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A review of SE's phone software / GUI (vs Nokia's S40 3rd Edition platform) |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
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From: Australia
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mib, fair comments. Time will tell I guess. I still feel SE must have some reason to have committed to UIQ3 in the first place, when they could have put that time into adapting s60.
What that reason is, is anyboddy's guess.
Maybe the Motorola deal is lucrative enough to be worthwhile?
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Supa_Fly
Joined: Apr 16, 2002
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From: Toronto, Ontario
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On 2006-08-28 04:40:53, apolloa wrote:
Oh and to Prom1, you say you hate the design of the K800I but want to buy a K800I walkman? Aren't you contradicting yourself there a bit, I mean any walkman K800I will be based on the current K800I's design but maybe in white with orange lights. Do you not like the K800I's lights or something?
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No, the K800I is not the best SE can do, that'll be the P990I, M600I and W950I smart phones which are the competitors of any S60 smart phone.
Remember at the end of the day were comparing user interfaces, and as you keep going on and on about the Nokia Smart Phone User Interface Series 60 then it MUST be compared to SE's Smart Phone interface as on the M600I and P990I and W950I and not ANY other SE phone including the K800I.
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Yes indeed it seems at first glance I'm contradicting myself. I really like the features of the K800 (except lack of torchlite); but the case design I'm still contemplating on. The rumored Walkman K800 in white, just sucks. But if you consider the the M600 looks NOTHING like the W950 then you begin to understand what I'm hoping SE will do to a walkman phone based on the K800 platform/shell - not its case.
Also to nokiamaniax; if you remember the Nokia S40 3rd edition GUI (6270/6280) came out FIRST then S60 3rd edition gui was based on its layout/theme base (ala N80/93/92/73/72).
In the end, I still prefer the SE GUI for everyday use ... guess thats why I'm still using my z520i. I've just gotta decide now on 2 phone purchases: K790+K750 or w810i+k750.
> Once you go SE you'll never stray too far from or away too long!
|AppleTV2|iPhone 12Mini 256GB|iPad Pro 256GB| Previously ...  K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded T68i). |
apolloa
Joined: Jul 27, 2005
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From: Dorset, UK
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On 2006-08-30 08:22:50, mib1800 wrote:
apolloa:
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| So you really are stupid enough to use nearly Nokia's entire phone range against the K800I to back your argument up. |
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Are you so dumb that you cannot understand what I am sayng? for the last time, I am saying that s60 UI is more advanced but at the same time as user-friendly and easy to use as SE UI (as implemented in K800). I am just responding to your argument that s60 is complicated and normal users have difficulty with it.
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What you actually said was and I quote:
'There are 10 times more people picking up a S60 than a K800. And this number is increasing leap and bound every year'
Thus using every Nokia S60 phone and user against ONE Sony Ericsson model. You may have meant the entire SE range of non smart phones but that's not what you said, you also can't use the K800I because the article does because it compared it the S40 UI and not the S60. And for the last time S60 is not as easy to use as a Sony Ericsson non smart phone, if the article at the begning of this thread states the SE's UI is better then Nokia's S40 then I hardly think it would say the S60 UI is easier would it! Like it or not the majority of the people on these forums would say the same, S60 is more tricky to use.
I had a Nokia S60 phone for a year and I know from my own experiance it's not half as easy to use as SE's UI. Have you owned a SE phone in the last 2 Years? Or only Nokia?
@Prom, you never know they may change the case design slightly but I doubt it. I take it you don't like the slider on the back, well they changed it on the K750 - W800. I don't think they'll do anything like the M600 - W950 as that's a bit different cause of the QWERTY keypad.
[ This Message was edited by: apolloa on 2006-09-01 00:36 ] |
whizkidd
Joined: May 14, 2004
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Does someone here agree that non touchscreen smartphones are easier to use than their touchscreen counterparts? This is why i'm still stuck with s60. I'm plannin to upgrade soon...and i'm considering another s60 as i think touchscreens are cumbersome and difficult to use in the conditions in which i travel. Anyway, being a long time user/supporter of s60, i personally think the ui needs to be revamped. It now feels like once you've seen an s60 you've seen them all!
T230 >> T610 >> Ngage QD >> N73 >> N85 >> Omnia HD >> And countless other review units |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
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From: Australia
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Yes s60 phones can multi-task and SE non-smartphone can't, but one can still find that the gui of the less advanced phone is more sensibly designed, and the phone is therefore easier to use regardless of the complexity of the features the phone has.
