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Sony Ericsson XPERIA X1 discussion |
_vAmpiRe_
Joined: Feb 04, 2008
Posts: 84
From: Norway
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@aksd:
Thnx for clearing that out... But this is then based on white-paper-spec, and not real-life performance? | |
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Dogmann
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: London England
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@se dude
You know what it would be a good idea if you followed your own advice and checked facts before hitting post.
First point is the E90 has 800x352 4" 16 million colour internal screen. The X1's screen is 3/4 this size.
Secondly the E90 has a 1500aMh Li-Polymer battery.
Ram has no bearing on Multimedia playback as although the E90 only has 128mb Ram it has up to 90mb Ram free and more than enough to allow Multimedia playback. The reason why the X1 has more Ram is it needs it to run the Panles and Touch Flo it will have a very similar amount of free Ram after boot up.
As for this
"528Mhz Qualcomm 7210 processor.Yea, its much better than your OMAP 2xxx pro.Please check a few review sites before nosing in."
I suggest again you check these facts as this is just not true although the OMAP 2420 runs at a slower clock rate it is fast enough for the Symbian OS and the Power VR MBX is far more powerful for graphics than anything the Qualcomm processor can produce and that is a fact.
Same goes for the HSDPA and Touchscreen neither of these have anything to do Multimedia playback. So yes whilst the faster HSDPA speed is of course good and a Touchscreen is down to preference it has nothing to do with Multimedia does it?
As taken form the X1 white paper the X1 offers
MPEG4:30fps@VGA*
H263:30fps @ VGA*
H264:15fps@VGA*
*US Models support MPEG4 H.263 24fps encoding@QVGA only and not H.264
Which means it is only @ 30fps VGA in 3gpp which is an inferior codec to H.264
Compare this with the E90 that gives 30fps VGA MPEG4 H.264 at up to 640 x 480 for both recording and playback and it is clear to see which has the superior Multimedia abilities.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-08-18 22:49 ] |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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On 2008-08-18 20:19:08, aksd wrote:
On 2008-08-18 19:19:14, _vAmpiRe_ wrote:
@se_dude:
correction: X1 has 800x480, not 640x480 display...
@Dogmann:
How do you know that the e90 has support for higher bitrates than the X1? Just curious...
Basically the PowerVR accelerator is better. The Qualcomm QTv solution for video playback is'nt as great as most hoped. This can be seen from the Diamond and Pro. It plays most DVD rips, but sometimes struggles with higher bitrates. Forget using WM player, that wont work, you'll have to use TPCMP or Coreplayer to get decent performance.
@Max
I think you'll see quite a few dead zone device next year, with Qualcomms Snapdragon, Nvidia 2500 and the OMAP3 series of processors, all of them multimedia oriented and any of them on a WM7 phone would put it bang in the middle of the dead zone. Plus we have to see what Android has to offer.
it's true, and I wait with baited breath to see what devices come about. My interest is that they will get smaller and smaller, as I've mentioned I'd like something roughly the size of a K850 but in sideways slide formfactor and thinner but still falling into the dead zone spec-wise. It seems now as if they coouldn't get any smaller, but just compare a touch pro or x1 against one of the original Nokia Communicators and it's easy to believe that miniturisation hasn't reached a dead end yet.
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WhyBe
Joined: Apr 02, 2008
Posts: > 500
From: Ohio, USA
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@Dogmann
Why do you always compare the X1a (U.S. model) to the e90. Why not the X1i since it isn't hindered by legal restrictions?
Another thing you're forgeting when praising the e90's supposed capabilities is: Who cares? No one is standing in line to get that dinosaur 
@all
I think what matters most is how any given device performs in the real world. Splitting hairs over chipset specs is kind of meaningless if the device does not give a great user experience. I've seen no indication of the X1 failing multimedia-wise and I am confident it won't fail user-experience-wise. |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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I agree, I don't think the X1 will disappoint by any means. It's a shame that it doesn't have video out, but even in the dead zone, most buyers don't want everything and are more interested in form factor and usability over minute details of spec. Unless someone specifically needs tv out for a particular purpose, it's unlikely the lack of it will be a significant hindrance to buying it.
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drgopoos
Joined: Dec 02, 2004
Posts: 307
From: Toronto
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I am no big nokia fan, but yes loves WM for what it offers.
But then i have never seen a WM play video as good as any of the symbian or UIQ handsets...
E90 has very good multimedia capabilities( I love the screen) but does not meet the PDA standards of WM
what i expect from x1 is a good WM device with good mutimedia capability (looking forward for a good camera )... |
carkitter
Joined: Apr 29, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Auckland, NZ
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On 2008-08-18 18:32:44, Dogmann wrote:
Hi all,...
