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SE ranks poorly in reliability/quality |
peacemf
Joined: Dec 10, 2004
Posts: 167
From: UK, but now in CZ :)
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lol
you know if somebody has a SE phone if they are walking around and holding their phone up to the sky whilst trying to send a message! 
lol looking for good reception  |
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Kwiksta
Joined: Jul 17, 2004
Posts: > 500
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lol, my k700's reception is good...but nothing will beat the reception i had with vodafone on my nokia 7210... class..
Previously --> tempsonyfreak |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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mib, I've seen people crash all sorts of phones because they are unaware of how to treat them right. This has nothing to do with SE, it happens on all phones in the hands of idiots. As a computer tech I have no sympathy for peeps who blame the ui or the equipment for their own inability to use common sense.
I agree firmware should be well tested and so forth, but there is still an issue where user errors cause problems that the vast majority of other users don't experience. Some firmwares don't account for people doing unexpected things, and this is the cause of many crashes I have seen in handsets. Once you know what to avoid, the phone magically becomes stable.
For example, on my K700, if I let the number of pictures build up in any one folder (500+), the picture menu would become extremely slow, and I also would find that I could no longer copy photos reliable from one folder to another. Now this could be fixed with firmware I'm sure, but why keep 500 photos on there? It's just laziness if someone can't be bothered to save them, and if the phone memory corrupts and they lose their pics it's their own fault. When you start to have problems moving photos around, you save them on the computer and delete them from the phone. It's just common sense.
Instead these people get on Esato or some forum and claim the firmware is "unstable" and blame the phone manufacturer for their lost photos!
My K700 was never updated, and I had a firmware version that many peeps claimed was crash worthy. The phone rarely crashed (about three times). My K750 has never crashed on R1L. Many people have reported crashing problems with R1L, so if the firmware is buggy, why do I have no problems with it?
As far as I'm concerned it is faultless, yet there are people on this forum giving R1L K750's a bad name because it's not working for them. Give me a phone, and I guarantee I could find a way to make it crash, because no phone is so solid that there is nothing the user can do that will crash it. No phone is that "reliable".
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JK
Joined: Feb 24, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: S. Africa - JOZI
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On the branding issue i 'tested' a 6230i branded vs non branded, the branded one is easily slower...
Branding can affect a phone, my K700 unbranded with r2l firmware had no probs exept for the call answer delay. |
scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: UK
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Quote:
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On 2005-08-30 11:26:28, mib1800 wrote:
Don't you think it is a tall order to expect users taking part in the survey to know whether it is firmware, user or hardware problem? Maybe to us, we know if a phone freezes it is most probably firmware issue. But can you expect Joe Public to give this prognosis? It is not feasible and not objective at all. I thought a failure is a failure no matter what cause it.
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Well it really isn't much of a survey if they simply say "This doesn't work" and have no meaning to it. As I said before the 'fault' could be user error, which isn't really a fault with the product.
Even if the survey had asked some basic questions of the nature of the faults it may have been more useful. As it stands it is little more than a generalisation with no background or explanation offered.
@Orange
Your glib response aside, the same is true of any manufacturer. Whether SE, Nokia or anyone else had the most faults according to that report I would still say the same thing, it is a generalisation. We know nothing of the demographics surveyed; were the people surveyed predominantly SE users? Were they predominantly Motorola users? What care was taken to ensure an objective sample?
Quite frankly I wouldn't base a buying opinion of any manufacturer based upon this report. A survey carried out by a group of nursery children would likely offer more scope.
Blindly accepting everything that's fed to you in such reports as well as the media isn't very wise. One should question and enquire about such matters.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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good point scots, I thought the same thing. Information can be twisted until one thing looks like another.
I've just done a quick google on mobile phone firmware faults, and there is no shortage of bugs in Nokia handsets, neither is there a shortage of dissatisfaction with Nokia handsets. Does this prove anything? No more so than that report.
