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Give your SE the BEST protection! |
fetzi
Joined: Oct 26, 2004
Posts: 230
From: currently warsaw
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my dear methylated_spirit 
It honours me that at least you didn´t say I´m still living in the woods - but don´t feel mislead by my current (!) position. I´m proud citizen of a very 'well-developed' country (not that I´d dare to say Poland is not - but I thought I read this between the lines). Got my first ID card 12 years ago but - for example - I am really f**** up with the americans starting this biometric data mess.
Living in a 'nanny state' might be an ideal - but all communistic states where such an ideal (indeed back to the cold war), where the state 'cared' for its citizens - and you know what happened within. And I´m lucky to know what I´m talking about - I´ve been ehind the wall a couple of times when it still existed - cute kind atmosphere of suppression, betrayal and fear.
But even a nanny doesn´t need to know all your belongings - as long as she knows which child to look after and where the bottle is.
Pop! Goes The Hamster... And Other Great Microwave Games | |
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frontman
Joined: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 381
From: Slough, Berks, UK
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Lol... you guyyyys!
Another interesting point is this credit card malarky. People forget that its really the responsibility of the card ISSUERS to protect your card, not you.
Think about it. Every receipt, every statment, every transaction results in a hard copy of your card numbers being made. Every petrol station guy, every shop assistant, every company you buy from have your numbers the minute you purchase something, yet SOME of us run around like protecting the 16 digit number on your card is the most important thing ever. Its not!
If someone is going to infiltrate your wallet and get your card details they will get it one way or another, its soooo easy. So stop walking around with a clenched ar*ehole all year round and relax, if its your turn, its your turn. Anyone like MEND that offers to ASSIST you in the recovery of valuable items has to be the way forward.
I like the new chip and pin system. Just look at it. At a pay point you now, in full view of the queue behind you, key in your personal PIN number to authorise your transaction. Anybody with better than zero eyesight can clearly see you do it and mug you moments later. Now thats a problem worth mentioning! |
methylated_spirit
Joined: Jul 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Bonnie Scotland
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I deal with credit card transactions every single day, and all ican say is its a good job im an honest man...not so much face to face customers, but over the phone, its totally unsecure. You have all the info you need to make a "customer not present" transaction, theres nothing to stop you using those details for yourself.
@fetzi: i was not saying anything, i was merely ststing i do not know the system in poland so i will not comment on it. You are a regular conspiracy theorist! Stop reading so much into everything, mate.
_________________
Hello, Scroto!
615 green bottles hanging on the wall...
[ This Message was edited by: methylated_spirit on 2004-11-24 16:19 ] |
fetzi
Joined: Oct 26, 2004
Posts: 230
From: currently warsaw
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@dave_uk
if you´d followed the discussion from the beginning you would have registered (!) that I´m not talking only about mobiles - it complicates when someone (like in this thread) starts to register his whole belongings or even major parts of it..
@frontman
we´re using the pin system since 18 years - now it´s getting interesting when guys at the gas station make first a copy of your card (do you always control which machine they´re pulling your card through) and then use the station' s surveillance tapes to look after your pin..
Pop! Goes The Hamster... And Other Great Microwave Games |
frontman
Joined: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 381
From: Slough, Berks, UK
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Quote:
| then use the station' s surveillance tapes to look after your pin.. |
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Thats a bloody good point. |
methylated_spirit
Joined: Jul 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Bonnie Scotland
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So? What can you do about it? Nothing. Live with it. Nothing is perfect.
Hello, Scroto!
U.G.L.Y. You ain't got no alibi, you ugly! |
fetzi
Joined: Oct 26, 2004
Posts: 230
From: currently warsaw
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yep. Open your doors, strip, let anyone see, read, save everything - don´t worry, it´s registered, and the good will always win! Yeah, come on nanny, time for my 5 o´clock milk.. 
Pop! Goes The Hamster... And Other Great Microwave Games |
frontman
Joined: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 381
From: Slough, Berks, UK
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Quote:
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On 2004-11-24 17:59:35, fetzi wrote:
yep. Open your doors, strip, let anyone see, read, save everything - don´t worry, it´s registered, and the good will always win! Yeah, come on nanny, time for my 5 o´clock milk..
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How strange... |
dave_uk
Joined: Mar 06, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: London, UK
PM |
Hmmm.....
I think your last post is probably the most revealing (no pun intended) but for the record I did read the thread from the beginning. It started off fairly innocently - you may well not be talking only about mobiles, but everybody else was, until this veered off-topic. It is currently careering towards garbage at this rate!
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methylated_spirit
Joined: Jul 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Bonnie Scotland
PM |
And its a damn shame.
Hello, Scroto!
U.G.L.Y. You ain't got no alibi, you ugly! |
plevyadophy
Joined: Mar 01, 2003
Posts: 177
From: London, England
PM |
Hi folks
Interesting thread.
I have to say I am with Fetzi on this one.
Someone hinted that Fetzi, and people like Fetzi, are perhaps unduly paranoid.
But working in the legal field with an interest in IT and politics I can tell you it is definitely the so called "open minded" people who are naiive. Nearly EVERY, and I mean nearly EVERY, paranoind/conspiracy theory thought that a citizen may have in mind has already or is about to happen. Some of the things I have seen are absolutely jaw dropping.
I think Fetzi's suspicion is well placed. Don't forget not long ago there was a Member of Parliament here in the UK who's personal data was abused by the authorities. And there are a multitude of examples of the police etc getting up to no good.
I think that this MEND service is a brilliant one if it ONLY required you to log on the database those items you have lost or have had stolen.