The Nokia s40 menu is virtually identical to s60. I really dislike the s series GUI in any Nokia phone, and much prefer the SE GUI. Even an s60 device with multi-tasking can't change the fact that I don't enjoy using the menu system of Nokia phones. Whether the interface can multi-task or not comes down to the OS and has nothing to do with questions of ergonomics (which is what the GUI is all about).
The Nokia GUI is one of the only reasons I avoid Nokia phones. As pieces of hardware, they are quite nice (boring designs though). But using the device is another story. I don't like it, and will rather have a phone like the K750 (and the K800 soon hopefully), with it's limited multi-tasking ability over any Nokia, no matter what it's specs, or whether it is a smartphone or not.
If SE start making s60 phones with the SAME menu layout as Nokia phones, I would have to look around for another brand of phone...
If they have s60 but with the same menu philosophy as current SE Phones, then it could be very interesting...especially if s60 apps are still compatible 
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rockygali
Joined: Nov 21, 2005
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so much that ive like to join the conversation... reading the thread from the beginning... max_wedge just pulls every word from my mouth....
i second to that... and the last post sez it all... i still go for usability over design and again... contradicting stereotypes...
ciao!
"Darkness is the absence of light.. and not the opposite..." |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
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max_wedge:
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| The Nokia s40 menu is virtually identical to s60. I really dislike the s series GUI in any Nokia phone, and much prefer the SE GUI. Even an s60 device with multi-tasking can't change the fact that I don't enjoy using the menu system of Nokia phones. Whether the interface can multi-task or not comes down to the OS and has nothing to do with questions of ergonomics (which is what the GUI is all about).
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In terms of UI type (like form/popup/tab form etc), I think there exist a lot of similarity between SE and s40/s60 (in fact with a lot other UI too). Maybe you want to give some example where SE UI triumphs in usability compared to others. Shouldnt be difficult for you to do since it is so easy for you to dismiss the non-SE UI.
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max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
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On 2006-09-01 05:39:43, mib1800 wrote:
max_wedge:
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| The Nokia s40 menu is virtually identical to s60. I really dislike the s series GUI in any Nokia phone, and much prefer the SE GUI. Even an s60 device with multi-tasking can't change the fact that I don't enjoy using the menu system of Nokia phones. Whether the interface can multi-task or not comes down to the OS and has nothing to do with questions of ergonomics (which is what the GUI is all about).
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In terms of UI type (like form/popup/tab form etc), I think there exist a lot of similarity between SE and s40/s60 (in fact with a lot other UI too). Maybe you want to give some example where SE UI triumphs in usability compared to others. Shouldnt be difficult for you to do since it is so easy for you to dismiss the non-SE UI.
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For a start, the matrix style menu is more efficient for accessing deeply embedded functions. I also find SE MORE to provide better access to contextual info or settings than anything the Nokia interface offers.
I also don't mind the Motorola interface, I find that has more in common with SE than Nokia does.
I'm not arguing a yes or no case anyway mib. I'm quite willing to accept that for some people the Nokia GUI is fine and dandy.
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apolloa
Joined: Jul 27, 2005
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From: Dorset, UK
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There's a phone model you'll have to consider also, Motorola. I believe that in it's new top RAZR MAXX due to launch before the end of the year will feature the new Linux based OS. It could be one of the best UI yet if Motorola do it right. |
Bambino
Joined: Sep 17, 2005
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From: Clow Kingdom
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On 2006-09-01 03:15:00, whizkidd wrote:
Does someone here agree that non touchscreen smartphones are easier to use than their touchscreen counterparts? This is why i'm still stuck with s60. I'm plannin to upgrade soon...and i'm considering another s60 as i think touchscreens are cumbersome and difficult to use in the conditions in which i travel. Anyway, being a long time user/supporter of s60, i personally think the ui needs to be revamped. It now feels like once you've seen an s60 you've seen them all!
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U should try uiq3 mate!
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mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
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max:
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| the matrix style menu is more efficient for accessing deeply embedded functions. |
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You got me confuse here. I thought s40 has the same 4X3 matrix menu as SE. s60 already has this in its early days. s60 is more powerful because you can have bigger matrix (NX3) and matrix within matrix (sub menu).
btw: in s40/60 you can quickly access apps in the matrix menu by pressing key 1-9 which map to first 9 positions in the matrix. You dont even need to use joypad. Can SE UI do that?
