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Esato phone selling raffle discussion |
masseur
Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Sydney, London
PM |
ok, it seems we need a discussion about these
Should we allow raffles?
if so...
How will they work?
Who should do the draw?
who should collect the money?
when should the money be sent?
what maximum price per ticket? (this will decide the number of tickets)
etc etc
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J-J
Joined: May 10, 2004
Posts: 268
From: Nottingham, UK
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Personally i think not, i think it opens the flood gates for lots of half completed sales, people 'buying tickets' and having to wait weeks for the outcome, half completed raffles sitting uncompleted for weeks or the seller forgetting about them.
Plus the trust issue on here has always been a factor when it comes to buying and selling this would just increase the potential for fraud ten fold and yes it would be for smaller amounts but it would be for an increased number of users.
the issue you also have to consider and that there is absolutely no way of controlling is...
What is there to stop me raffling off my phone, getting on of my friends who uses this site to join the raffle, making sure they win it, keeping the phone and just pocketing everyone elses money?
There is physically no way of controlling these raffles enough for them to be safe for all users, there is always going to be someone who doesnt win questioning the integrity of the raffller.
For me the buying and selling is risky enough as it is already with out adding extra risk and more time consuming sales |
carkitter
Joined: Apr 29, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Auckland, NZ
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It sounds like a nice idea initially, but in the end it doesn't work for the majority of ticket buyers and I can't see it being able to manage itself unlike the A-ZoTT. It'll need constant supervision by moderators and increase admin costs to Esato for little or no benefit to the site.
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masseur
Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Sydney, London
PM |
I think as PeterKay said in the other thread, it would need to be drawn by a respected member or one who is at the top of the feedback table. So that takes care of the "making sure as friend wins" problem. Similarly, the person making thr draw should probably also be the treasurer for that raffle.
also...
I think that no one should pay any money into the raffle until all tickets are sold.
Also, there should be a fixed time limit for selling the tickets and if that time expires then the raffle is abandoned.
that is, if we are to do this at all...
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RLP06
Joined: Jul 10, 2007
Posts: 342
From: London
PM |
I think its going to go over people's heads, especially with for expensive items like an iphone.
PeterKay can't always collect the money and do the raffle...
Its a nice idea, but its too time consuming, too much logistics, and keeping track of things is going to be a nightmare... like I said in the other post, it happened once because we were trying to help willi out, and yes it was a sucess.
However: as a seller you would go to a raffle format as:
1) You take less risk on money collection
2) You can get a higher price
3) You don't have to do the work, someone senior collects the money and organises
With all sellers moving to a raffle format, I just feel buyers will always be taking a gamble unless they "buy all the tickets". As a buyer, I just feel I wouldn't be able to buy the phones I want anymore, and as a seller, I think this is great. However, the system will deteriorate and people will lose interest as they keep losing, and we're just going to end up with the original format....
Hope all that was coherent |
PeterKay
Joined: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: The Ummah
PM, WWW
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I don't think it should be scrapped, however it needs to be conducted in a correct and fair manner as the previous raffle was handled.
A few points as i mentioned before must be followed:
1. The seller is reputable, has good feedback
2. The Raffle host must be reputable/respectful
3. The draw must be taken with a witness at hand or even a camera recording
4. The price of the tickets should be cheap
5. The phone value must be reasonable
6. There must be a good reaso to raffle the item, it must've been in the market before! if its hard to sell then raffle it like weirdwilli's samsung g600.
A few points here i feel are important, no.6 being the key.
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RLP06
Joined: Jul 10, 2007
Posts: 342
From: London
PM |
I agree, #6 is pretty key, so people don't move to raffle immediately...
The only reason I think people have to raffle from the start is to get a higher price than you would without a raffle, which I think is taking advantage (not helping the community) |
carkitter
Joined: Apr 29, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Auckland, NZ
PM |
The raffle format is best suited to new items and to generate income for a charity, otherwise accusations of profiteering will abound. The suggestion of video recording the draw is impractical IMO.
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PeterKay
Joined: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: The Ummah
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On 2008-07-03 13:52:16, carkitter wrote:
The suggestion of video recording the draw is impractical IMO.
worked for me.
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dougproctor
Joined: Jan 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Gosport, UK
PM |
Being completely unbiased about this , even though I lost £5 in the last raffle we had for that magnificent Samsung phone  , I think this could get out of hand. We did that last raffle to help out a poor 14 year old with a phone he hated and was unable to sell. It was fun at the time as everyone will agree.
This could become the normal way of selling and is going to be an administrative nightmare to run - for somebody.
I think it is a way of getting more than you would by selling it alone - I mean a phone for £12 is much better than buying it for £300!! But if you continually lose, it adds up and the novelty will wear off quite quickly.
If you want to enter in a raffle for a phone, go on Ebay!!
Let's keep the "for sale" section on this site as it was originally intended - for sale or trade not a raffle!
Doug |
PeterKay
Joined: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: The Ummah
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I hear what you say Doug and agree with you.
We can keep the Esato Market for normal sales
but i think a raffle now and then would be fun
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RLP06
Joined: Jul 10, 2007
Posts: 342
From: London
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I think now and then is the key, but who is to decide what is 'once in a while' or who gets to raffle their phone... at the end of the day, we did it once in an 'opportunistic manner' to help out a 14 year old... not that we will help every 14 year old that needs money, but it just happened, and weirdwilli got the better deal out of it...
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dougproctor
Joined: Jan 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Gosport, UK
PM |
Peter,
I agree - now and again! But what will happen is that someone will offer their phone for sale and as we all know, no-one offers what the phone is actally worth - we never get what we want for it so we think - let's raffle it - make more of what I want plus possibly a bit more. I am sure that is the way it will go.
And who decides who does the odd raffle - the mods? This could very quickly get out of hand, realy think we ought to stay clear of it unless Willi has another phone he wants to offload on some poor .........
This was fun for a £85 phone, not so for a £300 odd top spec phone. And are there not laws about raffles and licencing etc?
My £5 worth..... And, Peter, I am only 14 years old and have this settee thing I want to........
[ This Message was edited by: dougproctor on 2008-07-03 15:44 ] |
pmerryman
Joined: Jun 02, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Oldham,Uk
PM |
I think we just stick with the For Sale/Trade.
We were helping out Weirdwilli in his plight to get rid of his unwanted G600, but a one off I think it should be.
One Day, Men Will Look Back And Say I Gave Birth To The 20th Century. You have to have a piss in the sea, its the law. The A-Z of Trusted Traders[img]http://a-zott.com/images/A-Z |
dougproctor
Joined: Jan 07, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Gosport, UK
PM |
Can the mods put up a voting form thingie where we indicate our preference? You know - the no, not flamin' likely, over my dead body thing! |
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Posted: 2008-07-03 12:32
