| Author |
Watch out for this when buying new phones. |
djtwistter
Joined: Aug 22, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: UK
PM |
nice pics is that your house
| |
|
Supa_Fly
Joined: Apr 16, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: Toronto, Ontario
PM, WWW
|
On 2007-08-26 03:08:37, Alexandra wrote:
On 2007-08-26 03:04:57, Prom1 wrote:
@ Alexandra; no worries. I'm sorry if my entire post seemed to single you out. That was NOT my intention & I'm happy you didn't take it that way - at least I hope you didn't.
@ plankgatan, excellent shots dude! Love how you captured the contrast of light & shadow on your daughters face. Also noted that the K810's photos still able to tell the single blade of grass in the background.
What really offended me was your first line; I would never want to ruin my life like that.
My DEEPEST apologies. I'm one of the older members here and I use such words as jokes or punchlines; not the real thing. I'll be more careful when addressing you in the future, as you don't know my online humor/wording just yet. I do hope that NOBODY would ruin their lives with such a substance.
back on Topic. Jojo, that extra light is cheating mate. is that light even compatible with the K790/800/810? Hmm.
|AppleTV2|iPhone 12Mini 256GB|iPad Pro 256GB| Previously ...  K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded T68i). |
Alexandra
Joined: Jun 13, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Nowhere Mobile: K800
PM, WWW
|
EDIT: Damn you Prom, you beat me to it 
_________________
*edited on a Coloco PC of course. Coloco: There is no substitute*
This message was posted from a  K800i or Coloco C100 (home-built)
The Non-Smokers Thread
[ This Message was edited by: Alexandra on 2007-08-26 02:19 ] |
*Jojo*
Joined: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: > 500
PM |
@dj - If you were pertaining to ME . . . YES it is  !
@prom - I remember that when I took those shots I made sure that there WAS no lights (ceiling et al) that was turned ON, if there was . . . I think they are just those SMALL-ones . . . because I wanted to give emphasis on what the Xenon Flash (optional accessory-K750i) can DO !
[addsig] |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
On 2007-08-26 02:19:52, Prom1 wrote:
What kind of crack are you on with such a general statement??
Can the K750 take a 3.15MP photo? Nope so that statement doesn't count. Now blow up a GOOD quality shot - in great sunlight with a K800/790, then the same with a K750 and blow BOTH up to 10x11 see which one is better & less blurred. 7
Prom1, I've taken over 7000 photos with the K750. I can assure you, that without imagination, the reasons people claim it is better are based on experience and not ego. That's not even considering the cam driver development, which further improves the camera.
No one is dissing the K800 when they claim the K750 is better quality. It's not a myth. It's a fact. Just like no one with any knowledge of photography would claim the K750 is better quality than the S700 - it isn't. You can blow up a K750 picture more than you can a S700 before you notice pixelation, but in all other respects the S700 produces a better picture. It doesn't have auto focus either. Of course in the macro arena K750 kicks arse over S700, so overall it's a better cmaera. But in light balance, colour, sharpness (when subject is in the focal range), and noise performance, the S700 is still better than any SE camera phone.
No one is trying to say that the K750 photos can be blown up as large as K800 pictures, we all know that. We are talking about other, what some would argue, more important factors in producing a quality photo.
/10 it'll be the K800 that stands out = ALL WITHOUT messing with cam drivers like SoooOOOoo many ppl do here on Esato - I'm not even sure if the cam drivers can be cleanly removed and brought back to stock?
The K750 camdriver is one file only, to restore the K750 camera to stock all you need do is restore an original camdriver file and your camera is back to normal. If you don't know even this much about the camdriver mods then don't presume as to what is and isn't possible with cam driver modding. The camera driver modding was not a desperate attempt to get useable photos out of K750 - the K750 has excellent photos in it's own right. What cam driver modding does is improve on the default performance parameters used by SE. SE were more interested in a driver that was dummy proof. Modders have instead developed drivers where you can change manually change ISO values, do manual focus, use AE lock, manually change exposure time, and many other features that make the driver more complicated to learn, but much more flexible once learnt.
So driver modding is more than about quality it's also about having a digicam in a phone that has features more common on high end cameras, to give you the control you need to get better pictures more often than you would with a stock driver. With K800 we have the opportunity to improve on some of the areas where the K800 performs poorly compared to K750, as well as add some of the great features exploited in the K750 camera driver mods.
I never owned a K750 long enough that I had photos that I kept, only the W810 - which many here seem to think the lens/sensor is different but equally has good at quality 2MP photos.
The W810 has an identical lens module (sensor/lens in all-in-one) to the K750. It can also use K750 drivers.
