Posted by laffen
We want to restrict the type of items for sale in this forum. Please do not advertise for items not related to mobile phones. Cars, bikes, PC's, games, game consoles and cameras for sale should be advertised on Ebay, and not Esato. Bluetooth dongle, battery, headset, charger, memory can be sold here.
thanks
Posted by PeterKay
Any chance of creating a 'Non Mobile related sales section'? Please?
Posted by beeb
yes that sounds like a good idea!
Posted by The Little Master
as ive said before its an excellent idea and a natural progression from just mobile accessories
Posted by djkizlive
The moderators can't really complain - they'll get loads more hits to the website, which equals more hits to their sponsors, which equals more money for them.
I say go for it
let Esato expand.. it's already bursting at the seams.
Come on mods, please?
Posted by adhamroberts
I prefer this place to ebay to be honest...
Posted by PeterKay
Laffen knows best, whatever he decides - we must follow
Posted by MikLSP
I've got to say I think its a very bad idea to restrict the market like this UNLESS we get a new section for miscellanious/non-mobile related things.
We have a section to talk about non-mobile stuff so why not a mobile free market section too?
Posted by PeterKay
Spot on MikLSP.
Totally true and a valid point.
Posted by The Little Master
I just cant see a reason why it should be restricted.
Posted by MikLSP
Its fair enough to restrict this section but there must be another section instead.
Saying use ebay is wrong! I prefer to deal here with people I know and trust no matter what the item. It would be just like saying you can't talk about Nokia here, you must use another forum!
Posted by batesie
I think thats fair enough. This is a mobile phone forum at the end of the day. Its Laffens website.
Posted by PeterKay
Laffen might be thinking about it.
Let's hope he makes the right choice
Mik, got to agree with you 100% - Trust here on Esato is a key aspect between members on the market forums. Stopping non mobile adverts will do no good to Esato !!!
Posted by batesie
this site is free 100% free, people that sell mobiles on here make some money out of it and laffen doesnt charge a penny. We're quite lucky really and should be a bit more grateful.
Posted by PeterKay
That is a valid point and we all thank Laffen for not charging us however, what harm can be done by creating a non mobile related section? This would make most market forum users quite happy !!!
Posted by nessaizfit
I agree that a section for none mobile related things should have its own section coz i prefer this site to sell my things on coz i cant use ebay coz im younger than 18 and i dont own a credit or debit card yet (getting my debit card soon) so i cant sell my stuff on ebay so to sell my things i need 2 use several differnt forums plus there is a lot of trusted people on esato that i would b appy 2 deal with!
Posted by govigov
perhaps he feels the essence/the root/the basic reason on why he created esato is decreasing/lost/dilluted?
Posted by dave_uk
@govi
Did you swallow a thesaurus at lunch time?
Seriously, though, I would imagine that you've probably hit the nail on the head!
Posted by nessaizfit
I get where your coming from but if u see, look ow many members ow joined this site and if you create a section for selling items other than mobiles, a lot more ppl would join which means there would be an even bigger chance of sellin ur things.
On the other hand, creating it and bringing more ppl to join can result in more con's and scams happening so really its a no win situation. In my case, i would still create a section but ppl would just need to take care wen doing deals!
Posted by djkizlive
Well that's no different to the other sales really..
Perhaps they could implement something so that you can only post in the 'General Sales' thread if you have been a member for over a month. This would stop scammers just creating an account to post crap.
It's not that difficult to overcome, just needs some simple PHP programming.
Posted by nessaizfit
Not a bad idea actually, ppl like me would benefit from having a section for other items. Simply because i do a lot of selling/buying over the net and a lot of it isnt mobile related and there seems to be a lot of trusted ppl here so that is a starting point. Also, it gives people like me who are under 18 (im only 16) a chance to sell things on 1 site insted of using ebay which i am too young to use. ppl say ppl under 18 aint trust worthy on the net wen there are plenty of ppl the same age and younger than me that do interet deals. So i agree totally about a new section!!!
Posted by tranquil
I think this whole thing has been totally turned up side down now.
