Posted by DennyL
There is an article in the current Personal Computer World magazine (p21) saying that Stereo Bluetooth headsets to a new standard called 'A2DP' (Advanced Audio Digital Profile) are starting to appear. These have a data-rate capability of 3Mbits/sec, and should be OK for music. It says in the article that the W800i is A2DP-enabled. Doesn't this mean that the K750i is A2DP-enabled, as it can be flashed to W800i? Does anyone know anything about A2DP headphones, or even have a pair that they can tell us about?
Posted by happycheesecake
I don't think it does. Here's the list of Bluetooth profiles supported by the K750i:
•Dial-up Networking Profile
•Generic Access Profile
•Generic Object Exchange Profile
•Object Push Profile
•Serial Port Profile
•Handsfree Profile
•Headset Profile
•Synchronization Profile
•Basic Imaging Profile
•File Transfer Profile
•Human Interface Device (HID) Profile
•SyncML OBEX binding
•JSR-82 Java API
The details are available in a PDF available here: http://developer.sonyericsson.com/getDocument.do?docId=70824
Posted by s0real
i had a aquick look at the white paper on the w800i and it mentions nothing about ad2p... is it definately supported on the w800?
Posted by abe2000
Isn't that the Headset Profile? (not Handsfree Profile)
Posted by happycheesecake
I don't think the headset profile is the same as the A2DP profile. According to the Bluetooth V2 specs, A2DP is mentioned in the list of available profiles as well as the headset profile...
That suggests to me that they are seperate profiles...
Posted by Itanium
Headset and handsfree profile are differnt from A2DP (Advanced Audio Delivery Profile).
A2DP is relatively newer and is included in BT2.0 specs.
AFAIK, Neither K750 nor W800 has implementation of this profile. As for talking about support, this is a totally software implementation issue so theoretically above said phones can have it in future. But at the moment that is not the case and I really don't see it happening. The way commercial companies work, they will include it in say K800 or W850 or something
Posted by gelfen
it is highly unlikely to be added to a future firmware. SE rarely adds a functionality upgrade to firmware updates.
Posted by DennyL
This says it's compatible with the K750i, FWIW. Looks very temptiing.
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=119598
Posted by jcwhite_uk
It also lists the K700 which is definately not compatible with it. It will probably work as a bluetooth headset but not to listen to music or in stereo.
Posted by batesie
bluetooth can only just handle 2 way conversations, i doubt a high quality audio track can be seamlessly streamed via bluetooth without comprimising battery life/and/or/quality
Posted by carkitter
@jc
Why wouldn't it work in stereo with the K700i handsfree profile over B/T 1.1?
Both my HCH-15 and SE (plug in) headphones use K700i handsfree profile.
Posted by Itanium
Most of the people are missing the point here. These headphones might connect very well with the phone and might work perfectly for calls. You might also be able to hear the incoming call voice from both the earpieces too, BUT, now pay attention here, voice calls are not stereo. So is a mono channel sound data is heard over 2 earpieces, it doesn't make it stereo.
Now to the 2nd and more important point. K750 and all previous models support headset and handsfree profiles only. A2DP (Advanced Audio Delivery Profile) is not implemented in these phone's bluetooth stack. That essentially means that you won't be able to transmit sound from media player to these (or any bluetooth stereo headset for that matter).
You can invest money in these and can use it to make and attend calls
but forget about listening to music with these and K750.
And ya as for talking about bandwidth available to trasmit good enough amount of music data over bluetooth, yes it was not possible until bluetooth 1.2. But the latest bluetooth 2 specs have much higher bandwidth available and hence can transmit stereo music data over the air. You might also want to make note that bluetooth and Wifi (a.k.a. 802.11), which has quite high bandwidth, use same frequency spectrum to transmit data, meaning that its not the transmitting medium that restricts anything, but the protocol specifications itself that has limitations.
Posted by Iondah
Ok. What Itanium makes sense, BUT. I've been looking all over the net trying to find out whether the K750i will work with an A2DP device or not. The fact that there is no mention of the A2DP profile in the K750i whitepages doesn't seem conclusive. For a start, the A2DP profile is included in the GAVDP (General Audio/Video Distribution Profile). Both of which are included in the BT 1.2 profile stack. Logic would suggest then, that any device which is BT 1.2 compliant can handle A2DP. But I'm not 100% on that because I haven't tried. I'm seriously considering ordering an A2DP adapter just to try it out and put an end to this.
