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Sony Ericsson XPERIA X1 discussion |
aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
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@WhyBe
We'll you have mentioned that the specs are like nothing seen before, and thats what got all the hackles up  . Just like the iPhone having specs never seen before, the UI is great it caused a UI revolution in the touchscreen world etc.. but windows answer to that is WM7. You can hope and pray all you want that you'd never see the underlying WM shell, but its just not possible, any WM user can tell you that, and from your posts I gather you do not program which isnt really an issue, but thats why you dont understand that the WM interface cannot be altered in anyway at the core level, and nor can there be a hybrid SDK for SE phones unless SE has a framework where apps can install on that, but this might not be the case looking at the videos, similar type apps have been present(not identical but along the same line with less eyecandy though) task managers that show screenshots of all open programs on the home screen, its called Dynamo 2. And what I've been trying to tell you is if you expect something iPhonish prepare to be disappointed, even the Diamonds thing is a today screen plugin only, some people got an early release of it running on their TyTnII. And I said it once I'll say it again, the iPhone type UI you are searching for will not be present in the X1 at release it will be present however in WM7 whcih will be available for the X1 either through offical or un-offical means (hopefully at least)
I dont suppose you've read my earlier posts on this thread have you? Look past pg 77 or something, lots of good debates from my end pro X1 and a few white papers you can read up on before debating . Basically did you see what happened regarding the SE paris, people are at a point that they;d practically hang the phone if it could be hung because of all the hype. And some people take what they read on these forums as the gospel truth so..........
I'd like to think I'm more of a phone pro as its been part of my education as well as hobby and future career, so I like to think that I know my stuff, I apologise if I come off to aggressive but I'm a wee bit too passionate about cellphone tech in general(no theres nothing mentally wrong with me  , been checked by several docs ). I
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aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
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On 2008-05-15 20:54:47, WhyBe wrote:
Here is some (paraphrased?) info from HTC (concerning complaints about the TyTnII video driver issue):
To address lingering questions about HTC's current MSM 7xxx devices, it is important to establish that a chipset like an MSM7xxx is a platform with a vast multitude of features that enable a wide range of devices with varied functionality. It is common that devices built on platforms like Qualcomm's will not enable every feature or function.
In addition to making sure the required hardware is present, unlocking extended capabilities of chipsets like the MSM 7xxx requires in-depth and time consuming software development, complicated licensing negotiations, potential intellectual property negotiations, added licensing fees, and in the case of devices that are sold through operators, the desire of the operator to include the additional functionality. To make an informed decision about which handset suits them best, consumers should look at the product specification itself instead of using the underlying chipset specifications to define what the product could potentially become.
This could give insight as to why the X1 doesn't have TV out and also, what's taking  so long.
Please don't confuse this as a statement of HTC "really" making the X1.
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-05-15 20:01 ]
You actually believe that drivel ? Thats HTC speak, btw that was concerning the Drivers, which is a bit difficult to implement once the final product is ready, for an induvidual that is, but for a corporation, no way, and TV_out implementation is'nt as difficult as that either , also ususally lead time(dev time) on a phone is usually 1.5yrs, dont tell me they need more than that to imlement 2 tiny features after putting together the X1. You can make all the excuses you want for the company . Its like, when you buy a car and the head lights dont work, and you're like why? They're like we never mentioned that the head lights work and it would take us too long to make the necessary connections.
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[ This Message was edited by: aksd on 2008-05-15 20:21 ] |
imranbashir
Joined: May 05, 2008
Posts: 28
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On 2008-05-15 17:29:05, aksd wrote:
2. CHange WM completely and that is happening, WM7 first devices expected end of 2008 from MwG, I'm sure the current gen phones such as the X1 and diamond will get Wm7 upgrades(recent video was shown with the TOuch Cruise running WM7)
@aksd,
Do you have a link to the video of WM7 running on a Touch cruise, I would really like to see it.
@WhyBe,
I’m afraid that you lack of experience with WM devices is obvious. I agree with aksd that you will only have a panels interface, a camera interface, and that’s about it on the X1. It’s not I don’t want more, if they could improve it then great. But I highly doubt it.
I know I have been refereeing to HTC a lot, but hear me out, the original HTC Touch was HTC’s first attempt to hide the WM interface, and it was way too shallow, you managed to get to the windows interface far too quickly. TouchFLO 3D is much better at covering up the interface, but to get this far HTC has had three attempts.
