Posted by erazer007
Here we compare the 8 Megapixel sliders of Nokia and Sony Ericsson and see who wins as an all rounder.
Read about it here
http://n86blog.com/2009/03/28[....]n86-8mp-vs-sony-ericsson-c905/
Posted by Radu_91
the N86 is clearly a winner,innovative camera and many features
Posted by Luci'sPower
yeah right!! and i'm Napoleon
Mates the N86 have's a great camera maybe better than the C905 in daylight but it dosen't have a xenon flash so it can never be the best overall camera it's imposible
And let's wait till the N86 it's released and reviews will appear with pics from both phones.....and from what i've seen till now the N86 pictures are still not as goot as the innov ones even in daylight conditions
Posted by erazer007
I never meant it better in camera performance, I said better overall functionality.
Posted by gtr83
From the title of the blog it's obvious which side you're on.
Posted by Radu_91
Luci the N86 is not finished yet and the xenon flash in a phone is not that important
Posted by Luci'sPower
well the xenon is very important in a phone for many reasons
People that are looking for a phone to replace a regular digital camera will not buy even a 12MP phone if it dosen't have xenon
My opinion is.....why having a high megapixel camera if you can't use it allaround than i will just go for a older phone with similar specs
Example: you are at a party you spend 600 pounds for a N86 with 8MP camera and you are asked all over the place to take some pictures in the dark with your new phone they will look like crap trust me......a guy with a 100 pound K800 will take better pictures
keep in mind that i'm referring only to the camera part not to the phone overall specs
Posted by recl
your opinion is... wrong
Posted by Luci'sPower
what a crappy reply
no offense
but a opinion is just a opinion even if it looks wrong for others at the same time may be right for others so you can never judge a opinion as being wrong
A opinion is always the right one if you guide after it in your real life
Posted by recl
12 mpx for a phone is huge! you'll only need 12 for high def posters or something like that.that's if you have a good sensor...
happy now?
[ This Message was edited by: recl on 2009-03-29 16:11 ]
Posted by Luci'sPower
yeah i'm happy now
i also agree with the fact that 12MP is to much for a phone
but i was only giving a example with the 12MP part in my post
Posted by recl
for you allround means just xenon?
i'd like hd video recording dinamic range quality lens..but hey that's just me
Posted by Radu_91
for me the xenon flash is not important because i don't take many pics in low light so i can live with a LED flash.
Posted by recl
dual led would suffice
Posted by gtr83
Can't be bothered by HD video recording though. All those features need to wait until some new kind of battery comes up which can last long enough. And he's right, to beat N86 in a blackout party you don't need 12MP, or even 5MP cams for that matter. K800's xenon flash is enough.
Posted by Radu_91
by the way the N86 has variable aperture which means great low light behaviour wide angle lens and dual Led flash that can reach 3.5 meters
[ This Message was edited by: Radu_91 on 2009-03-29 16:59 ]
Posted by recl
astonishing..tell me more radu
Posted by Radu_91
a comparison between n86(which has wide angle lens) and a normal camphone and more detail about the variable aperture and LED flash here
http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_mwc_09-review-318.php
Posted by mario2004
Never mind who is better - 8mp with a lens the size of my small finger nail and a pinhole camera ? ! ? W.T.F. I think I will be passing on this tread and leave Plankgatan to do the 'fighting'
Sorry cellphone manufacturers, I ain't falling for the gimmick.
Posted by erazer007
Xenon or a better flash does not necessarily make the camera better. Different people have different needs. I f you dont need a camera to take pictures in the dark, a smaller flash or even lack of flash wouldnt cause much problem.
Posted by Supa_Fly
On 2009-03-29 17:11:06, recl wrote:
12 mpx for a phone is huge! you'll only need 12 for high def posters or something like that.that's if you have a good sensor...
happy now?
[ This Message was edited by: recl on 2009-03-29 16:11 ]
The sensor ALONE will NOT help you get quality pictures ... remember the LENS which the sensor looks through is also important. An example is the human eye ... if no issues then we're mostly all born with a quality 'sensor' but over time the 'pixels' within become stressed. Having a quality lens - Glasses - helps the quality ... you wouldn't trust your eyes to a walmart brand lense would you?! Its REALLy loosely compared but you get the idea.
Also the cpu will play a HUGE part in sensor performance & battery drain. I have a giddy feeling the reason for the Idou & N97 debuting late this 2nd QTR is because shipments of new 4-Core ARM-11 or Cortex cpu's will be sourced to be used in these devices - whether its from Qualcomm, Broadcom, Texas Instruments, or Freescale they have access to all the designs.
NOTE: the TI 3430 OMAP can be had on a test board for under $140US.
On 2009-03-29 17:27:37, gtr83 wrote:
Can't be bothered by HD video recording though. All those features need to wait until some new kind of battery comes up which can last long enough. And he's right, to beat N86 in a blackout party you don't need 12MP, or even 5MP cams for that matter. K800's xenon flash is enough.
Well Said.
Posted by jake20
any more recent comparisons for these 2 phones?
