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Have Sony Ericsson finally taken the lead in global mobile phone solutions? |
slattery69
Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: north east england
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my 2p worth is the k750/w800 are evolution not revolution. they are the natural progression for the t610 and k700.
i dont think that the technology is particularly advanced but is in keeping with what the market requires over the next 12-18 months.
for me se biggest problem is getting in the message to consumers that they need there brand and the functions it provides. this is were i feel se has often been a let down, i sometimes feel they dont truly understand how to reach potential consumers and often end up looking very high brow.its nice to carve a niche in the market but you still need sales to help drive you to keep raising the bar.
i am looking forward to the new phones but wont be getting to excited till i see them in action, claims on battery life and camera quality are just specs on paper at the moment and until the phones are delivered and meet the specs then i shall just sit back and wait | |
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mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
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On 2005-03-10 17:44:23, Arez wrote:
90% of the people that are using nokias smartphones donīt know how to use them...they just buy them because theyīre form nokia and they do what they expect in a phone nowadays (photos, mms, video, games)...so, i see no point in SE turning and start launching a massive amount of cheap UIQ phones...one model could be ok, because thereīs a niche market for it
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like you say many people bought a Nokia smartphone without knowing they bought a smartphone. So this group of buyers would have compared the Nokia's with others like S700/K700 before buying. Who knows, maybe they bought the nokia's because it has more functions.
So in effect, you cannot isolate Nokia smartphones to its niche category. K750 when it comes out will compete with 6230i as well as all the Nokia smartphones. Put the K750 next to a series60 smartphone, well, the K750 looks quite mediocre. |
batesie
Joined: Feb 13, 2004
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From: London, UK
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most nokia owners i know, buy new nokias as they "can just text like they can on their old nokia" - basically they cant be bothered to learn a new UI.
[addsig] |
scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
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From: UK
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On 2005-03-10 18:13:15, mib1800 wrote:
like you say many people bought a Nokia smartphone without knowing they bought a smartphone. So this group of buyers would have compared the Nokia's with others like S700/K700 before buying. Who knows, maybe they bought the nokia's because it has more functions.
So in effect, you cannot isolate Nokia smartphones to its niche category. K750 when it comes out will compete with 6230i as well as all the Nokia smartphones. Put the K750 next to a series60 smartphone, well, the K750 looks quite mediocre.
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You are making a false comparison in that you are assuming that customers would have been comparing handsets; this does not take into account the large number of customers who buy Nokia because that is their default.
Your comparison would be more accurate if you placed limitations upon it. For example, one could say that those buying a K700/S700 compared it with a Nokia smartphone and decided that they didn't want all those extra features.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
goldenface
Joined: Dec 17, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Liverpool City Centre
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But what is the point of comparing phones from two different categories? What does that prove? 
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nimbuz
Joined: Dec 18, 2004
Posts: 23
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Doubtlessly, YES!
But as for a new phone user, Nokia or other Flashy looking phone is more preferable because of its user-friendliness and exquisite design.
Simply, Nokia is like Windows whereas Sony is like Linux, more advanced, more excellent features, power-packed. But a new user fails to see the difference or say he doesnt want to compare the features, he just wants to buy the phone thats very commonly seen.
Thankfully, I've chosen Sony K700i and I agree its the best phone available in its category. |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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On 2005-03-10 18:09:57, scotsboyuk wrote:
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On 2005-03-10 17:56:54, mib1800 wrote:
@scotsboyuk
it is true i am into smartphone. to me, if you can make a phone do like what a computer can do is definitely more advanced in technology than a phone that perform like a calculator. it is obvious (to me at least) that it is much more difficult to come out with a smartphone than a normal phone.
i am not saying that K750 is low tech. all i am saying it is too early to pop the champagne yet. Well, you can if you r comparing it to 6230i. But then, this would be a hollow victory.
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Here we have the crux of the misconception. I am equally as appreciative of advanced technology and I like handsets that can do all sorts of things besides making phone calls, but one has to realise that that isn't an appropriate means of comparison in judging what is better.
One can only judge a handset within the context it was was intended for. One cannot compare the T68i and the P900 and say that the T68i is rubbish because one would be taking it out of context. Similarly one cannot compare a smartphone and a non-smartphone because they are intended for different purposes; for different people. If someone wants a smartphone then they will buy one, if they don't then they won't.
I would not compare a supercomputer with an abacus because it is just plain silly. SE has decided that their target market does not want smartphones, so they produce them to cater for a niche market, whilst aiming the majority of their products at a wider consumer base.
Nokia are simply so much larger that they can produce lots of handsets and target every market sector. SE can't do this, so they specialise, hence the reason that direct comparisons are not very productive.
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"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC
[ This Message was edited by: scotsboyuk on 2005-03-10 17:15 ]
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i dont quite agree with you here. if the trends continues, Nokia will sell something like 20-30million smartphone this year. this is a huge number. As was brought out, many of these who bought do not need a smartphone but they still buy one and these people will be lost customers for SE K750/S700.
