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CH4 Dispatches (19/05/2008) In Gods name. |
Muhammad-Oli
Joined: Jun 13, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: The NZ of L
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I am Christian and have gone to church from birth, but I agree wholly with fatreg. See, people like myself and voda_jon can be Christian and have Christian beliefs, but we are smart enough to be able pick out the parts of the Christian faith which common sense tells us is plain stupid, savage, or just wrong.
After all, the bible itself is very very old. The world has moved on and progressed so much, so why should we follow a book's preachings when it isn't even relevant to our modern age? The bible has no proof that is correct anyway, parts of it may be completely true, other parts could be lies or the truth could have been distorted through all the story-telling, just like Chinese Whispers.
I think its sick how some people take whatever the bible says, or what religious leaders say, to heart. They take it too far and forget other things that the bible preaches, which are far more important. My church welcomes gay people, and anyone who wants to join and I'm glad, because I wouldn't want to be hanging around with these idiots that obviously are so narrow minded that they've fallen off the tracks!
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Bonovox
Joined: Apr 13, 2008
Posts: > 500
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Im not gay myself but i know 3 gay people and they are such gone friendly people with nothing nasty about them. People with distorted views of their religion are just either naturally evil or just mentally crazy or just brain washed. These religions are meant to peace loving to all mankind so god is gone right so why would he want to kill someone who is gay. AT THE END OF THE DAY IF YOU ARE A GONE DECENT PERSON NOTHING ELSE MATTERS. But these people do make my blood boil over. I hate it when they stand on OUR streets protesting about OUR way of life in this country. The saying goes IF THEY DONT LIKE IT HERE. LEAVE. I care nothing to what anyone says nobody should tell you how you lead your life as long as you dont hurt people. |
haynesycop
Joined: Mar 10, 2004
Posts: > 500
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On 2008-05-21 15:41:26, Muhammad-Oli wrote:
I am Christian and have gone to church from birth, but I agree wholly with fatreg. See, people like myself and voda_jon can be Christian and have Christian beliefs, but we are smart enough to be able pick out the parts of the Christian faith which common sense tells us is plain stupid, savage, or just wrong.
After all, the bible itself is very very old. The world has moved on and progressed so much, so why should we follow a book's preachings when it isn't even relevant to our modern age? The bible has no proof that is correct anyway, parts of it may be completely true, other parts could be lies or the truth could have been distorted through all the story-telling, just like Chinese Whispers.
I think its sick how some people take whatever the bible says, or what religious leaders say, to heart. They take it too far and forget other things that the bible preaches, which are far more important. My church welcomes gay people, and anyone who wants to join and I'm glad, because I wouldn't want to be hanging around with these idiots that obviously are so narrow minded that they've fallen off the tracks!
Best post in this thread so far, i agree on the whole bible point, the possibility of it being distorted and so on. It's just crazy that seeing how old the world is and the life that has been gone we've still not learnt to live and let live, it's 2008 people. It's definitely how your brought up in my eyes, if a parent is racist, homophobic or whatever then it gets passed on.
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themarques
Joined: Jan 26, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: London, Tokyo,
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Those who will be able to enter the new city (Heaven) do what Jesus commanded (Revelations 22:14). Check the verse. They do what Jesus has commanded them to do.
Luke 6:46-49
46 "But why do you call Me 'Lord, Lord,' and do not do the things which I say?
Luke 13:24-27
24 Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, 'Lord, Lord, open for us,' and He will answer and say to you, 'I do not know you, where you are from,' 26 then you will begin to say, 'We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.' 27 But He will say, 'I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity. NKJV
I think these verses sum it up quite well, and for those that have said the times have changed move with them. Well lets take a look at Revelations were God has told us what to expect ie the mark of the beast etc. So in other words we can say for sure that he saw the future. Take for example how we heading to the ID card system and micro chip implants RFID etc, call it technology call it the mark you choose. But I believe God was fully aware of the times that will come and it is said he will not put any temptation before us that we can not refuse.