I am trying to decide between the two of them right now for a backup phone
Posted by mriley
On 2010-03-21 01:11:15, jake20 wrote:
any more recent comparisons for these 2 phones?
I am trying to decide between the two of them right now for a backup phone
Get an N86 and then compare picture quality yourself
Posted by titus1
On 2009-03-30 10:39:36, erazer007 wrote:
Xenon or a better flash does not necessarily make the camera better. Different people have different needs. I f you dont need a camera to take pictures in the dark, a smaller flash or even lack of flash wouldnt cause much problem.
Of course it could make the cam better. if a mobilephone is slated to be a IMAGING device...putting a xenon flash is just proper. NO EXCUSES
Posted by titus1
perfect example would me the C901...if this phone is only equipped with LED..it will never going to draw attention from people who's into "phone photography". They would never consider retiring their K800/850 for C901. But since it has Xenon flash..it's no brainer
Posted by titus1
And if you'll going to ask a Nokia user what is the best imaging device that they have use..the N82 is always up there. Why? because it was equipped with xenon flash
Posted by Shino03
I agree! Xenon is very important if you're into serious mobile photography. Led flash is just too weak no matter what
Posted by mlife
On 2010-03-21 01:11:15, jake20 wrote:
any more recent comparisons for these 2 phones?
I am trying to decide between the two of them right now for a backup phone
Im actually working on one right now...
http://forums.wireless.att.co[....]d=sonyericsson&thread.id=44233
Posted by mlife
On 2010-03-21 03:14:45, Shino03 wrote:
I agree! Xenon is very important if you're into serious mobile photography. Led flash is just too weak no matter what
I read this statement all the time and for some situations is true but not ALL... I actually own both a C905a and the N86 and find my self being pleased with the dual LED more often than the xenon, here's why....
xexon - great for stopping action due to its VERY SHORT illumination duration... however this short duration of illumination works against you when shooting night portraits because the C905a just doesn't have the low light capability to capture a good (or even fair) amount of the ambient light in a darker area or scene. More on this and pictures will be included to prove this in later posts on my thread which is linked in previous post.
Dual LED - can NOT be beat when being used as a video light and also produces enough light to illuminate darkened scenes on the interior of homes or what-not... dual LED however has a much longer duration of illumination which makes action or moving shots blurry... if you want crisp/sharp images in dark situations at fairly close range, this is not the design for you.
also... if you play with the dual LED and setting provided with the N86 enough, you will see what I mean.... and may even realize that "xenon" in a camera phone, lands (IMO) more on the bells and whistles side than performance enhancement side..
Posted by jake20
my theory is that if dual LED works so well, then why does every single REAL camera have a xenon flash?
I don't see any Nikon's or Cannon's coming out with Dual LED flash's instead of xenon's...
I am not knocking the N86, and I think its clear that the images produced are better than the C905 for the most part.
But I could just see myself needing to snap a shot at night requiring a bright flash, and being out of luck because the dual led's are not up to the task.
Daylight shots are still pretty darn good on the C905, so its not like they are total crap next to the N86, and with the modded DM3.8 driver, you can really get some great looking pics.
Lets not also forget that the N86 is around $100 to $150 more than the C905. Thats a lot $$ if you are primarily concerned with just the camera, and not all the bells and whistles that come along with a smartphone.
I think eventually one day I will pick up the N86, but for right now the C905 seems to hit that sweet spot for me.
Just my opinions of course
[ This Message was edited by: jake20 on 2010-03-22 01:34 ]
Posted by mlife
On 2010-03-21 21:00:54, jake20 wrote:
my theory is that if dual LED works so well, then why does every single REAL camera have a xenon flash?
I don't see any Nikon's or Cannon's coming out with Dual LED flash's instead of xenon's...
Simply put... flash to subject distance vs power consumption.... on a camera phone you rarely shoot a subject further than 5 or 10ft which require flash... full size cameras require the extra power of high power strobes to shoot subjects at greater distance and to fill larger areas. So why waste the extra battery on a xenon when LED is WAY MORE efficent and will often produce the same (if not better in some circumstance) results.
I am not knocking the N86, and I think its clear that the images produced are better than the C905 for the most part.
But I could just see myself needing to snap a shot at night requiring a bright flash, and being out of luck because the dual led's are not up to the task.
What if however you didn't need flash at all? My point is, in most night scenes where the C905a may turn its flash on the low light ability of the N86 would not even require flash.... other than for fill... why not desire that Sony put a better and/or larger sensor or larger f/stop in the phone to increase low light ability...
Daylight shots are still pretty darn good on the C905, so its not like they are total crap next to the N86, and with the modded DM3.8 driver, you can really get some great looking pics.
Actually, I find that the daylight shots are indeed very close and anyone looking at either of these phones would not at all be dissappointed with the sony or nokia results for real world use (ie printing 5x7 or or posting to social network site) where you are likely to see NO difference at all (excluding pixel peepers).
Lets not also forget that the N86 is around $100 to $150 more than the C905. Thats a lot $$ if you are primarily concerned with just the camera, and not all the bells and whistles that come along with a smartphone.