After listening to mib, you'd think the need to update phone firmware after sale is an exclusively SE phenomenon, but that is clearly not the case. |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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@scotsboyuk
Quote:
| Well it really isn't much of a survey if they simply say "This doesn't work" and have no meaning to it. As I said before the 'fault' could be user error, which isn't really a fault with the product.
Even if the survey had asked some basic questions of the nature of the faults it may have been more useful. As it stands it is little more than a generalisation with no background or explanation offered.
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Since you guys are in the UK, maybe you can drop by your local news stand and grab a copy of this Which? magazine. Then we will know what are the criteria used for the survey.
I have seen this article being carried by many websites. And motorola and an operator came out with statements on this survey which should give some credence to it. So I dont think this survey is such a whitewash.
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Arne Anka
Joined: Nov 05, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Sweden
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A similar survey 2 years ago in Norway claimed 35% of returned mobile phones due to faults in Norway came from Nokia. The figures then came from Norways biggest mobile phone reseller based on real returned units.
Whether that was specific for Norway or that specific reseller was not possible to conclude.
This survay about SE and Moto seem to be in same state. Not possible to trust since nothing is said how it was measured and where (worldwide, just UK, a specific reseller, asking customers etc.).
[ This Message was edited by: Arne Anka on 2005-08-30 16:31 ] |
Kryptik
Joined: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Port Elizabeth, S.Africa
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@ Masseur, thanx for the link to this thread...
This message was posted from a Nokia |
scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: UK
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Quote:
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On 2005-08-30 16:06:02, mib1800 wrote:
Since you guys are in the UK, maybe you can drop by your local news stand and grab a copy of this Which? magazine. Then we will know what are the criteria used for the survey.
I have seen this article being carried by many websites. And motorola and an operator came out with statements on this survey which should give some credence to it. So I dont think this survey is such a whitewash.
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One of the operators who commented on the report, 3, criticised it for similar reasons to those I have given. No one is saying that this report isn't valid at all, but as it stands it offers very little information. It throws up some interesting trends, but without further information they are as good as meaningless.
I am not sure if the issue with this report is still on sale, but I may have a look for it the next time I'm in the newsagent.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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@scotsboyuk
Quote:
| One of the operators who commented on the report, 3, criticised it for similar reasons to those I have given. No one is saying that this report isn't valid at all, but as it stands it offers very little information. It throws up some interesting trends, but without further information they are as good as meaningless. |
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You can't expect others that carry the news feed to print the full article, do you? You cannot say it is meaningless just because you dont know the full details. It just like saying the quarter sales figure issue by SE is meaningless because the news feed did not carry the full breakdown details (running into tens of pages).
Most of the time we are just interested in the final conclusion. Of course those who were given the bad limelight would try to rubbish it. btw 3 didnt provide alternative figures to disprove the findings except only saying sample size is not big enough.
[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2005-08-31 03:14 ]
[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2005-08-31 03:17 ] |
Kryptik
Joined: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Port Elizabeth, S.Africa
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The report certainly casts somewhat of a shadow, but imho we're not likely to see a "perfect" mobile phone anytime soon from any manufacturer. Ppl are too diverse for that to happen. One man's trash is another's techno-marvel.
This message was posted from a Nokia |
Cenfi
Joined: Jul 24, 2005
Posts: 129
From: Indonesia
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siemens phones never crash |
jcwhite_uk
Joined: Feb 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Dorset, UK Phone:Xperia Z1
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How can 3 uk critisize SE for faults when they have only been selling SE handsets for less than a month? |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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In the Which survey, 20% of SE users reported faults, and 10% of Nokia users reported faults. The survey sample was 50 users, hardly enough to make any sort of realistic differentation between a 10-20% result.
Seriously, this "survey" would not be considered a reliable sample by any professional statistician.....
Everybody read this report and decide for yourself if the method was accurate or not. I myself am appalled it even made the news. It's sensationalism as far as I am concerned....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4745205.stm
[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2005-08-31 13:04 ] |
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Posted: 2005-08-30 14:02