I don’t see how you can expect SE, with no experience of WM to do the same on their first attempt. Don’t get me wrong, if they do it then kudos, but I’ll be pessimistic, where as your very optimistic, I do hope the X1 lives up to your expectations. Your right about something at least, this is the place to get excited about the X1! |
aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
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From: UK, India
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Did I say Cruise, sorry my mistake , its the Touch Dual, my mistake, its just for a few seconds in the new Windows Live Mesh video, it at least looks like WM7 colour scheme and all .
http://www.engadgetmobile.com[....]-in-microsoft-live-mesh-video/
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imranbashir
Joined: May 05, 2008
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Your not wrong when you said a few seconds! I do hope wm7 lives up to the hype... |
WhyBe
Joined: Apr 02, 2008
Posts: > 500
From: Ohio, USA
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Well I guess we all have to wait until the release of the X1 to see what's really going to be there, huh?
My feeling is if a lot of the WM flaws can be tweaked and enhanced by third party apps, there is no reason couldn't implement the same strategy in designing their X1 software. I don't buy the argument that doesn't have WM experience. is a company, not a person. It's as simple as hiring programmers with the skills required for the job. There is a very real reason the X1 is not released yet, even though the hardware is complete, software! If they were just going to give us the X1 hardware with the panels plopped on top of WM6.1, then it would be released already.
What I am talking about does not require the remaking and restructuring of WM (even though many would welcome that). It's about X1 having it's own suite of well made, intuitive applications with a generous helping of eye candy thrown in. If this can be done with a picture browser, it can be done with a phone dialer. It can be done with a contacts manager. It can be done with.......and so on. This only takes DEVELOPMENT TIME on 's part, not a new version of WM. As I've stated before, if one chooses to run third party apps (I'm assuming most will), then it's back to WM world, of course. |
Dogmann
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: London England
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Hi WhyBe
You really think it's that simple are you totally oblivious to what has happened with UIQ since the UIQ3 launch and the P990 a platform SE has worked on for a long time and is now even a 50% owner of?
If your view of how easy it is to optimize a device is on any platform was we would all be walking around with perfect devices right now. Which in case you hadn't noticed none of us our.
Please explain how or why you think that SE with HTC and Microsoft on their first collaboration are going to be able to deliver what you think, on a brand new OS as well just to complicate things further. As hopefully it will be good but perfect i seriously doubt.
But as already pointed out as far as being a Multimedia Monster it is missing out full 30fps VGA H.264 and mainly supports 3gp.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-05-16 00:52 ] |
WhyBe
Joined: Apr 02, 2008
Posts: > 500
From: Ohio, USA
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@Dogmann
I have said nothing that is impossible or out of reach from any company willing to devote the resources.
Is releasing a product with a well made suite of custom applications unattainable? Give me a break.
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-05-16 01:16 ] |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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Let's face it. No matter what HTC/SE do to hide WM, it would not give the same total touch screen experience that Iphone or the future S60 Touch/WM7 can provide.
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Keiki
Joined: Mar 27, 2008
Posts: 160
From: Valhalla
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Hmm i just read some articles HERE
People at akihabaranews says their test unit is faster than proto @3GSM
And they put some UI pictures too
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aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
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On 2008-05-16 00:52:08, WhyBe wrote:
What I am talking about does not require the remaking and restructuring of WM (even though many would welcome that). It's about X1 having it's own suite of well made, intuitive applications with a generous helping of eye candy thrown in. If this can be done with a picture browser, it can be done with a phone dialer. It can be done with a contacts manager. It can be done with.......and so on. This only takes DEVELOPMENT TIME on 's part, not a new version of WM. As I've stated before, if one chooses to run third party apps (I'm assuming most will), then it's back to WM world, of course.
The pics of the dialer on the test unit was similar to the HTC dialer . And it will be done with all those apps you have mentioned, if not there are 3rd party apps to do the same. BUT every time you need to close a program, or a dialog box pops up its the same old WM OS. No matter what SE does, other than rewrite the WM OS its still going to be a pain to use single handedly, maybe a bit less of a pain but still a pain. A manufactueres only aim is to make the product market ready tothe least extent and then release, they're not going to spend months perfecting it, especially SE. I'm sure you'll realise that once it is actually out.
But the software shortcomings are not really shortcomings, like I said when you buy WM, you get updates, apps etc. And assuming from the hardware I think it should be ready for WM7 as well. So it should abe a good enjoyable buy(due to the WM modders).