Remember OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT? well things like eye for an eye were abolished leaving us with turn the other cheek (hypothetically speaking). I think if you going to go the whole 9 yards for for it, otherwise make a new religion.
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Bonovox
Joined: Apr 13, 2008
Posts: > 500
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Jesus could forsee what was going to happen in the middle east he said WEEP NOT FOR ME WEEP FOR YOURSELVES. |
badassmam
Joined: Nov 07, 2007
Posts: > 500
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You either follow your religion or not. You can't exclude what you don't think is correct, that would mean that you have no faith in your religion. It's one or the other. If you believe that a religion needs to be modernised then that means you do not believe in the religion and you see problems that have to be changed according to society.
Society has changed a lot, 20 years ago there would be no discussion about this at all but time goes on. I'm sure that people look down on this abortion issue but society has moved on and everyone is having sex, even kids that are 14 get pregnant. That is one way in which society had become bad.
I have no issue with gay people, I'm sure that it can be tough emotionally and mentally for those who are confused. Perfect example is from my uni days. One guy became gay after experimenting, few bad girlfriends etc. He was happy whenever I spoke to him, he is a nice guy and I have nothing against him. Another guy was attracted to men after looking at gay porn but he felt bad about it because he wanted kids. He stopped himself and managed to hold back his urges. He is now happily married to a woman and has kids, he is over the moon and says that he is glad to be straight.
I can't comment too much because I am not gay but I follow my religion and would not endorse it due to logic and also that I believe that my religion is still relevent and correct, 1400 years from it being revealed. Sometimes you can't follow your feelings and urges, you have to be logical regardless of what society is doing.
Some couples who cannot have kids really struggle through life, it rips them up from inside (this is what I mean by logic). I am certain that homosexual couples feel the same but then adopting becomes complex because of how the child may feel. If they accept then great but if not, it becomes a big psychological issue for the parents as well.
That's my honest opinion, I have respect for all men and women since they are God's creation so He is the judge of all of us. I would not discriminate against anybody based on such complex issues. |
Evilchap
Joined: Aug 25, 2006
Posts: 57
From: New Zealand
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@badassman, I must say I agree with you, which may come as surprising since I'm a Satanist. However you have summed it up with the statement about people essentially taking what they like out of their book and claiming that the rest is redundant because "times change". That has got to be the biggest crock I have ever heard. Its like some people I know that call themselves Muslim yet got out drinking etc more often than I do. If you are going to claim the title of a religon you could at least have decency to follow all the rules.
With that said I do not have a big problem with people who are just good people, they follow the basic rules and dont cause any one any harm. You will also notice that these people tend not to discriminate against creed, race, religon or sexual prefrence. |
Bonovox
Joined: Apr 13, 2008
Posts: > 500
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Did anyone hear the Pope recently changed some of the commandments for the 21st century so even he is moving with the times. Some people are so out of touch they want to live back in the stone age. Those people with distorted views of their religion thankfully are a minority. |
badassmam
Joined: Nov 07, 2007
Posts: > 500
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Bonovox
If Jesus was here today, do you think that he would have to change his beliefs to become more mainstream? He and other prophets had a set of values and examples from their time which are to lead as an example to others. If everyone was like Jesus and the other prophets, there would be no need for heaven.
Do you follow the Pope or the teachings by Jesus? If you look deep into your beliefs, you will realise that actually there is no need for modernisation. If everyone were to stick to their religion by word, the world would be perfect. No wars, no violence, no conflict. |
voda_jon
Joined: Nov 28, 2004
Posts: > 500
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and this is why i love the church of england lol.... the vicars and ministers let u make ur own mind up in regards to how u live your life and how u treat other people....
There are many people, some in my church, who follow the bible to every word and that is their choice. As a young christian i understand that if i was to follow the bible word by word then i would certainly b outkast in the general public for my views... that is why i am more open to sexuality and the like.