Giving someone a list of all your valuable items in advance seems worrying. And in fact my experience has been that at times one should be more worried about abuse by the Police and other government agencies than private industry (speak to any decent ex-policemen, an investigative journalist, a lawyer to know why).
Also keep in mind that when these sort of thngs are set up. They are often sold to us as a great convenience - helping us to help ourselves and the authorities with the authorities playing the loving uncle. At some point down the line I can well imagine that the thing will become compulsory. Big Brother!!! Thus giving the State enough surveillence opportunities to give Stalin multiple orgasms in his grave.
I think for me the option will be simple. I will wait for an item to get stolen (but really I pray it never happens) and then and only then will I register the item with MEND.
That way the database will have only one or two items listed in my lifetime rather than a comprehensive list of everything I own or have ever owned.
. |
methylated_spirit
Joined: Jul 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Bonnie Scotland
PM |
That member of parliament was doing illegal things...he was no saint...therefore, the system wasworking. I would rather walk the streets at night knowing there will be a camera watching me, than walk around with no help, no protection at all.
Hello, Scroto!
U.G.L.Y. You ain't got no alibi, you ugly! |
frontman
Joined: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 381
From: Slough, Berks, UK
PM |
Quote:
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On 2004-11-24 20:33:46, plevyadophy wrote:
Hi folks
Interesting thread.
I have to say I am with Fetzi on this one.
Someone hinted that Fetzi, and people like Fetzi, are perhaps unduly paranoid.
But working in the legal field with an interest in IT and politics I can tell you it is definitely the so called "open minded" people who are naiive. Nearly EVERY, and I mean nearly EVERY, paranoind/conspiracy theory thought that a citizen may have in mind has already or is about to happen. Some of the things I have seen are absolutely jaw dropping.
I think Fetzi's suspicion is well placed. Don't forget not long ago there was a Member of Parliament here in the UK who's personal data was abused by the authorities. And there are a multitude of examples of the police etc getting up to no good.
I think that this MEND service is a brilliant one if it ONLY required you to log on the database those items you have lost or have had stolen.
Giving someone a list of all your valuable items in advance seems worrying. And in fact my experience has been that at times one should be more worried about abuse by the Police and other government agencies than private industry (speak to any decent ex-policemen, an investigative journalist, a lawyer to know why).
Also keep in mind that when these sort of thngs are set up. They are often sold to us as a great convenience - helping us to help ourselves and the authorities with the authorities playing the loving uncle. At some point down the line I can well imagine that the thing will become compulsory. Big Brother!!! Thus giving the State enough surveillence opportunities to give Stalin multiple orgasms in his grave.
I think for me the option will be simple. I will wait for an item to get stolen (but really I pray it never happens) and then and only then will I register the item with MEND.
That way the database will have only one or two items listed in my lifetime rather than a comprehensive list of everything I own or have ever owned.
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I'm getting stuck into this one!
You have opened your post by professiong your expertise in the field of law and IT. Perfect for this topic. I hope. My problem sir, is that you dont substantiate any of your claims other than to say "what I have seen is absolutely jaw dropping". What have you seen?
Perhaps then as concerened and helpful fellow you might do me (and the rest of the gang here) a favour out of politeness and generosity?
I was wondering, if using your knowledge, you could explain to me exaclty HOW MEND is potentially a corrupt service and organisation that would merely seek to obtain our details for improper use? I feel that is what you were driving at in you message, that I as an open minded person am open to abuse and controversy as a result of utilisation of this service. I would appreciate clarification from you as to how and why you feel this service is perhaps.... dishonest?
Please bear in mind when you reply, IF you reply, that these valuable items that you can list would also be listed with A) your phone service provider, B) Your home insurance company (if you cover yourself properly) and C) The shop at which you purchased the item. And thats just for starters.
So, Mr Legal, tell me please why this service from MEND, a POLICE enforced and approved FREE valuables database should be assumed corrupt and/or a conspiracy. I'm genuinely interested! |
fetzi
Joined: Oct 26, 2004
Posts: 230
From: currently warsaw
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querty_uk Quote:
| I read about this on a BBC article today. Have already registered my P900, Creative Jukebox Zen and Sony DSC Camera.
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Ok, should be time for me to row back a little bit - don´t like the idea of me beeing blamed guilty for 'garbaging' this thread
It was this quote which lead me into stronger discussion; if this thread was only all about mobiles - then I was wrong; sorry for that. But I referred to this quote and a more extensive use of MEND.
Nevertheless I´m happy plevyadophy joined me in my paranoia..
And as long as someone is arguing on a topic - he´s thinking of it; that´s the effect I´d liked to evoke
Pop! Goes The Hamster... And Other Great Microwave Games |
methylated_spirit
Joined: Jul 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Bonnie Scotland
PM |
Hes not thinking it through properly, and neither are you. For gods sake, they arent asking you for the code to your alarm, or where you were at a certain time, they are asking you for contact details, available in any public phone book! For gods sake, junk mail companies have it! Its so easy to get peoples addresses! go onto royalmail.com, and every single address in the country is on there! So why should signing up to help track any stolen equipment come under such heavy criticism? I think you are just being argumentitive for the sake of it.
And as for the lawyer, has it ever occured to you that some of the things that go on are for the protection of people? Its only poeple with something to hide they are interested in. For honest, law abiding people, they dont care. They arent spying on you. They dont have bugs in every room. Get a grip.
Its people like you, with your theories, and your shady comments, that escalate situations. Prime example: this thread!
_________________
Hello, Scroto!
615 green bottles hanging on the wall...
[ This Message was edited by: methylated_spirit on 2004-11-25 09:54 ] | |
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Posted: 2004-11-24 17:11