...There is always a trade off between one set of features to the other and is an enforced segmentation of the market as it is the manufacturers that make them this way. Why i don't know as it seems so many of us are actually frustrated by these actions but as consumers so far there is little we can do about it. We are forced to find the best compromise of features that suits us best in our devices.
The evolution of high speed mobile data along with reasonable fixed price data plans has most certainly improved the uptake and use of mobile data. Along with the faster processors and improved graphics on our devices and of course continually improving screen technology. This means that now our mobile experience is one of high quality it is no longer painfully slow and in poor quality and the next set of advancements will once again greatly improve what is delivered on our devices and take up a level.
There is plenty of room for a variety of devices either with or without touch screens or full QWERTY and a range of different sizes and styles. I really don't believe their will be one dominant OS or form factor for all. Choice is a good thing so all of us may find the device that suits our individual needs best as is competition that will improve the specs and drive down the prices. It has taken a very long time for Mobile data to get to where it is now but now it is truly able to start delivering on it's promise IMO and exciting times are just around the corner as the tech starts to fully deliver a fast and rich experience to us the user.
I beg to differ on these three points:
Frustratingly for us, manufacturers work hard to avoid the dead zone with most of thier products; SE have made an art of it! 
For the mainstream consumers (read voice and text) price drops, data speeds and devices will make very little difference to them and this is probably why you and I have to wait so long to get reliable, economic mobile data. Only you and I will pay extra for it - here comes that dead zone again... 
The market for all non voice/text devices is only 36% as Mace's research says so there is not much market for Xperia, P-series, S60, Cybershot,  ,ROKR, Vertu, WM, Android, Apple, RIM, Palm + others to fight over. ATM  are being pushed out of the bed, if they get back in with more appealing devices (for the mainstream not the dead zone) then someone else will fall out IMO.
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[ This Message was edited by: carkitter on 2008-08-19 04:29 ] |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
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From: Australia
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On 2008-08-19 04:47:25, carkitter wrote:
Frustratingly for us, manufacturers work hard to avoid the dead zone with most of thier products; SE have made an art of it!
unfortunately you are very right there. As I've said before, I think this is good business on SE's part, but not so good for us dead zone customers.
I don't begrudge SE this, especially since I don't think Nokia are doing much better either.
My personal view is that as operator's loosen up the purse strings on data costs, dead zone devices will become more broadly appealing. Then everyone will want to be able to do all or a large subset of the following: send emails with 2mb attachments without being restrained on cost, browse full websites, download applications and music and videos, access ftp servers, use vpn to access work servers, maintain social networking and media sites such as flickr, access database servers, etc etc.
So I do think the dead zone will diminish as data costs reduce. I don't think Mace believed this was the case, because he doesn't believe operators will give up trying to value add to their networks, but personally I strongly believe data use will not be seriously taken up by consumers until it is cheap or just part of the service. In the long run, operators will HAVE to virtually give it away simply as a way to keep customers from moving to the competition. At that point the cost (the realistic cost not the inflated cost we have now) will simply be incorporated into standard phone plans.
Of course there will be limits, and large data plans will always be separately costed, but the average user will be able to do their music downloads, work vpn connections etc all within their standard plans.
Then and only then will OEM's start to really compete on the AIO front.
We are currently in the starting phase of this movement, and that's why we are starting to see more competition on the AIO front, and why SE have developed the X1 (and why Nokia are developing the touchscreen at last)
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carkitter
Joined: Apr 29, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Auckland, NZ
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I think you're right about Mobile Data, it will need to be free eventually or else takeup will not improve very much over the current niche market. Even in my IT classes at Uni there are very few people exploring Mobile Data. There are alot of stylish, expensive phones that just text and play music...
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NightBlade
Joined: Jul 29, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Nessebar, Bulgaria
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Have you guys seen this comparison between the X1 and the Touch Pro?
http://smape.com/en/reviews//[....]y_Ericsson_XPERIA_X1-prev.html
Funny how they are in favour of the Touch Pro when the X1 has slightly better specs and is 150 euros cheaper.
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[ This Message was edited by: NightBlade on 2008-08-19 09:54 ] |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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On 2008-08-19 08:10:33, max_wedge wrote:
On 2008-08-19 04:47:25, carkitter wrote:
Frustratingly for us, manufacturers work hard to avoid the dead zone with most of thier products; SE have made an art of it!
unfortunately you are very right there. As I've said before, I think this is good business on SE's part, but not so good for us dead zone customers.
I don't begrudge SE this, especially since I don't think Nokia are doing much better either.
My personal view is that as operator's loosen up the purse strings on data costs, dead zone devices will become more broadly appealing. Then everyone will want to be able to do all or a large subset of the following: send emails with 2mb attachments without being restrained on cost, browse full websites, download applications and music and videos, access ftp servers, use vpn to access work servers, maintain social networking and media sites such as flickr, access database servers, etc etc.
