinion was that Sony tvs are basically cheap plastic over priced rubbish. His words not mine. The Playstation network is a perfect example of how Sony cut yet another corner with lower security measures than Microsoft. Which is why they faced a heavy fine and got taken to court by quite a few users of their services.
I know you Sony fans are all highly hostile to anyone who dares think anything against Sony, but its the truth. Sony have a good thing going but they always find a way to spoil everything they do.
Posted by bart
In a way this is funny. In the good old days it was Ericsson fans vs Nokia fans.
Today its like Ericsson vs SE vs Sony
Posted by etaab
True, but I always have considered myself completely on the fence when it comes to branding.
I just look at what is the best for me at that point in time and buy it without any loyalty to the brand.
Nokia used to make the best phones imo, then SE, then back to Nokia, now Samsung. Im sure in a couple of years time it'll be Motorola (Google) or even LG.
I just cannot live in a cloud of ignorance, I cannot follow one company in the hope they turn out the best. I honestly couldn't care less if Samsung went bankrupt tomorrow. Im sure when my contract is up for renewal next year there would be a competitor product which took my eye. To me its all healthy competition which is good, the only time I will genuinely slag off a manufacturer is when they want to go about underhand or bad business practices such as Apple - e.g attempting to sue the ass off everyone and prevent their products from reaching the market and therefore winning by default as the customer has no choice what to buy.
Apple need to go out of business, the rest i'll happily play with. Apple have no repsect from me. Steve Jobs ? couldn't care less, he was nothing short of an irrational megalomaniac !
[ This Message was edited by: etaab on 2013-10-07 22:35 ]
Posted by Bonovox
From what I have seen and experienced Sony has improved a lot since SE days. Better build is one of them. The recent drop test proved that on Android Authority where after 3 drops the Z1 never cracked but the Note 3 did. Their updates have become more frequent as I have seen of late fixing issues quickly. There's a huge difference in performance between the Xperia S,Xperia T and Z,Z1. A friend of mine who is not biased towards Sony says his Z1 is a massive improvement in terms of camera,battery life,no lag and build. Doesn't anyone remember the SE days where phones were extremely buggy,had poor build and phones often fell apart?? That happened a lot with SE even though I loved them they went downhill after the k800i
Posted by Tsepz_GP
On 2013-10-07 23:34:39, etaab wrote:
True, but I always have considered myself completely on the fence when it comes to branding.
I just look at what is the best for me at that point in time and buy it without any loyalty to the brand.
Nokia used to make the best phones imo, then SE, then back to Nokia, now Samsung. Im sure in a couple of years time it'll be Motorola (Google) or even LG.
I just cannot live in a cloud of ignorance, I cannot follow one company in the hope they turn out the best. I honestly couldn't care less if Samsung went bankrupt tomorrow. Im sure when my contract is up for renewal next year there would be a competitor product which took my eye. To me its all healthy competition which is good, the only time I will genuinely slag off a manufacturer is when they want to go about underhand or bad business practices such as Apple - e.g attempting to sue the ass off everyone and prevent their products from reaching the market and therefore winning by default as the customer has no choice what to buy.
Apple need to go out of business, the rest i'll happily play with. Apple have no repsect from me. Steve Jobs ? couldn't care less, he was nothing short of an irrational megalomaniac !
[ This Message was edited by: etaab on 2013-10-07 22:35 ]
I'm the same. If Samsung were to be dethroned as the best by another OEM who brings something totally new and better, I'd gladly jump ship. I can't be loyal to a company, that's just plain stupid, what I can do is give my money to the company that's creating the best product at the time.
Posted by bart
Bonovox you compaire Xperia S, T and Z1 with each other? Ofcourse there's improvement. Every time basic things are updated, more ram, cpu, gpu, battery mAh, ...
Its like comparing K700-750-800
Posted by Bonovox
Yes but people keep saying nothing has changed with Sony but I don't see it that way
Posted by reeflotz
@ Etaab
On 2013-10-07 23:09:39, etaab wrote:
So Sony has had a decent run of updates since the Z ? so we're talking less than a year then. That's not a long time to evaluate Sony in comparison to a company like Samsung which actually do release timely updates.
So you simply contradicted yourself, it took less than a year for Sony to provide a decent run of updates. While SE, their Android handsets were stuck for about a year even more than that.
Also:
you criticize Sony with their updates right now
then when Sony provided timely updates with the Z (not only Z, but other recent Sony handsets as well), you make an excuse by saying:
it's too early to evaluate Sony now,
again contradicting yourself.
