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so who is religous here? |
absinthebri
Joined: Feb 11, 2004
Posts: 476
From: London, UK
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@ Sammy
I wonder if so-called 'Christian' extremests have read the New Testament? How do they reconcile, say, Matthew chapter 5 with the invasion of Iraq?
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axxxr
Joined: Mar 21, 2003
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From: Londinium
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On 2005-07-16 14:36:50, scotsboyuk wrote:
Also, does Islam advocate the policy of 'an eye for an eye'?
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It does but only in a state of war and in the battlefield.
This is another article which you might be interested in: HERE
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PeterKay
Joined: Jul 08, 2003
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From: The Ummah
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The Satan, with whom i do Jihad daily will say the following which is mentioned in the Holy Quran Chapter 14 Verses 22 and 23:
And Satan will say when the matter is decided: "It was Allah (God)Who gave you a promise of Truth: I too promised, but I failed in my promise to you. I had no authority over you except to call you but ye listened to me: then reproach not me, but reproach your own souls. I cannot listen to your cries, nor can ye listen to mine. I reject your former act in associating me with Allah (God). For wrong-doers there must be a grievous penalty."
But those who believe and work righteousness will be admitted to gardens beneath which rivers flow,- to dwell therein for aye with the leave of their Lord. Their greeting therein will be: "Peace!"
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"Verily the Day of Sorting out is a thing appointed"
[ This Message was edited by: peterkay on 2005-07-16 19:16 ] |
amnesia
Joined: Jan 15, 2004
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From: Doha, London, Tokyo, Shanghai
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@axxxr, to an extent it applies to the law as well.
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absinthebri
Joined: Feb 11, 2004
Posts: 476
From: London, UK
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On 2005-07-16 14:15:27, scotsboyuk wrote:
I suppose a valid question would be what justification they find in Islam for their actions though. They appear to root their beliefs and actions in Islam. What is it that they are using to do that?
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Some people seem to find justification in their "Christianity" for invading two sovereign nations (one of which happens to have the world's second largest oil reserves - a desperately needed commodity by the invaders) and murder 100,000 innocent civilians. 'Islamic' 'terrorists' have a long way to go before they match that level of atrocity.
Perhaps the 'Christians' do it because they hate Islamic values and the Islamic way of life?
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02
Joined: Sep 24, 2004
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From: UK Birmingham
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@scotsboyuk
Where do this terrorist form this terror act?? Definately not from Islam.. Its just the built of Hate and Anger... Yes they are an "Islam" faith.. but they are not pure in a way... coz they followed the devil to kill others... thus Islam religion has no link with this terrorist.. its just from their twisted mind.. and hate..
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PeterKay
Joined: Jul 08, 2003
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From: The Ummah
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Absolutely true @02.
A little information on the character and manners of the Holy Prophet Muhammed (peace be upon him). Main reason for me mentioning the following is because not many non-muslims know about the Holy Prophet and his way of life.
The Holy Prophet (saw) was the most patient among men, the bravest, the best judge, and one who pardoned most. His hand did not touch any strange woman. He was the greatest charitable man. He did not pass a single night hoarding any dirham or dinar. Whenever any excess money came to him and if he did not then get anyone to accept it as charity, he did not return home till he gave it to the poor and the needy. He did not store up for more than a year the provision of his family members which Allah was pleased to give him. He used to take one fifth of what easily came to him out of dates and wheat. What remained in excess, he used to give in charity. He used to give away in charity to one who begged anything of him, even out of his stored up provision.
He used to repair his shoes, join his wives in their labours and cut meat with them. He was the most shy among men and could not stare at anyone for long. He accepted invitation of slaves and free men and presentation of even a cup of milk. He did not use the properties of Zakat and used to accept the invitation of the widows and the poor. He used to speak the truth even though it was sometimes a cause of trouble to himself and his companions. He used to say: I Don't accept any invitation of any infidel. He used to bind stones in his bell for appeasing his hunger and eat whatever he got. He did not return any present and did not take precaution in any lawful food. If he got dried grapes in lieu of bread, he ate them. If he got baked meat, he ate it. He used to eat whatever he got of bread, wheat, sweets, and honey. He considered milk as sufficient if he did not get any other food. He used not to take food leaning against a pillow or upon a high table. Soles of his two feet served as his towel. He used not to eat bread consecutively for three days till he met Allah. it was a voluntary act on his part. He used to accept invitations of marriage, attend the sick and the diseased and attend the funerals. He was the most modest without pride and his tongue was most eloquent without prolongation of his speech.
More on The Holy Prophets manners and life can be found HERE.
Another trait of his characters is that he used to salute first one whom he met with. He used to wait at a place where he was to meet a man. He used not to withdraw his hand from anybody till he first withdrew his hand. When he met with any of his companions, he used to handshake with him, hold his hand, enter his fingers unto his fingers and hold them firmly. He did not stand up or sit without remembering Allah. When anybody sat by him at the time of his prayer, he used to make it short and say to him: Have you got any need? When he fulfilled his need, he returned to his prayer.