Religion is what you decide it is to you and yourself. |
Daedalus85
Joined: Apr 23, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Suffolk, UK
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As most likely one of the only gay people on this forum, all I will say is this.
Religion. Designed to bring people together but 99% of the time it blows people apart. It starts wars, it brings hatred between groups of people, and does the exact opposite of it's intention. In short, use your OWN brain, your OWN thoughts and make your OWN mind up, not follow a list of rules to govern you life as dictated by a fictious character.
And thats my 2 pence 
My opinions on this forum are that of my own and not of the company I work for. |
KingBooker5
Joined: May 12, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: London, England
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On 2008-05-22 15:49:54, Daedalus85 wrote:
As most likely one of the only gay people on this forum, all I will say is this.
Religion. Designed to bring people together but 99% of the time it blows people apart. It starts wars, it brings hatred between groups of people, and does the exact opposite of it's intention. In short, use your OWN brain, your OWN thoughts and make your OWN mind up, not follow a list of rules to govern you life as dictated by a fictious character.
And thats my 2 pence
Rubbish. Their is a big mis understanding between religion and war. IMO opinion, if there was no religion, the human race would have been wiped out years ago. Religion has brought wars, but it has kept a balance.
If there was no such thing as religion, people would have killed and done what ever they wan't causing corruption and death, because they would have nothing to worry about in the future. This is why it has brought a balance.
With religion people have had second thoughts and restrained themselves from commiting these acts.
Obviously we have had genocides and wars, but my point is, it would be a hell of a lot more with out religion.
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Daedalus85
Joined: Apr 23, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Suffolk, UK
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Nu uh, sorry, I don't buy that.
If two countries are in the middle of a war, I doubt very much that 'religion' is going to stop anyone. The differences people have between two religions can cause it, but stopping it? If they knew it was wrong they wouldn't have done it in the first place, and if their religion 'commanded' that they don't do it, then they wouldn't have done it in the first place.
My opinion though, not saying it's fact or anything.
My opinions on this forum are that of my own and not of the company I work for. |
KingBooker5
Joined: May 12, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: London, England
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On 2008-05-22 18:48:39, Daedalus85 wrote:
Nu uh, sorry, I don't buy that.
If two countries are in the middle of a war, I doubt very much that 'religion' is going to stop anyone. The differences people have between two religions can cause it, but stopping it? If they knew it was wrong they wouldn't have done it in the first place, and if their religion 'commanded' that they don't do it, then they wouldn't have done it in the first place.
My opinion though, not saying it's fact or anything.
No problem, every one has an opinion and ours differ.
However, look at it this way. Mohammad Ali, did not go to the Vietnam war, because he stood by his religion.
"If two countries are in the middle of a war, I doubt very much that 'religion' is going to stop anyone"
Imo I think in history many people have used religion as an excuse to fight for land and respect for their people. Just look at the ancient times and medieval times, people wen't round conquring the world, were all of these based on religion?
Two religions may fight but history has proved they can live in peace. Just look at the crusades (I can't remember which one) the Muslims came and saved the Christians in Spain (I think Spain) and lived in peace together.
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badassmam
Joined: Nov 07, 2007
Posts: > 500
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The religion doesn't cause war, that implies that my religion dissed your religion so lets go to war. War is over land and resources. Even Isreal is to do with resources and disrupting the countries in the Middle East. It is all tactical with regards to import, export, dividing countries that would normally be allied. If the Middle East were allied, it would be the daddy because of their wealth. War on terror is war for oil, nothing to do with religion.
With regards to religion demanding war think of it like this, you rent out one room of your house to me and I then decide that I'll put you in that room and take control of your house. I have a gun as well, I make the rules about who uses the kitchen and bathroom etc. One day I say you can't use the kitchen therefore you starve, you get my point. You have every right to fight for your house and your religion will back this up because this is an injustice. If the Police and courts don't help you, your only choice is violence to get back your house and save your family. This is pretty much the problem in Palestine. Isreal is strategically very important for the USA. | |
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Posted: 2008-05-21 15:41