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max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
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On 2006-09-02 04:06:12, mib1800 wrote:
max:
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| the matrix style menu is more efficient for accessing deeply embedded functions. |
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You got me confuse here. I thought s40 has the same 4X3 matrix menu as SE. s60 already has this in its early days. s60 is more powerful because you can have bigger matrix (NX3) and matrix within matrix (sub menu).
btw: in s40/60 you can quickly access apps in the matrix menu by pressing key 1-9 which map to first 9 positions in the matrix. You dont even need to use joypad. Can SE UI do that?
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Okay you got me on the matrix, I was thinking of my 6220.  So I can change the 6220 menu to matrix layout? 6220 is s40 isn't it?
btw, SE UI can call menu by number. Has been able to since the Ericsson days. The number system goes into submenus as well, so for example menu-5-1-1 starts a new text message, or menu-7-6 opens the games folder.
Maybe we both should have a closer look at the "other" UI 
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[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2006-09-02 09:35 ] |
Supa_Fly
Joined: Apr 16, 2002
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max; your greatly forgetting that even back in the Ericsson days (T18z, T36/39 for example) days menu calls was quite different (there wasnt 7 menus, lol); but efficient non-the-less. Nokia is the true beginner with using # keypad shortcuts to various menu items. Whizzkid is right with "once you've used an S60 device from Nokia you've seen them all". Lets hope Themes can save ya. Panasonic & Samsung have BOTH tried twice with S60 ; with no success, and it seems both have abondaned it until the next revision. Whizz, I suggest until you wait a few more months out AFTER 'beta testers, those S60 Freaks' play with a shipping model before spending large dollars again. STILL not enough apps, and digging through the menu system with FExplorer isnt gonna keep ya happy for the next several months. Battery life on such a promising device like the N80 just kills its glory.
> Motorola menu's EVEN the supposed Linux-Java combination, only looks nice like candy over shite; once ya bite in you'll forever be disgusted. I will never touch a motorola & havent since my only experience in using it more than 3 mins with the p7382i.
> Max, finally you're upgrading to the K800 .... a true holdout on the K750. I've decided to start hunting for a blasted silver K750 as a backup to the W810 I'm purchasing this week. I'm still out on the K790i which I'm getting word that SEUS will be abondoning, just fokelore I hope.
At the end of the day, the style of a phone only goes so far, and the Menu, how you navigate to USE the features of the phone & its battery life will ULTIMATELY solidify your purchase of a phone as worthy. As much as I dont like my z520i its kept me going even through 7 drops on concrete with 1 case change (style cover only) and works solidly as a phone. Furthermore, the menu I can NEVER be sick of.
Some BIG improvements that I long for are in the CALENDER and its layout to list appointments.
|AppleTV2|iPhone 12Mini 256GB|iPad Pro 256GB| Previously ... K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded T68i). |
apolloa
Joined: Jul 27, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Dorset, UK
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@Prom
I agree about the battery, I seriously thought the day's of a 1 day phone were over but obviously not. There is absolutely no point in stuffing all these features into a phone like the N80 when it's dead after a day as it's all useless then. The same goes for the N93 and P990I. But also look at the 3G battery life of phones, rubbish and they've been working on it for what seems like a lifetime.
One day we'll have all the features we want and a battery that last a week and will last a million recharges.
I shall wait and see on the new Motorola Linux thing with great interest as I have used one for about 5 minutes and that was more then enough, horrible, it's totally backward to every other UI. If they get it right though then I'm sure they'll storm the sales charts again with there 'ZR' range. |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
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On 2006-09-02 12:06:47, Prom1 wrote:
max; your greatly forgetting that even back in the Ericsson days (T18z, T36/39 for example) days menu calls was quite different (there wasnt 7 menus, lol); but efficient non-the-less. Nokia is the true beginner with using # keypad shortcuts to various menu items. Whizzkid is right with "once you've used an S60 device from Nokia you've seen them all". |
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I used to own a T28s, probably one of the best phones for it's day. Keypad numbers brought up menu items just like on current SE's.
I tested my old Nokia 5110, and it uses the keypad number system for menus, but I don't have as old an Ericsson to check. Both manufacturers have been using the menu numbering system for a good while now.
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Posted: 2006-08-30 18:27
K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded 