Why use Ebay when Esato is for free? That is what I read between the lines here.
If Laffen were to make a non mobile related sales forum I think he schould charge equal to Ebay for items sold.
You trust the members of Esato?
You don't have a credit card?
You are too young to use the facilities of Ebay?
I don't buy most of the arguments you guys have come up with yet.
I believe you don't want to pay for selling.
Esato was created for mobile phones and developed to be a hang out place for people with an interest, above average, for mobile telephony. If Laffen were to create a sales forum for PCs, cars, mopeds, tractors, stereos, TVs, watches, game consoles and everything else not related to the basics of Esato he should charge for it. He runs Esato for everyone to learn about mobile phones and meet equals for free. Everything not related to the essence of the Esato ideology should be avalable at a charge.
Sorry if I sound harsh but I think people taking advantage of someones' generousity ought to sell their stuff elsewhere.
Posted by MikLSP
@ tranquil
Actually I was perfectly serious about feeling safer here dealing with people I know I can trust & its nothing to do with fees!
Also I was meaning more from a buyers point of view than a sellers so that doesn't affect fees.
I wouldn't want to buy expensive items e.g. a laptop, on ebay as I just don't trust it enough even though I'm sure lots of people do BUT I wouldn't hessitate to buy such an item on here from PeterKay for example!
The very fact that I created the A-Z of Trusted Sellers should confirm my stance on this matter.
As for the point that we should be charged to sell non-mobile items.......will we need to pay a fee to use the mobile phone free zone forum also?!
Posting & chatting about non-mobile related things is as much removed from the supposed ideals of Esato as selling such items is.
I think the essence of Esato is that it has become a complete community of people & friends and not just a good site to get info on phones!
I can't see any disadvantage of allowing these sales. Scammers will come either way and they're more likely to try it on with the latest phone 'for sale' anyway.
If we're going to start getting restrained here it would be a shame but innevitably people will move their business (phones too) to another site with more SE-NSE!!
It's the users that make this site what it is & not the fact that its for phones. As pointed out earlier, more hits on Esato & its sponsors benefits the site.
_________________
Posted, as always, from my P905!
Using the Esato Market?
Check sellers feedback and leave feedback of your own (seller or buyer):
The A-Z Of Trusted Sellers
[ This Message was edited by: MikLSP on 2005-03-23 23:35 ]
Posted by JiggyJaggy
Alot of the people on here are good friends now....I can vouch for close to 70-100 people I can say I REALLY know on here and its a good way to communicate with people atound the world.
In the same way we trade mobile telephony equipment, its nice to be able to provide people with other items or swap items etc. I give you the example of someone offering me a PC software cd which was bought legally and they did not want it. It enabled me to use my P9xx do upload/download software with my pc.
I subsequently showed that to business cutomers and corporate clients at work and recommended Esato as a place to communicate thoughts and problems. So whats so wrong with that?
I know your going to say well selling an Audi on here (like i advertised myself - i will be honest) has nothing to do with mobile phones/telephony...but we have a "NON MOBILE DISCUSSION" section so why not a non-mobile items for sale/trade section?
Perhaps there could be a way to charge people a monthly subscription of a dew £'s to use the for sale section...or publically advertise that we should sponser more...I can honestly say that most of the new users dont realise the site is run on donations/advertisements.
Your thoughts please???
JiggyJaggy
Posted by GOwin
Here's something hypothetical:
IF laffen creates a market forum for non-mobile related stuff and charges you a for such a facility, will you pay?
You're benefitting from the goodwill of esato (members you can trust and vouch for, discussion forums, etc.) so why not give back to esato as well?
Managing the market forums takes a fair share of the time of the EsatoTeam
Posted by tranquil
I'm behind Gowin in his view.
My post last night might have been a bit OTT but I mean what I said. I used a few (maybe a bit too) direct examples to underline my view and I'm sorry if I was out of line and unfair.
I just think that where money is involved and the issue goes beyond the essence of Esato Laffen should be allowed to make a buck or two on it.