_________________
"Verily in the heavens and the earth, are Signs for those who believe"
"Verily the Day of Sorting out is a thing appointed"
[ This Message was edited by: PeterKay on 2005-07-16 20:47 ] |
scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
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From: UK
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On 2005-07-16 20:32:38, absinthebri wrote:
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On 2005-07-16 14:15:27, scotsboyuk wrote:
I suppose a valid question would be what justification they find in Islam for their actions though. They appear to root their beliefs and actions in Islam. What is it that they are using to do that?
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Some people seem to find justification in their "Christianity" for invading two sovereign nations (one of which happens to have the world's second largest oil reserves - a desperately needed commodity by the invaders) and murder 100,000 innocent civilians. 'Islamic' 'terrorists' have a long way to go before they match that level of atrocity.
Perhaps the 'Christians' do it because they hate Islamic values and the Islamic way of life?
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Perhaps they do, but then I was asking about Muslims and not Christians. I am more familiar with the Christian religion, hence why I didn't include it in my enquiry.
@amnesia
I have to say that that is something I don't agree with. 'An eye for an eye' is a policy I can never agree with, it implies vengeance, which is something that is in contrast with my own beliefs.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
PeterKay
Joined: Jul 08, 2003
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From: The Ummah
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On 2005-07-16 13:49:41, scotsboyuk wrote:
@PeterKay
Is that your quote from islam from today?  Would you like to nominate tomorrow's religion?
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Yep that was my quote, for tomorrow i would like to hear from any other religion bitte.
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amnesia
Joined: Jan 15, 2004
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From: Doha, London, Tokyo, Shanghai
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@scots, why does it have to be related to vengance?
To avenge means that someone will be satisfied.
An eye for an eye in law is to deter crimes, the government feel no satisfaction in harming another brother in religion.
So if someone were to kill someone and they are killed as punishment and it prevents further deaths then you cant call this vengance, perhaps retribution to an extent to some people's opinion, but nothing more than a way of upholding the legal system and as I said detering further crime.
I hate it when people say that a murderer should have rights.
When a person kills another, they took away that persons right, so theirs should be taken as well
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scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
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From: UK
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@amnesia
I can't say that I agree with that sentiment. To me a person is a person.
I posted this the other day, but it is quite apt here I think:
The sage does not distinguish between himself and the world;
The needs of other people are as his own.
He is good to those who are good;
He is also good to those who are not good,
Thereby he is good.
He trusts those who are trustworthy;
He also trusts those who are not trustworthy,
Thereby he is trustworthy.
The sage lives in harmony with the world,
And his mind is the world's mind.
So he nurtures the worlds of others
As a mother does her children.
My beliefs tell me that the best way to combat suffering IS with kindness and compassion.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
Sammy_boy
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
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From: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
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I read in this morning's Sunday Express an article reportedly from a Muslim who had been close to Al Quieda and the terrorist cause and had met and done things with Bin Laden's number two (whose name escapes me), that said that most Muslims were basically 'silent terrorists'. Meaning that many Muslims have a sympathy with the terrorists after things like the Iraq war, percieved support for Israel and not for Palestinians in the occupied territories, and that that silent refusal to denounce that attacks as meaning they supported terrorism.
It also stated that many Imams publicly denounced and said they didn't condone violence and terrorism to avoid revenge attacks then secretly carry on supporting the terrorist cause. It went on to mention that Islam, or at least the way it is taught says that all non-Muslims are to be killed! 
There was a separate article in that paper (the Express seems to be a bit anti-Muslim today! ) complaining about the Muslim community's lack of integration into British society and isolationism may also be causing trouble.
BEFORE I'M FLAMED I'm not saying I agree with this, I am interested to get PeterKay and other Esato Muslim's opinions on this article - are there any shreds of truth in it, or is it yet another example of the British tabloid press being islamophobic and zenophobic? Have any of you come across terrorist/Al Quieda sympathisers in your local Mosque/community?
I hope this post isn't off topic, or either inflammatory or derogoratory, I apologise if it is.
"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke
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axxxr
Joined: Mar 21, 2003
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From: Londinium
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sammy_boy that article in the sunday express is the biggest pile of bull ever ive ever heard....nowhere in Islam does it state that all non-muslims have to be killed!...The Mail and the Express have always been islamophobic and zenophobic even long before 9/11...so im not surprised by this..These days they will blame anything and everything on Islam to try to make it look like a evil religion.
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02
Joined: Sep 24, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: UK Birmingham
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@Sammy_boy
who control ur life my dear fren?? the DailyNews!! Knowing u've been reading this post and yet the Media has taken control ur mind.. very sad.. looks like the Media is not supporting the world, but causing anger to people example, Sammy_boy. I feel sorry for the future to come..
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Sammy_boy
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
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From: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
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On 2005-07-17 17:10:46, 02 wrote:
@Sammy_boy
who control ur life my dear fren?? the DailyNews!! Knowing u've been reading this post and yet the Media has taken control ur mind.. very sad.. looks like the Media is not supporting the world, but causing anger to people example, Sammy_boy. I feel sorry for the future to come..
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I didn't say I believed it - I just posted what it said, and asked a few questions to others here to get their viewpoint and opinions on such items in the national press.
I do certainly take your point about the media and how it can control people's opinions..... you can see that every day!
Articles like that will certainly help fan the flames of hate and revenge against Moslems, it makes me worry that there may be more race riots in the future like there were a couple of years ago in Burnley 
"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke
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Posted: 2005-07-16 15:59