Why be quick to criticize and say "hopes of updates which never come" when you yourself said it's too early to evaluate them now?
You're not impressed by Z1 pictures, fine its your opinion, I'll just leave it at that.
Can you please elaborate more on this statement?
"The Playstation network is a perfect example of how Sony cut yet another corner with lower security measures than Microsoft."
Can you please provide proof that they did indeed cut corners? If you can't then that statement is nothing but baseless conjecture. Even if you say it's just your opinion and how you see things, it is still baseless. You call it the "perfect example" yet you are being vague on how exactly did it have lower security than microsoft?
As we said earlier Microsoft got hacked, Adobe got hacked, if we go by your logic then Adobe and Microsoft too cut corners. Even credit cards identity theft exists, so does that mean those also cut their corners in security? I also stand by my statement that anything can be hacked as long as anyone has the time and effort to hack it.
debate is good but I'd like more proof/consistency on these statements you said, screen lottery is indeed an issue I agree on that.
Also another contradiction in your statement:
"I understand Android is much more complicated than my K750i was, but then also that it should technically be much more easier to fix issues or deliver updates."
How can Android be technically easier to fix when you yourself said Android is much more complicated?
[ This Message was edited by: reeflotz on 2013-10-08 05:04 ]
Posted by etaab
Unfortunately, I haven't contradicted myself once. Clearly you don't spend any amount of time reading the news. The problem with Sony is, they never invest enough money in providing good customer service, support and security.
The beauty of Android is that its relatively simple to install on any hardware which is compatible. What takes companies so long to update their devices is when their custom apps, skins and launchers have to be customised or optimised. Devices which run plain vanilla versions of Android tend to get updated much faster.
Unless you invest in your devices post sale. I would be interested to see the numbers of software engineers who work on Samsung's products after release, versus Sony's. I can imagine there being quite a large difference in numbers.
Posted by reeflotz
So you only searched for the Playstation hacked, clearly you don't spend any amount of time reading the other news as well. According to these articles, Microsoft themselves admitted they got hacked, and it's high profile employees account that were hacked too:
http://www.theverge.com/2013/3/19/4125886/microsoft-confirms-high-profile-employee-xbox-live-accounts-hacked
http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/20/microsoft-xbox-live-accounts-hacked/
So your point? The same thing happens to Microsoft yet you ignored it. Try to be fair on your judgements please
and once again I repeat, even credit card identity theft happens which is worse. You are simply cherry picking bad news from Sony.
As for support, guess what, the playstation 2 is the longest in production console, even in it's 10nth year there were still games made for it, that is what you call support.
Microsoft on the other hand cut online support earlier on the original Xbox and you can't transfer your original Xbox information to the 360
Can I transfer information from my original Xbox console to an Xbox 360 console?
No. Unfortunately, you can’t move information from your original Xbox console to an Xbox 360 console.
No. Unfortunately, you can’t move information from your original Xbox console to an Xbox 360 console.
Source
Anyway enough of that, I still don't get what does the Playstation have to do with Sony aiming for 3rd largest phone manufacturer? You're steering things offtopic.
in this statement of yours:
Unless you invest in your devices post sale.
I once again repeat, midrange Sony handsets also got updated to Jellybean, my Go got updated even though it's the cheapest waterproof smartphone from Sony. Sony flagships as of now got timely updates, you cannot deny that fact, and I believe that falls on the category as "investing in your devices post sale". That also proved how much better the update policy Sony has now compared to the days of x10, contradicting your statement that SE had better update policy.
Sony isn't as bad as you make it sound like, There are many things you don't see and only looked for bad things in Sony, I pointed a lot of contradictions in your earlier post specifically, and I don't see any specific response coming from you with regards to that. You're all being vague and steering the topic to Playstation being hacked which has got nothing to do about
, or Sony mobile, how it fared compared to it's past, and how will it fare to become 3rd largest phone maker.
Sony is aiming for 3rd spot in mobile sector, too early for you to expect them to beat Samsung or Apple. I think you need to keep that in mind.
[ This Message was edited by: reeflotz on 2013-10-10 08:08 ]
Posted by etaab
Ooh, you really love this whole nit picking of peoples posts huh. Talk about defensive of a company that im guessing owes you nothing !
The whole point of mentioning Playstation is not about the fact they got hacked, but how they got hacked so very easily. And then in turn were given a relevant judgment followed by a sanction when taken to court over their inadequate security measures. Why are you banging on about Xbox ?? nobody ever mentioned them.