Posted by Mike.P®
Ok, so if Laffen charges users to make a sale will he also cover any losses if the sale goes wrong?
If you are going to start making money out of people then a certain responsibility also comes with that.
Posted by MikLSP
Mike.P® has a damn good point there!
And how is people selling non-mobile related items any more removed from the 'essence of Esato' that talking about them.
Here's another point:
IF laffen begins to charge sales will I be receiving a percentage also?!!!! Without trying to blow my own trumpet but I'm pretty sure the A-Z of Trusted Sellers has boosted the number of sales made here & hence it would increase laffens income from the market. I know I've done deals because I was confident I could trust the seller which I wouldn't have done without that thread!
Also I have to put in the time & effort to maintain it for the benefit of Esato users
I'm not saying I want paying or anything, just another side to the hypothetical arguement
Posted by PeterKay
Totally agree Mik.
The thing that i don't understand is, how difficult is it to create a new section in the market forums for non mobile related items?
With the efficiency of Esato, it can't be too difficult. Most of the members would be happy with a new section without having the hasell to go to other websites like Ebay.
Why spoil a happy family!
End of the day - when the sun goes down, it's Laffens choice. Whatever he decides we must follow. Hopefully the final decision will be in favour of most Esato members
_________________
"Verily in the heavens and the earth, are Signs for those who believe"
[ This Message was edited by: PeterKay on 2005-03-24 09:17 ]
Posted by batesie
This site is 100% free, and it should stay 100% free. i think what laffen is asking is fair enough, as this is a mobile phone forum at the end of the day.
MikLSP what youve done is great with your list, keep up the good work.
I think there needs to be some limitations on whats posted, as all sorts of people will find it through google, people not into mobiles searching for unrelated things.
Posted by MikLSP
But isn't more people finding Esato good for the site.
More hits on a site makes it more attractive to sponsors --> more sponsors/more money from sponsors!
A site with less popularity won't command as much from sponsorship.
One question:
Does Esato make profit, break even or lose money?
Posted by GOwin
re charging users if transaction goes wrong.
the charge is not for making a sale, but for providing the facility to advertise your wares to a market that esato has cultivated.
as far as i know, no media channel undertake such an insurance.
re maintaining the A-Z of trusted esato sellers
well, the same can be said for other discussion threads who benefit other esato users. so what makes it special?
the site is free. what i wrote in my hypothetical statement was meant for those who wants to advertise their non-mobile stuff for trade.
PS
These statements are mine, and mine alone, and written for the purpose of discussing the hypotethical statement i made earlier.
Posted by PeterKay
"Whats make the A-Z Sellers list so special?"
Well, before i buy anything here on Esato - first thing i do is visit the A-Z Sellers list to see the feedbacks that members have left. If there is no feedback i think twice before dealing with that person. I think many members here do the same thing? So the Feedback list is very important and special for all current market forums here on Esato.
I don't think MikLSP is thanked enough for the amount of work he puts in to the feedback list, he does this in his own time and without charging anyone just like Esato. So asking what is so special about the A-Z Sellers list - is a little harsh i would say.
_________________
"Verily in the heavens and the earth, are Signs for those who believe"
[ This Message was edited by: PeterKay on 2005-03-24 14:51 ]
Posted by batesie
At the end of the day, its laffen's website, and that should be respected. The countless hours he has put into this site have benefited probably hundreds of thousands of people and its his decision how he wants the website to evolve.
Posted by The Little Master
true, so could you please come back and give us a confirmation on whether you still want to follow this restriction through or not laffen
Posted by PeterKay
True, it is Laffens website and he has the final decision.
Whatever he decides we must be happy with.
Question is, what has been decided???
Laffen, please enlighten us all
Posted by batesie
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he doesnt need too. read it again, he's made his decision.
Posted by PeterKay
He might change his mind?
You never know.
Hopefully!