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slattery69
Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: north east england
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On 2005-03-10 18:19:33, goldenface wrote:
But what is the point of comparing phones from two different categories? What does that prove?
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i do get your point but people buy with cash and there eyes. you maybe right but most buyers dont look and its a smartphone its not a smartphone.
they walk into a shop with x amount of pounds to spend and are faced with options. i think that nokia is just better a communitcating a phone s ablity to its customers and making them feel they need the features.
to often se over complicate things and consumers get lost in the tech arguement.
i dont belive that se has to challenge nokia but over the next few years they cant stay in position 6 as it will hurt there long term ablity to survive. imho they need to but getting to at least 4 with the ablity to be in touching distance of samsung and motorola.
i dont think sony formed a partnership/takeover with ericsson to say a no6. sony like to be leaders and will want to try to get to a postion of at least top 3, if they dont i could see them trying to form partnerships with another company ie samsung to achieve there goals
[ This Message was edited by: slattery69 on 2005-03-10 18:01 ] |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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@scotsboyuk
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| You are making a false comparison in that you are assuming that customers would have been comparing handsets; this does not take into account the large number of customers who buy Nokia because that is their default.
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i think it is too naive to think a large number that bought a high-end phones do not do any evaluation at all. Maybe it will be true in low-end. |
phsychomantis
Joined: Jan 24, 2005
Posts: 146
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It seems that royalty story is not true however nokia did try to cheat and buy psion's share to take control of symbian but their plan was foiled by sony ericsson
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mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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On 2005-03-10 18:16:13, batesie wrote:
most nokia owners i know, buy new nokias as they "can just text like they can on their old nokia" - basically they cant be bothered to learn a new UI.
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these people is not in the market category that we r debating as they will be unlikely to pay a higher price for a premium phone |
ares
Joined: Dec 11, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Coimbra, Portugal
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Quote:
| Put the K750 next to a series60 smartphone, well, the K750 looks quite mediocre. |
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@Mib1800, care to express in what??
k750 is very small and light
fullscreen video
advanced stereo mp3/acc player
2 megapixel autofocus camera
java 3d games
radio with rds
MS support to 2gb
Advanced animated OS
Instant Messenger
JAVA APIs for acessing BT and PIM functions
So, can you please tell me in what s60 phones are more advanced??
I know you can install may apps in s60 phones - but i donīt need them, and so does most of the people. In fact, many s60 users become bored of all those apps they never use after a few months
Go ahead mib, iīm waiting
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[ This Message was edited by: Arez on 2005-03-10 18:15 ] |
scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
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From: UK
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@mib1800
Even taking your top figure of 30 million, that still only constitutes approximately 10% of Nokia's total sales last year. If we factor in how many people actually utilise the smartphone features of such handsets I think we would be looking at a relatively small number of people compared with the total numbe rof people who actually bought a mobile phone last year.
Like it or not, smartphones are not a major market force yet. Your attempts at trying to compare Nokia's Series 60 smartphones with handsets such as the K700 are futile, the comparisons simply do not hold up.
The vast majority of customers look for the basics when buying a handset e.g. phone calls. texting and more often these days a camera. Smartphone capabilities are useless to most people, hence the reason that most manufacturers do not produce more than a few models.
If you are trying to say that people who go to buy a mobile are comparing something like the K700 with a Series 60 handset then they probably are, but not in the way you are suggesting. Once people have looked at the basic criteria they judge with their eyes; they choose the handset, which looks best. This is the most basic rule of selling, make the product look good.
If you think that people are going through each handset's specifications point by point and comparing their abilities to handle Word documents then you are mistaken, most people do not care. Nokia's smartphone sales are almost certainly due, in a large part, to people just liking the look of the phone and the fact that it is a Nokia, which they are familiar with.
The people who do compare smartphones on a detailed level are the sort of people who will be using their features i.e. a small percentage of overall customers.
One must really move away from this notion that Nokia smartphones are somehow directly competing with handsets such as the K700 in terms of smartphone capabilities, they compete on basic abailities, because that is what the majority of customers buying a mobile phone are looking at, and in that context Nokia fall woefully short of the mark in my opinion. |
numb
Joined: Feb 07, 2005
Posts: > 500
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I fully agree with Arez.
The only thing that makes the nokia smartphones smart, are the ability to install apps. This ability is not used by approx 80% of the nokia smartphone customers, because they dont need these apps and they dont know they bought a smartphone.
If you look aside these apps and just compare the phones as they come, these smartphones are no match for the K700/K750 phones. They are generally slow, unintuitive and lack functions in comparison. Being a smarphone wont change the basic of the phone, even if you can install apps, you usually cant change many of the basic limitations of the phone, you can usually only add apps that do something else. Example: N6600 only support mono mp3 and sound terible even in mono. Being a smartphone wont change that fact.
Being a smartphone doesnt in itself equal being a good phone. If you have no use for the apps you can install, you get better phones in K700/K750
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scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: UK
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@numb
That's what I said. 
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC | |
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Access the forum with a mobile phone via esato.mobi
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Posted: 2005-03-10 18:10