So I do think the dead zone will diminish as data costs reduce. I don't think Mace believed this was the case, because he doesn't believe operators will give up trying to value add to their networks, but personally I strongly believe data use will not be seriously taken up by consumers until it is cheap or just part of the service. In the long run, operators will HAVE to virtually give it away simply as a way to keep customers from moving to the competition. At that point the cost (the realistic cost not the inflated cost we have now) will simply be incorporated into standard phone plans.
Of course there will be limits, and large data plans will always be separately costed, but the average user will be able to do their music downloads, work vpn connections etc all within their standard plans.
Then and only then will OEM's start to really compete on the AIO front.
We are currently in the starting phase of this movement, and that's why we are starting to see more competition on the AIO front, and why SE have developed the X1 (and why Nokia are developing the touchscreen at last)
What constitute an AIO depends on which angle you look.  At this stage (for most people anyway), an AIO is a phone with great camera, music player, multimedia, email, web and maybe gps. I highly doubt a qwerty or a touchscreen are over-riding factors in determining an AIO.
I always have the inklings that qwerty is desired only by the above 30's generation who has not gone thru the messaging craze like the situation now. For youngsters (or those young at heart) nowadays, I bet many can type faster with T9 than thumbing with a qwerty or scribbling with a stylus.
Touchscreen has not really taken off until Iphone. But it is too early to tell whether it can be sustained. It may just be like the passing craze that was when the first touch PDA came out.
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carkitter
Joined: Apr 29, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: Auckland, NZ
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The table says the X1 is 150 euro cheaper but it could be a typo as the text near the end says the HTC is 100 euro cheaper and available now not Feb (maybe) like the X1. This is probably what infuenced the decision in what is "not a review but a collection of thoughts...".
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aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: UK, India
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The smape reviews are some of the most ill informed reviews I have read. He mentions the X1 does'nt have hardware acceleration, anyone who is supposedly involved in the industry would know that VGA@30fps video recording would not be possible without hardware acceleration. As well as playback.
The X1 having better specs than the Pro is not completely true though. One gains where the other looses and vice versa.
The pricing of the X1 is out? I think the X1 will be a bit more expensive than the Pro. The Pro has released and ususally for the first month it will have a premium price should stabilize at about 400 pounds while the X1 should be a bit more expensive, better materials used.
@mib
I really doubt the iPhone has brought about a touch craze, the market was heading towards touch oriented phones anyway. If you notice the HTC Touch launched before the iPhone and the development cycle of a phone is generall 1.5-2 yrs. So basically other manufacturers were already thinking along the lines of having mainstream touch oriented phones. No doubt the iPhone has accelerated demand for touch screens, but it by no means created the demand. Several users bought UIQ over S60 and still do because of the touch screen, these users I'm sure have bought it out of personal requirement rather than buying it 'cause the iPhone is touch based lol
imo an All in one device will cater to different input needs as well, not just the usual cam, multimedia etc. A touch screen is a must as well as a hardware qwerty keyboard. The ultimate all in one device must be more like a pocketable computer.
[ This Message was edited by: aksd on 2008-08-19 10:25 ] |
Dogmann
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: London England
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@WhyBe
Do you really have that much trouble reading clearly that is the information for the X1 as taken from the SE white paper with the X1a differences highlighted below it.
We have discussed this many times before and it was only due to se dude posting complete and utter rubbish that it needed clarifying once again.
Very true no one is standing in line for an E90 as we have been able to buy and use them for over a Year and very happily at that. It may not be a device for you but for many of us it is as good as it gets for now and has served me perfectly for over 8 months. Hopefully soon you will get your X1 in the real world and we can all see just how well that performs compared to your expectations.
@Nightblade
Every where but in the comparison chart it says the X1 is the more expensive and that seems to be the case at most resellers to. With confirmed prices of the Touch Pro being lower than the expected selling price of the X1.
That was a good article and it seems there really isn't much to choose between the two devices with a couple of positives to each device over it's rival. The only thing being people can and are buying the Touch Pro now as opposed to still waiting for the X1. I also wonder just how many will value the Keyboard above other features when making there decision, but by this time next year we will see which sold more and was more successful.
Marc
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Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Seven, Tom Tom 6
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-08-19 10:37 ] |
plankgatan
Joined: May 20, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Sweden fur alle
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question... when does or some other company starts to use Nvidia mobile GPU ???? (or is it allready there ??)
im also a HUGH Nvidia fan ...he he
((OC.ing & tweaking my Nvidia cards is a dear hobby ))
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[ This Message was edited by: plankgatan on 2008-08-19 10:37 ] | |
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Posted: 2008-08-18 21:19