Posted by The Little Master
i know hes already stated this at the beginning, but the only reason this thread is still going on is because i think most people would just like a final confirmation.
i didnt ask him to make a decision did i...i asked him if he could give us a confirmation
_________________
Bought Something From Someone On Esato? Then Leave Feedback In The A-Z Of Trusted Sellers
[ This Message was edited by: The Little Master on 2005-03-24 15:42 ]
Posted by MikLSP
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What makes it special is that it DIRECTLY affects sales on the EsatoMarket which is what THIS thread is about! Other threads don't!
Also which other threads do u mean which take the same maintanance? The Trusted Sellers list isn't just a series of posts but needs updating to make it a useful facility, maybe you'd like to do it instead?!
Your comments suggest you have never used & certainly don't appreciate it!
Thanks for your gratitude mate!
Posted by tranquil
All right, hypothetical it is then; You put in an add in your local newspaper. You pay £3 fop the newspaper to print "Car for sale". "omeone comes along to have a look at the car and buggers off with it. What do you do? According to some of the statements here you don't call the Police, you call the editor of the paper and ask him to pay for the car! This is rediculas! Canlt you just accept that Esato is not the place to sell your compuert, CDs, cars and mopeds?
Posted by MikLSP
We can accept that the 'Accessories For Sale' section isn't the place but I see no reason against a new section.
Also tranquil, I think u have inflamed this by suggesting its just to avoid fees which is not true.
Posted by tranquil
I can't be bothered with this anymore.
The decission has been made by Laffen. If he see it needed he'll open a new forum. How that might be run is out of my hands anyway.
Posted by vanquish
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Its your decision to be a mod, im quite happy with modding other forums (se-nse and minted), dont complain...
Posted by joebmc
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Well maybe some one could make a selling forum and have it linked from esato or esato linked to it (if you know what i mean), it could inclued the trusted sellings and that (only problem is people joining in as trusted members)
Posted by GOwin
re maintaining the market forums and complaining about working as a mod?
no, i am not. it is only a statement of a fact.
i only do this with any spare time that i may have. and except for laffen, that probably holds true for the rest of the mods.
@milksp
by "special" i mean taking time and effort to maintain the thread like masseur did with his FAQ before or the other Krubach's S700i latest software, or arnoldc's old Summary of SonyEricsson Software for T610/T68i series or bobafett's ///Ericsson Forum–datas,infos&support(incl. galleries and links of fones,protos and acc.), etc etc.
what's common with all of them is that a) the thread starters was never asked nor forced to maintain those threads. they volunteered; b) it is meant to benefit esato users in one way, or another; c) and the success of the thread was the result of feedbak and interactions from other users.
i didn't mean that i (nor othe esato users) don't appreciate your efforts nor am i saying that it had no effect on the market forums. what i'm saying is that you saw something that youthought would be useful to others and created the thread, and made the effort to keep it up.
that is appreciated. those efforts are appreciated. not only by those who directly benefit from it, but the whole esato community as well.
Posted by themarques
Either I am going blind or someone felt its there right to DELETE the post I wrote earlier? Whats with that, I am guessing freedom of speech is out the window then.
Posted by MikLSP
They also deleted my post following it mate. We both posted addresses for other forums. U put minted & I put SE-NSE, I didn't know those sites were banned here too!
@ GOwin
thanks for those last comments
The Trusted Sellers thread is important to the market now & maintanance is important as it must be up to date or it may affect peoples sale, at least if Boba's \\\ thread doesn't get updated no-one loses out.
Anyway enough about that......
1) Why were those 2 posts removed? Seems like fear of competition
2) Is there any actual reason for this sale restriction other than 'its not in the essence of Esato'?
If we can see clear logic it'll be easier for people to understand this restriction.
_________________
Posted, as always, from my P905!
Using the Esato Market?
Check sellers feedback and leave feedback of your own (seller or buyer):
The A-Z Of Trusted Sellers
[ This Message was edited by: MikLSP on 2005-03-25 10:17 ]
Posted by p900 lover
why?
i dont understand y we cant just have another topic for non-mobile related things??????
laffen please explain?
i no u DONT have to explain but i think it might make others understand y ur doin what ur doin,
Posted by MikLSP
And please explain how selling non-mobile items is any different to talking about non-mobile items?