Can those with both a default straight out of the box non-branded, non-camdriver modded, non-custom firmware modded K750 take a series of photos & with a K800/790 take the SAME photos in the SAME spot with roughly less than a 2min timeline between phones/shots post up comparisons that each OF us can DOWNLOAD (not esato resizing) and compare at different zoom levels and SEE with our own (subjective) naked eyes .. this'll put up debate, of course but it'll be vary rewarding 
That's a lot of work and to be quite frank I've done my hard yards. I know that what Alexandra says is true, from my own experience. I don't have to prove it to anyone. If you don't want to believe that's your perogative, but after taking 7000 photos, and having taken 800 or so with the K800 already, I have my answer (I wondered too when I was considering getting K800). btw, I adore my K800 and I wouldn't go back to the K750 due to the extra MP, but that doesn't mean I don't hope that cam driver modding can improve on some of the areas where K800 falls down compared to the K750.
_________________
File System Tweaks for the K750 K750 Tricks
K800 Tips and Themes
Max's K800 Page
[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2007-08-26 02:28 ] |
*Jojo*
Joined: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: > 500
PM |
@alex - YES ! I was not minding this thing back then (for my fones that has NO built-in xenon flash still . . .) Little that I know that this thing can really make WONDERS !
Take a LOOK on these pages . . . as I used the wonders of the mxe-60 xenon flash with my K618i then (no - Auto Focus) : INDOOR-shots, in complete darkness !
http://www.esato.com/board/vi[....].php?topic=132094&start=45
http://www.esato.com/board/vi[....].php?topic=132094&start=60
[addsig] |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
the xenon flash is a great accessory, but even with just the onboard light K750 cam perform well in total darkness (apart from the camera light).
|
*Jojo*
Joined: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: > 500
PM |
@max - Yes ! I manage to see some uploads here (indoor/dark) that uses only the built-in light on their K750's . . . great ! Now what puzzles me is that if those BUILT-IN xenon flash (K800i et al) are LESS powerful than that with the optional accessory - mxe-60 xenon flash one 
[addsig] |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
On 2007-08-26 03:34:16, *Jojo* wrote:
@max - Yes ! I manage to see some uploads here (indoor/dark) that uses only the built-in light on their K750's . . . great ! Now what puzzles me is that if those BUILT-IN xenon flash (K800i et al) are LESS powerful than that with the optional accessory - mxe-60 xenon flash one
this is fairly normal - external flash units are usually stronger than built in flash units - that's the point of them. You can fit a larger unit and more circuitry in an external enclosure than you can onboard, so I guess it's only natural that the flash accessory will still have a place to be used with the K800.
|
alrodlop35
Joined: Nov 11, 2006
Posts: 461
PM |
I agree with you to a degree. Under perfect conditions, the K750/W800 is better than the K800/790. However, in regular situations I find the K790 takes better pictures easier. It behaves more like a real digital camera in aspects such as the speed it takes the pictures at. With a W800 the people you're taking a picture of need to stay still longer that usual. It can become quite annoying. I also think the K790 shows colors much better. It shows them like they are in real life. The W800 tends to go like a Nokia and make super bright colors that aren't like that in real life.
|
*Jojo*
Joined: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: > 500
PM |
@max - Thanks ! That's what I was just thinking of mate ! !
[addsig] |
Supa_Fly
Joined: Apr 16, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: Toronto, Ontario
PM, WWW
|
@Max Wedge,
As I stated & you quoted "I'm not even sure if the cam drivers can be cleanly removed and brought back to stock?", I didn't presume to make a statement & judge on something I know nothing about. Well in slight of hand kind of way I did. Many ppl on Esato have modded their K750's - yourself included - but I was refering to so many photos in the "post your photos taken from your K750 Thread or elsewhere. I didn't claim that K750 doesn't take quality photos, however, I'm stating that without a clear way for those of us that didn't own or mod a K750 (W810 in the same vote) - then the "The best quality photos" or "better than K790/800 photos" claim cannot be looked at or verified just by blind faith. I've taken a few photos with my old W810 - I don't own it any longer for quite some time - but not nearly enough as my K790a. I have not taken any photos on my old W810 (that I recall) pointed directly at sunrise/sunset and still make out what was the focused subject in the photo.
And yes I've seen QUITE A FEW quality photos taken by you Max - that I cannot argue. However I just couldn't help but mention about cam modding - only those that modded & took photos will know which are & which are not taken with modded settings (ISO etc). Again I've never modded any of my phones & don't wish to thus far.
With all that you can do even with cam modded driver for K750/W810 > why did you still want the K800? Just the extra pixels? if the photos are not clear then why, really (more memory, or)?
Oh well I still see that clarity of out of focus (not within the cross-hairs) items like blade of grass & such are still much clearer on K800. Your K750 photos took incredible landscape pics low light or midday sunlight. Don't know if it was the spectacular scenery on some that wow'd us but definately quality.