And please, stop trying to shove your pro-Sony nonsense down my throat. Samsung and HTC are ten times better at software support than Sony. I couldn't care less what version your budget device is running. I couldn't care less about you judging peoples opinions as contradictions. You don't actually make facts. You talk like you have the authority to determine what is a fact. You don't.
The real facts are that Sony want to play in the big league with the smartphone makers and yet release devices which have a premium feel but poor quality components inside them - and then spend significantly more time updating the devices compared to their rivals.
Posted by Gitaroo
actually they upgraded their online security big time after what happened and now always on tops of things. There was another hack attempt happened after the first major hack but they were able to informed everyone and stated no personal info was stolen withing 24 hours. It was posted on PS blog and also emails notification. The whole SNE thing was formed after the PSN hack and they have upgraded their security big time. People only look back at what happened before but their online security really tight now and probably better than most big companies. Unlike some companies like MS and their XBL fifa hack, not only that they did absolutely nothing at all and suspend people account. Even Steam and Wow accounts got hacked and ppl praised steam like it was god sent from heaven.
Posted by MyP910
What do you mean by `hacked so very easily' ? How you define easy ? Adobe got hacked, why don't you say the same `hacked so very easily'? XBOX, Microsoft got hacked as well. Aren't they hacked easily ? You are contradicting much in your statements. Please be consistent.
Posted by reeflotz
On 2013-10-10 23:25:46, etaab wrote:
And please, stop trying to shove your pro-Sony nonsense down my throat. Samsung and HTC are ten times better at software support than Sony.
We were talking about Sony and SE updates remember? You were the one who made the statement that SE provided better updates. I replied complete with examples on why I think Sony has currently provided better updates than SE. Now you are once again steering things away from your original post. Samsung and HTC was never mentioned, and I never said that Sony is better than them
I was simply saying that Sony isn't as bad as what your post makes it look like.
On 2013-10-10 23:25:46, etaab wrote:
The real facts are that Sony want to play in the big league with the smartphone makers and yet release devices which have a premium feel but poor quality components inside them
The real facts are that Sony want to play in the big league with the smartphone makers and yet release devices which have a premium feel but poor quality components inside them
poor quality components? you sure? proof please? here are some "real facts" about Z1 specifically:
http://blog.gsmarena.com/sony-xperia-z1-gets-its-first-teardown-treatment/
Teardown revealed Z1 uses Samsung chips inside
Z1 uses Sony Camera sensor, Samsung and Apple had also used Sony camera sensors in their flagship phones.
Processor is a snapdragon S800, which is what LG G2 uses, and Note 3 too and afaik there will also be an S4 having snapdragon s800.
Z1 is very far from what you generally call having "poor quality components" when it's hardware is pretty much exactly the same as others except the first batch of screens. It currently even has one of the best camera on an Android phone (not just my opinion, see samples on Z1 photo thread Link).
Other phones/phablets like the Z and ZU are pretty much the same, they use components same as other manufacturers. If there ever was any difference, it'll be minor and usually not related to build quality, but just benchmarks
You think I'm defending Sony? I'm simply replying with the basis of facts that's all. Sony is still far from the market share of Samsung and Apple, hence they are aiming for third. But they are not what you call as "poor quality components" "hacked so very easily" "quality has done nothing but dropped".
[ This Message was edited by: reeflotz on 2013-10-11 10:25 ]
Posted by Gitaroo
Going back on topic, I think their goal is pretty realistic. LG and some chinese companies are their competitor to be number 3. Gaining ground in the Chinese market is probably their biggest goal. India has also become an important market for them.
Posted by etaab
On 2013-10-11 03:05:46, MyP910 wrote:
What do you mean by `hacked so very easily' ? How you define easy ? Adobe got hacked, why don't you say the same `hacked so very easily'? XBOX, Microsoft got hacked as well
Because we aren't talking about Microsoft. Also, in the court ruling if you read that link..
"The Information Commissioner’s Office (ICO) ruled the breach of information ‘could have been prevented’ if better security measures had been in place.
ICO deputy commissioner David Smith said there is ‘no disguising that this is a business that should have known better’.
‘In this case that just didn’t happen, and when the database was targeted – albeit in a determined criminal attack – the security measures in place were simply not good enough.
‘It is a company that trades on its technical expertise, and there’s no doubt in my mind that they had access to both the technical knowledge and the resources to keep this information safe.’ "
The point being, they could have made it far harder to get anything from their network. When really, they all but served it up on a plate to the criminals.
But then I expect nothing less than ignorance to those facts as per the norm.