I 100% agree.... dollar for dollar I believe the C905a is a WAY better value.
I think eventually one day I will pick up the N86, but for right now the C905 seems to hit that sweet spot for me.
Just my opinions of course
Had I not been the "see for myself" type.... and I knew what I know now, I don't believe I would have purchased the N86 for image quality when compared to the C905a... the cost/benefit is simply not there.... You can't go wrong with the C905a if your wanting the most bang for your buck!
[ This Message was edited by: jake20 on 2010-03-22 01:34 ]
Posted by bobbywomack
Wtf ,xenon flash is not important??For those who say that:
Go and buy one Canon or Nikon,after a month post again ,im interested to see what will be your opinion then...Both ,leds and xenon have their purpose.But dont say 'led is beter than xenon' or things like this,simply bec. It's not true. You can use the xenon flash even at daylight conditions.
Btw,SE should make bigger aperture,f/2 will be awesome
.If some one needs to use the phone for astrophotography...
Posted by mriley
Bigger sensor, bigger+smaller aperture, equivalent S,P and A modes is what is needed, it's also what will never happen.
IMO the Nokia N86 is one of the best camera phones ever made (non flash pics)
Posted by bobbywomack
@mriley
It is just a mater of time ,the miracle to hapen.I'll wait for something like 'Canon' phone with 5x optical zoom ,also it will be good if you can change the lens
.(Canon 18mpx phone,quadcore 2,5GHz ,full hd at 150 fps or more and superb batery life '10Ah,7V'). .You think it will never hapen?With todays speed of changing ,i say probably in the next 15 years my dream for cameraphone with fullframe sensor will be reality.btw see this:
http://www.yenra.com/samsung-camera-phone/
Posted by mriley
Yeah I have seen those types if phones with optical zoom, but aren't those phones just phone-cameras instead of camera-phones? You say that in around 15 years time camera-phones will be much better (I agree with you there) and will have amazing features of proper cameras like interchangeable lenses. (you're joking right?
)
I don't think it will ever happen because there is already something about there with all this: the compact camera. Cameras on phones sounds great, but they will never compete with anything above them like compact cameras, there just isn't enough space and wouldn't it be a disgrace to the company that made the compact camera if the camera-phone had better image quality? The compact camera's only purpose is to take good photos, the phone also has to be a good phone.
If you cross both gadgets together there has to be some compromise somewhere, either in the camera or the phones features. I used to think the same as you, but I don't anymore
Camera phone's are about convenience to capture the moment where a big hefty SLR wouldn't let you, but compact cameras are just as convenient around the same size.
This is the one i want
Posted by bobbywomack
I agree with you. But I still think there will be such a phone.But it must be very big and probably will look ugly.There are cameras for this purpose.
Posted by mriley
If there is such a phone it will be pointless
Posted by Bonovox
Matt Sony lenses is poo go for one with NO Sony lens.
[ This Message was edited by: Bonovox on 2010-05-24 22:46 ]
Posted by mriley
i picked that one because i read all the reviews for it compared to the others 
Posted by Bonovox
Oh right well perhaps they have improved then cos my eldest brother recently had one with a Sony lens & the picture quality was dreadful. Though that model you shown is one with the new Exmor processer inside. That should be good. About time Sony started doing the wide angle in compacts it's good to see they are.
Posted by bobbywomack
why not canon powershot sx200? U don't like canon?
Posted by mriley
I still dont know which camera to get tbh
Do you own that one?
Posted by Bonovox
The SX 200 is a stunning camera that is the one I once played with in Jessops. It has all the manual controls you want Matt plus 12x zoom I think
Posted by bobbywomack
i own the succesor 20,but once i played with 200,its amazing camera.canon are the best for me,but sony are not bad too.you can even get the 20 for the same price as 200,its bigger,it's way beter but maybe u wont like this heavy monster.
.i always read in internet about the thing im goin to buy,coments are so usefull.but there even beter thing to do,wait 1 year more and the price of todays cameras will drop.(joke,but kind of true). .
Posted by mriley
Camera prices do drop dramatically from some companies but others keep prices high for years (e.g Panasonic TZ7)
After a lot of thought about it I made my mind up and ordered the Panasonic Lumix TZ10 and after a lot of thought about cameras and camera-phones I came to a realization about them which put me off the camera-phones like the C905, N86 and nokia's X6 and 'phone-cameras' like the AMOLED or the 14 MP Altek, buying a phone like the satio or the Pixon 12 now just seems ridiculous to me, though it may be such a great novelty. Neither do i have the desire to know how cameras on different phones compare to eachother.
[ This Message was edited by: mriley on 2010-06-02 02:18 ]
Posted by jake20
for C905, witchking's CBE 6.5 really closes the gap for low light capability of the C905 vs N86.
you can take some really great low light shots with the C905 now by slowing the shutter speed down a little.
Posted by titus1
I've had the N86 before and I don't like the quality of photos it was producing. There's the yellow hue and warm colors in it.
Posted by wherestheid
interesting results..