The other thing I'd like to mention is with regard to someone's comment that the only SE handset to support A2DP is the P910. I looked through the whitepages of every single SE handset on the market at the moment for a mention of the A2DP profile and there is none. Even the GAVDP isn't mentioned in the Z800i which obviously has both in order to have 3G video and stereo capabilities. Therefore the fact that it is omitted from the whitepages doesn't seem to mean anything.
A2DP has been around for a while now, and while the K750i is BT 2.0 complient and SE was one of the original contributors to BT it seems odd that such a media oriented phone wouldn't support A2DP.
If anyone wants to make a donation I'll order a pair of A2DP BT headphones off Ebay today... unfortunately $100 seems a bit steap to buy just for the hell of it when it might not work.
Posted by Iondah
Bad news:
http://developer.sonyericsson[....]null&forumId=13&readOnly=false
That doesn't sound promising to me! :'(
I guess we pray for a Firmware upgrade.
Posted by Aussie Blue Boy
Yeah, I'm not real happy that the A2DP profile isn't in the K750i either.
Particularly as I've been itching to get my hands on this sensational looking headset...
http://www.bluetake.com/Products/BT420EX.htm
So please, please, please S-E give us a firmware upgrade that includes this profile!!!
Posted by blue-isaac
Nokia 6230i has A2DP
Posted by grassynoel
Sorry if i'm going off the topic here, but is there any way at all to play sound from the media player application to any bt headset?
I don't care if it's stereo, nor if it's high quality, as i'm only listening to podcasts (talking) and mono audio books.
I have SE P910a. Some have suggested a bt transmitter + headset but the point is to use the phone's bt.
Thanks for any replies.
Posted by jplacson
Ok... a firmware upgrade will NOT work unless the BT chipset itself is already BT v.2 compliant. That would be like saying a software upgrade will give me Hyper-Threading on a P-II CPU. You need BOTH the hardware and firmware to support the new stereo audio transmission.
And yes, the audio quality sucks. Imagine the crappiest headsets you can buy... then imagine that the jack was rusty and dirty and you kept twisting it around to get a solid connection (ever experience those crackly sounds?)... then you'll get pretty close to BT stereo audio.
Now, if you're the type who can stand to listen to MP3s encoded at 128kbps and lower... then you may not notice anything bad about the new BT stereo headsets.
Logitech has a white one... if you want a black one, you can get Logitech's "HP" branded one.
I'd say these things are better off for games where audio quality isn't that big a deal.
I'm wondering if these BT headsets have a memory buffer. Quality would improve a whole lot if they added 1MB of buffering so that the headset would have time to decode and add some DSP corrections
Posted by brouno
It's quite strange !
In K750i white paper on developper SE site, we can read :
"The K750i supports Bluetooth specification 2.0."
Page 27 in this document : http://developer.sonyericsson.com/getDocument.do?docId=70824
So the K750i should/may support A2DP profile if its in BT2 specs, isn't it ?
BTW its not in Profiles list on page 28 ...
B.
Posted by Vildvarg
Have a look at this model from Planex.
Anyone tried theese and know how the quality is?
http://www.planex.net/product/bluetooth/bt-01hss.htm
Posted by b_rad
Although I have a SE Z800i, my phone is very similar in terms of specs to the K750i (apart from the 2.0MP camera on the K750i and the 3G capability on the Z800i, obviously), and so I might be able to shed some light on the question of music playback through bluetooth headsets:
I have a Motorola HT820 stereo bluetooth headset for use with my phone, which works very well as a handsfree, but it seems that there is no way that the phone can be made to play music through the bluetooth headset. When a regular (corded) handsfree is plugged in, the media player automatically plays music through the handsfree; when the bluetooth handsfree is connected, the handsfree functionality is identical to the corded equivalent, but the music player plays music through the phone's speaker only. This would appear to indicate that the Z800i does not support A2DP, and I'd consequently assume that the K750i would be the same.
Posted by max_wedge
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Just because the BT2.0 specification includes a profile doesn't mean all bt devices will support all profiles. You wouldn't expect a headset to support the hid profile for example.
I don't understand the need for discussion. The K750 white paper doesn't include A2DP in the list of supported profiles, so why would anyone expect that somehow magically K750 gets A2DP?
Posted by FUMES
the w800i is so easy to use i bought it and i got the hang of downloading music onto it the same day
Posted by jiminabottle
Have you tried using a Bluetooth headset with a Nokia? All sounds are transferred to the headset once connected, music and all. And yep, even key tones while pressing buttons are heard from the headset.
Posted by max_wedge
not in stereo
Posted by Buttoneer
So nobody brave enough yet to have bought one of the many stereo BT options available and try it out?