Posted by MyP910
What do you expect the court to say ? Do you expect them to say "the security is tight, but it is very unfortunate the system got hacked" The court statements are the textbook statements. Everybody will say the same to all other systems that got hacked. That statements don't mean that the PSN can be hacked easily and far from "serve up on the plate to the criminals" and this is not to indicate that sony never invest huge money for security. You are so wrong.
Maybe you don't understand how computer system work. I will repeat again, any system in this world can be hacked. Microsoft and adobe got hacked, and to use the word by the court, "those can be prevented if better security measures had been in place." Does it means those system got hacked so very easily? No. Does it means those system serve the plate to the criminals? No. Does it means those company do not invest heavily on security ? No.
Posted by >500
On 2013-10-10 23:25:46, etaab wrote:
Samsung and HTC are ten times better at software support than Sony.
False.
Posted by admad
On 2013-10-12 13:56:55, >500 wrote:
On 2013-10-10 23:25:46, etaab wrote:
Samsung and HTC are ten times better at software support than Sony.
False.
Why false? It's been a month since Z1 release and it still didn't recieve the so called "BIONZ" update. It doesn't support 4K video, updates take way too long. I don't see this problem on Samsung or HTC.
Posted by Gitaroo
wasnt there a day 1 firmware update for z1. Not the final camera update but it was update
Posted by MyP910
I got firmware update on my Z1 in about 1-2 days after buying it. 1-2 days is not long to me and I've never seen any other phone update this fast.
Posted by Gitaroo
my S3 had like 3 updates in that I can remember, it crash whenever I copy text and it wasnt patch for a long long time until the multi screen patch comes out.
Posted by admad
On 2013-10-12 18:29:32, MyP910 wrote:
I got firmware update on my Z1 in about 1-2 days after buying it. 1-2 days is not long to me and I've never seen any other phone update this fast.
Yeah but it was more a bugfix rather than update. I mean, my Xperia T is only a 1 year old phone, it was released with ICS 4.0 but it should come with 4.1.2 straight. Sony released 4.1.2 6 months later, and now, there probably won't be another update. A third version of Android after 4.1.2 is coming, I mean come on!
If Sony plans to be third largest phone maker, they need to sort this shit. Also they need to be serious with quality check. The reports of some Z1 units having bad screen, blurred camera, and now overheating problem. They go for the record here.
Posted by bart
This week ZTE said they want to be nr3
To be honest i think they got a better shot, because they stol most of their R&D, they got connection all over the world (corruption and lobby work, like samsung), and they can produce their phones cheaper (and with less quality).
So i gues its nr 4 for Sony, or maby even lower if Motorola finally starts to use the full potential of google
Posted by Tsepz_GP
Any report on how the Xperia Z1 has sold so far? It's been out a month now hasn't it? The sales of the Z1 and Z Ultra would give us a good indication of whether Sony are on the way to meeting their goal.
Posted by Ranjith
I believe SONY has improved their updates off late.At least for the XS and few of the older phones.Got few updates for S in the last few months and was seeing many releases for many phones.Was impressed.
Posted by etaab
On 2013-10-12 12:01:34, MyP910 wrote:
You are so wrong.
Maybe you don't understand how computer system work. I will repeat again
No thanks. I don't need you to as im not wrong just because you have a difference of opinion.
The proof is, other companies get targeted by hackers, as did the company I work for recently. Whats different is when a company is then taken to court by the authorities for not providing the relevant level of security towards their business and customers data.
In this area alone, Sony were completely negligent and were given a sanction to justify the judgment against them. My credit card details were part of what got hacked also, so it affected me personally. So yes, Sony did balls up, they didn't do enough.
I got firmware update on my Z1 in about 1-2 days after buying it. 1-2 days is not long to me and I've never seen any other phone update this fast.
I have. My current phone got an update as soon as I took it out of the box. Minor bug fixes which the manufacturers discover and patch after the devices have shipped is quite common, I wouldn't say it qualifies Sony as having fast updates. Bare in mind, when I got my S3 on day of release, the phone would have took a month or two to ship from the factory. That's plenty of time for Samsung or any other company for that matter to fix bugs in their software.
Twisting and bending the truth or ignoring facts to suit your opinions is a little desperate I think.
[ This Message was edited by: etaab on 2013-10-13 10:46 ]
Posted by Angeaa
I have no faith in them as they make continuously bad mistakes. The fact they let their Playstation Network get hacked with careless security measures illustrates their poor decision making.
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Posted by tesndro353
Somehow, I doubt Sony can do it XD They're better off where they are right now. At least they're not Nokia.