On 2008-05-16 02:13:59, WhyBe wrote:
@Dogmann
I have said nothing that is impossible or out of reach from any company willing to devote the resources.
Is releasing a product with a well made suite of custom applications unattainable? Give me a break.
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-05-16 01:16 ]
Have you seen a company working from the inside? I'm sure you have'nt, many of us have worked closely or in a cellphone company and thats what we base our views on. They do the basic minimum and not more than what its required. Really not their fault as they're in it for the profit. Thats where the devs come in. And if they made the phone perfect then devs dont get work. Its not as simple as you think.
[ This Message was edited by: aksd on 2008-05-16 04:10 ] |
WhyBe
Joined: Apr 02, 2008
Posts: > 500
From: Ohio, USA
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Have you seen a company working from the inside? I'm sure you have'nt, many of us have worked closely or in a cellphone company and thats what we base our views on. They do the basic minimum and not more than what its required. Really not their fault as they're in it for the profit. Thats where the devs come in. And if they made the phone perfect then devs dont get work. Its not as simple as you think.
This principal applies to ALL industries, not just cellphone companies.
Why don't you guys go to S60 or UIQ or iPhone since WM has you so jaded? |
aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
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@WhyBe
I love WM. But its not what you're making it out to be. All I'm doing is pointing that out to you. I've never once mentioned that WM is a bad OS, if you read my previous posts on this thread I've had several arguments with Dogmann and mib regarding that WM is a more "powerful" OS and more dev friendly OS than Symbian.
You misunderstand the point I am trying to make. Bascially all i want to do is clear the misconception that SE are going to release a ground breaking product, with a UI that blows everything else away, that is not the case.
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WhyBe
Joined: Apr 02, 2008
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From: Ohio, USA
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OK, maybe not blow everything else away on the scale of iPhone, but I have the feeling that is making a worthy attempt to blow away every other WM phone by taking a few UI cues from Apple. From the available info and press releases, it seems as if , at least, understands that USER EXPERIENCE (thus the name 'XPERIA') is key to making a great mobile. Most of the user experience is brought about by software...no? Great hardware alone is not sufficient. So it is also a bonus that X1 is also a well thought out, powerful piece of hardware too. So this great experience brought about by software isn't WM6.1, we all know. It must be 's own included applications.
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-05-16 05:25 ] |
aksd
Joined: Nov 11, 2005
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On 2008-05-16 06:17:27, WhyBe wrote:
OK, maybe not blow everything else away on the scale of iPhone, but I have the feeling that is making a worthy attempt to blow away every other WM phone by taking a few UI cues from Apple. From the available info and press releases, it seems as if , at least, understands that USER EXPERIENCE (thus the name 'XPERIA') is key to making a great mobile. Most of the user experience is brought about by software...no? Great hardware alone is not sufficient. So it is also a bonus that X1 is also a well thought out, powerful piece of hardware too.
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-05-16 05:20 ]
We'll similar programs to make things finger friendly already exist, although not as flashy as SE's panels. You can check http://www.pointui.com or SPB Mobile SHell at http://www.spbsoftwarehouse.com and of course imo the Diamond plugin is far nicer than SE's implementation but thats just my opinion(and its possible it might be able to port it to the X1, but it take a horrendous amount of RAM 40MB I heard). SE are not the first ones with this idea, first was HTC( a year ago), then came Asus/Gigabyte theres not much publicity for those companies as they're not as big as SE, and their products might or might not be better than SEs, that we can say only after launch. The Asus one seems quite nice, a 3D cube that rotates and some other stuff.
In WM great hardware is sufficent as generally many WM users strip off what the OEM gives us and put our own personalized stuff in. I rememeber a few memebrs posting that they;re first going to disable the panels , but thats just down to personal preference.
The hardware is good, its not amazing, I expcted the next gen Qualcomm processors this year  as HTC claimed that they;re going to release the QUalcomm Snapdragon, a 1Ghz processor based phone. The processor tech is quite last year with a change in die size so that it could get clocked a little faster. Evedently the qualcomm processor has'nt really proved it self yet.
Just because SE claim its targeted at overall experiene does'nt mean it will actually be that amazing an experience. I think thats whats called Marketing hype, and SE are famous for not delivering on their promises
[ This Message was edited by: aksd on 2008-05-16 05:35 ] | |
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Posted: 2008-05-15 21:14