Posted by max_wedge
those options are not available for the K750, which doesn't support the stereo bt profile.
Forget bluetooth if you want wireless stereo from your K750. The only option is rf (plug fm transmitter into hpm-70 or mmc-60 and send stereo to a fm radio). All phone sounds come through, but the mike isn't wireless, so you have to use the hpm-70 mike to talk.
For example, you could have the hpm-70 mike clipped to your lapel with the fm transmitter lead plugged into the socket. The cables would run down to you pocket/belt where-ever you put your phone and the transmitter. In your other pocket you'd have a small stereo fm receiver tuned into the fm transmitter, with a headset plugged in and leading to your ears.
Sounds complicated, but it works, I just tried it!
But in truth, it's to cumbersome to bother with. However there was one unexpected advantage I noticed - the fm radio was capable of blasting the sound even louder than the K750 itself is capable of.
Posted by scotchgitt
that seams a little over the top, why not just plug the handsfree kit in, a lot less boxes to fit in your pockets.
Good idea for driving as it provides a handsfree without actually being wired to the car and saves using a bluetooth car kit.
I use the home made hpm-70 for this through the car speakers and means the call actually come through the car stereo and the hpm mic picks up my voice.
Posted by max_wedge
I agree it's over the top!!
I didn't suggest this option with any degree of seriousness. I was just offering a "proof of concept", and also out of perverse curiosity.
I'm sure the dude's concern with the lack of stereo bluetooth is because they would enjoy the convenience of a having no more than a bluetooth stereo headset on their head and their phone in their pocket with no wires to get in the way. My "wireless" solution certainly doesn't achieve that (more wires than a wired handsfree
). However, if you needed, for whatever reason, to send the sounds on your phone in stereo wirelessly to a set of headsets (or a stereo system), then this is the way to do it. Of course as I mentioned, this setup doesn't offer a wireless mike, only wireless audio output.
If you rewired the hpm-70 to provide a jack for the mike as well, you could use two fm-transmitters. One to send audio from the phone to an fm receiver, and another to send audio from a wireless fm mike to an fm receiver plugged into the modified mike input on the hpm70. Technically it is wireless, but we are now carrying a phone, two transmitters, two receivers, and about ten miles of cable
Incidently I agree with you about the car, I have an fm transmitter actually installed in the vehicle, with a lead coming out from under the dash from the fm transmitter for audio input. I just plug that lead into the hpm-70 jack and away I go. No batteries to worry about for the fm transmitter, and I have a car charger that can piggy back the handsfree, so my phone is on charge whilst driving.
To speak I just reach for the hpm70 mike, or clip it to my lapel whilst driving. I don't do it so much for the wireless function (it's not really wireless, since the transmitter is installed in the car), more so I can listen to my fave music whilst driving.
Posted by redman5087
I asked the Support HelpDesk Of SonyEriccson Belgium,
They returned the following mail:
The k750i is FULLY compatible with A2DP, AVRCP 1.0 en GAVDP 1.0
It should work without any problem!
Greetings
Posted by max_wedge
Well that's strange because I've been searching the web all afternoon and I can only find claims that it doesn't support a2dp. No where can I find anyone who says K750 supports A2DP.
Infact, on a forum I found this "Bluetooth devices have to have the Advanced Audio Distribution Profile (A2DP) to connect with a wireless stereo headphone. The K750i is missing that profile. Even the W800 will not have this profile (information I got from the SE support)."
http://www.mobile-review.com/forum2/showthread.php?t=32006
So who's right?
Posted by redman5087
Yes, I know, all the information you find on the net is that is doesn't have the profile. That's why I asked The support team of Sony Ericcson. I asked them again if they are sure that this profile is supported on the K750i.
They said: we are sure that the k750i supports a2dp!
It is a mistake that it is not included in the manual!
It should be.
I would you show a copy of the mail but it is in dutch.
I'm planning to buy the nokia hs-12w bluetooth stereo headset.
It should work without any problem.
Greetings Redman
[ This Message was edited by: redman5087 on 2005-10-06 09:31 ]
Posted by ares
What we need is someone to test it, to know if that info from SE belgium is true...
Posted by Draqula
No test results, anybody?
Posted by sepguy
If w800(k750) had the a2dp profile it wouldn't necesarily need a pair of stereo BT earphones to be tested.
You can also check that on your computer and see that the high quality audio isn't among the discoverable services!
THERE IS NO A2DP!
Posted by redman5087
I'm really sorry about the information I posted here.
I mentioned before that I have send a mail to Sony Ericcson
confirming that the k750i has the a2dp bluetooth profile onboard.