Did any of your K750 photos exhibit artifacts like my K790 did that I mentioned?
|AppleTV2|iPhone 12Mini 256GB|iPad Pro 256GB| Previously ... K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded T68i). |
chili
Joined: Dec 09, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Philippines
PM, WWW
|
... And so the white tourist hunters debated on and on and on about how each one's choice of rifle is better than the others', about how accurate the viewscope is and how clean the exit wounds can be and how one even modded his gun to have a silencer. Meanwhile it's dusk and the local guy with nothing but a spear and a knife brings home some perfect venison from a full day's hunt, skillfully hunted and beautifully cut and bled. And he wonders as he looks around and sees all the tied-up, already-dead chickens being shot repeatedly by the white hunters while they intelligently debate on and on about their weapons. |
Supa_Fly
Joined: Apr 16, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: Toronto, Ontario
PM, WWW
|
On 2007-08-26 06:19:00, chili wrote:
... And so the white tourist hunters debated on and on and on about how each one's choice of rifle is better than the others', about how accurate the viewscope is and how clean the exit wounds can be and how one even modded his gun to have a silencer. Meanwhile it's dusk and the local guy with nothing but a spear and a knife brings home some perfect venison from a full day's hunt, skillfully hunted and beautifully cut and bled. And he wonders as he looks around and sees all the tied-up, already-dead chickens being shot repeatedly by the white hunters while they intelligently debate on and on about their weapons.
LMAO!
Just remember those hunters with all the dead chickens may eat for days after that 1 night and if season is out & the blood you've left will scare off the game lol. j/k. But well put.
|AppleTV2|iPhone 12Mini 256GB|iPad Pro 256GB| Previously ... K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded T68i). |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
On 2007-08-26 06:00:25, Prom1 wrote:
@Max Wedge,
I'm stating that without a clear way for those of us that didn't own or mod a K750 (W810 in the same vote) - then the "The best quality photos" or "better than K790/800 photos" claim cannot be looked at or verified just by blind faith. I've taken a few photos with my old W810 - I don't own it any longer for quite some time - but not nearly enough as my K790a. I have not taken any photos on my old W810 (that I recall) pointed directly at sunrise/sunset and still make out what was the focused subject in the photo.
you are quite right and it's true that to the outsider it's hard to ascertain for sure that the great results seen by K750 pictures posted at esato are not muddied by interspersed modded cam photos, and indeed there is some of that happening. however, I have to say the majority of guys posting pictures in the K750 picture thread are non-modders. Also, when I post, I usually state clearly if it is a moddified cam pic. Also, for my own records I maintain a table of DSC number to camdriver correlations, so that I know which photos are camdriver or not. Also, in the exif info, the camera software version is listed, and the good modders change this info in the driver so the photo's own exif information can tell you if the photo is from a modded camera or not.
And yes I've seen QUITE A FEW quality photos taken by you Max - that I cannot argue. However I just couldn't help but mention about cam modding - only those that modded & took photos will know which are & which are not taken with modded settings (ISO etc). Again I've never modded any of my phones & don't wish to thus far.
I am honoured by your compliments, thank you. Many of my best pictures are with standard driver. Modded driver gives us more flexibility to get better shots more of the time. But that doesn't mean the stock unit isn't also capable of excelling 
With all that you can do even with cam modded driver for K750/W810 > why did you still want the K800? Just the extra pixels? if the photos are not clear then why, really (more memory, or)?
The K800 has extra buttons in the UI. Scenes and Shoot Mode buttons. "Scenes" are available in modded drivers on K750, but existing K750 hardware buttons need to be used which makes the use of scenes complex and tedious and without visual feedback. With the K800 the button is just sitting there ready to use.
Also, Xenon Flash, Better viewfinder (K750 only 176x220), Best Pic.
AE lock, Infinity lock, spot, all of which are standard on K800 but to get these features on K750 need to use a modded driver. It's doable on the K750, but as above "scenes" example, when integrated into the hardware it works so much nicer.
Oh well I still see that clarity of out of focus (not within the cross-hairs) items like blade of grass & such are still much clearer on K800. Your K750 photos took incredible landscape pics low light or midday sunlight. Don't know if it was the spectacular scenery on some that wow'd us but definately quality.
The art with low light landscape pics on K750 standard driver is to always under expose as much as possible without ruining the pic completely. This reduces the ISO the camera will use and you'll get virtually noise free pics. You then also have the option to increase brightness/contrast a little with photoshop. (if the pic has noise in it photoshop or even noiseware are of little use). However, please note I have never posted "touched up" photos - they are always straight from the camera (though resized by esato).
BTW, who said K750 can't get nice crisp blades of grass in the back ground?
Did any of your K750 photos exhibit artifacts like my K790 did that I mentioned?
post me an example and I'll look at it. I can't think of anything like that that I have noticed, but I may have missed it.
_________________
File System Tweaks for the K750 K750 Tricks
K800 Tips and Themes
Max's K800 Page
[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2007-08-26 05:57 ] | |
|
Access the forum with a mobile phone via esato.mobi
|
Posted: 2007-08-26 03:14
K750|Z500|Z520|K700|K790i|K850i, :Ericsson: T18z|T28World|T36m x3|T68m (Ericsson, not the rebranded 