I called the Helpdesk service of sonyericcson Belgium.
They made an error because they have different version of there database. The information mentioned in the mail IS NOT CORRECT.
Only the p910 has the a2dp bluetooth profile onboard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The k750i does NOT support a2dp!!!!!!!!!!
The mail they send was a mistake. The information came from a wrong database!!
I'm sorry for the wrong information!
Kind regards Redman
Posted by max_wedge
well thank god for that...it would be far worse if Google had failed so badly
...who knows, the whole space/time continuum could implode if google started to go belly up
Posted by RobertWebbe
For the lastest list of A2DP compatible phones and devices, check the A2DP page on my website.
http://www.robertwebbe.nl/A2DP.html
Besides a list of compatbile phones, there are also usefull links to A2DP headsets, updates, information and A2DP newsarticles.
Posted by pzboyz
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A2DP is not in BT2.0, there are no problems using A2DP over a BT 1.1 or 1.2 connection.
pzboyz
Posted by pzboyz
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On the Bluetooth BQB website this is not true.
The Nokia 8800 does have A2DP, and likely an recent Series40 phone after this also does. We fall find out in next few weeks with 7380 and all.
pzboyz
Posted by Muckle_Eck
Hi all,
I have had the following response from SonyEricsson help desk:
Quote
Thank you for contacting the Sony Ericsson Call Centre.
With regards to your enquiry, we do not have any information concerning future support for A2DP. At present, no Sony Ericsson phones support A2DP.
UNQUOTE
Not good news!!!
Posted by max_wedge
Apparently the W900 and P990 will be supporting A2DP, but hasn't been tested by this guy (cause they aren't out yet):
http://www.robertwebbe.nl/A2DP.html
[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2005-11-16 09:07 ]
Posted by masseur
there is no P990 whitepaper yet but I definitly can't see a2dp listed ni the profiles for the W900 in its whitepaper
Posted by max_wedge
hmmm, I found this link: http://digitalcameras.engadget.com/entry/1234000243060273/
makes me think the W900 a2dp was just a rumour that sprang from this article or similar. This robert webbe character was very certain of a2dp support in another post, but I can't find a thing on google that supports his claim...
Posted by lordlupin
I talked to the SE helpdesk (UK) today and they said that no phones made by them support A2DP and from what i have found out on the net, all of the bluetooth stereo headsets need A2DP to play stereo music from an audio player on your phone to the bluetooth headset. Most won't even play audio without A2DP although some say you'll just get a mono audio signal (not sure whether that is true or not). If a bluetooth headset says it is compatable with an SE phone then it is only for using as a headset or handsfree kit. This seems like misleading information if you ask me as no-one is going to buy big chunky stereo headphones and then just use them as a handsfree kit.
If, like me, you didn't realise this before paying 65 quid for a pair of bluetooth headphones you might be a bit pis*ed off, especially since the SE website and manual for my phone don't mention the profiles that the K750i DO support. I assumed that since the K750i played music and supported bluetooth V2, there would be no problem. It was only when i started to read this forum posting that i realised you could look at the 'whitepaper' for a particular phone but they aren't exactly easy to find on the website. Bluetooth info like this should be easy to find in the tech spec for each product they sell and not hidden away where we may or may not find it.
Not only is all of that annoying, but the K750i doesn't even have a normal 3.5mm jack for me to plug in a normal pair of headphones or bluetooth dongle for my headphones. It seems that the only headphones i can play music on from my K750i is the shi*ty, in-the-ear pair you get with the phone as you need to use the extremely unusual connector located on the base of the phone. Of course, you could spend some money and get one of the other 2 sets that SE sell, the HPM-70 or HPM-20, but, if like me, you really enjoy listening to music with a pair of headphones which aren't in-the-ear, then your kind of screwed unless you fork out more money.
As someone mentioned earlier, you could use the MMC-60 cable adapter but you'd need to find a set of headphones which connect using 2 phono cables (which is very unlikely, possibly even impossible) or get an adapter to convert the 2-phono output of the MMC-60 to a 3.5mm female jack which you could then plug a pair of normal 3.5mm male jack headphones into.
Also, i just found a 'Sony Ericsson K750i / W800i Stereo Audio Adapter' ( http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/product/7265.htm ) which means that you can plug in any set of normal headphones you want to use for music. If you really want, you can then get a bluetooth dongle/adapter ( http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/product/7632.htm - the adapter for my bluetooth headphones isn't cheap) with a pair of bluetooth stereo headphones (mine were £65) and plug the dongle/adapter into the 'Sony Ericsson K750i / W800i Stereo Audio Adapter' which means you can use bluetooth headphones to listen to music. The K750i/W800i stereo audio adapter and the bluetooth dongle would have to sit in your pocket/bag with your phone and although neither of these 2 options would be a full handsfree kit (i think you would know when you get a phone call, but you would have to use the phone normally for the call as the stereo audio adapter is one-way only) at least you could have a wireless setup to listen to music.
Also, you could get a 'Retractable Stereo Audio Adapter - Sony Ericsson W800i/K750i' ( http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/product/8177.htm ) and plug normal headphones into it. it wouldn't be prctical to use with bluetooth headphones but it does feature a microphone and would be useable as a full handsfree kit with the headphones of your choice. Unfortunately SE haven't released it yet.
Also, as someone mentioned, the K750i isn't exactly the loudest audio player in the world. I turned up all of the EQ bands on my phone to full which made a bit of a difference but i can still hear conversations of other people on the bus or the engine noise of cars on the street.
In conclusion, i'm pis*ed off with SE for being misleading or evasory regarding the capabilities of bluetooth profiles their phones provide, and also for the misleading info that many stereo bluetooth headset manufacturers give when they say their headset is compatable with a particular phone as they don't give you the specifics of the bluetooth profiles which their headset can use on that phone.
Although SE haven't bothered to put A2DP into their phones yet (and i seriously hope i get a firmware upgrade for it in the future from them), at least i can still be wireless for my music, although it will cost me another 40 or 50 quid to get there.
Hopefully this has been helpful for some of you and apologies for the rant-like quality of this post. I had been looking forward to easy-to-use bluetooth audio and was sorely disappointed.
Cheers
Bone
[ This Message was edited by: lordlupin on 2005-11-17 18:35 ]
[ This Message was edited by: lordlupin on 2005-11-17 18:38 ]
Posted by max_wedge
The HPM-70 has a 3.5mm audio connector and comes with earbud headphones standard but you can use any audio equipment with a 3.5mm jack. Using adapters you can plug the phone into your stereo if you want. or an FM transmitter. or ur nice headphones.
You can also then use the mike on the HPM-70 if you have it clipped to your lapel, and using your bt headphones thru the 3.5mm to bt adapter you mentioned.
Posted by MacC00l
This is bad news. How dumb.
But lordlupins work around is the most appropriate so it seems.
K750i -> Adapter to 3.5mm -> bluetooth adapter supporting A2DP
Then you'd have a headset which links to the adapter for music and to the K750i directly as hands-free headset.
I hope I got the concept right.
Though I imagine the media-buttons on such headsets would be useless, as the bluetooth adapter cannot send the commands to the phone over the 3.5mm cable, right?
Before buying a seperate bluetooth adapter, I'd get a headset which has it included. Example: http://www.planex.net/product/bluetooth/bt-01hss.htm
Other thing: I just found this on alibaba.com:
See here.
I tried contacting the company but my mail bounced with an error.
Also, on the website it doesn't say anything.
Anyone seen this thing before? I think it looks really good...
[ This Message was edited by: MacC00l on 2005-11-27 17:50 ]
Posted by soulframe
It looks like these are the only real stereo bluetooth headsets around at the minute. BT 2.0 and AD2P. Hopefully the P990 will be compatible with these and by the time it's released I would like to think the price would be a little cheaper by then, as it's a little pricey at the moment:
http://www.wi-gear.com/products/imuffs/specs.php
Posted by Muckle_Eck
Well...I can see that adding the dongle to the bottom of the phones will work, but beware!!
If you buy the Itech BlueCon bluetooth audio dongle this will only work with itech bluetooth headphones! I found out to my cost that this is the case.
However.....
I am now using my ipod with the BlueCon II connected to it , together with my Itech BlueBand headset.,...this gives me glorious stereo music!....at the same time my K750i is paired to the headset...and when a call comes in it cuts the ipod off and allows me to have my phone call...at the end of the call the ipod music is restored.
I know it isn't perfect....but better than nothing.,...now what do I do with my Anycom bluetooth headset!!!
Cheers
Posted by Giles@Cad
I have just bought a pair of iTech Blueband headphones & discovered that the phone won't play music on them even though iTech say their product is compatible with the K750i.
Having read the posts on this thread I know understand why. The K750i does not support A2DP & therefore incapable of streaming stereo music thru its bluetooth stack.
Thank God for forums!
But is the solution "K750i -> Adapter to 3.5mm -> bluetooth adapter supporting A2DP"?
Should I buy a iTech bluetooth audio dongle?