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Mobile phone comeback for the Walkman |
ann3x10
Joined: Jun 25, 2006
Posts: 154
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the rokr phone just have gone down south, it is a mediocre phone, who would win from a phone that almost has everything? 2mp cam and a great player. hope to see better all in one walkman phones./ | |
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max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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Quote:
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On 2006-07-18 08:32:56, kalleboo wrote:
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| Personally I feel an industry standard DRM technology is required |
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It exists - it's called OMA DRM, and is supported by nearly all cell phones for copy protection of ringtones, etc.
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Not the same thing. That's over the air drm that can be applied to any format, but it's not so useful for online music distribution.
The music industry needs a drm protected codec, not drm protected files. OMA DRM is forward locked to the device it is installed on. That means you can't copy it off the device. At best you will be able to copy it once only. With DRM, rights are stored on your computer (aka itunes, WMP) you can copy protected music to the same device again and again. For example if the device needs formatting, you don't lose your drm music, because you have the licences stored on your computer.
OMA DRM the licence is with the content (not a licence as such but a restriciton on copying) - and the content is sent direct to your phone. If you delete it to make room for photos for example, you have to buy it again to get it back.
It's more useful to the end user if DRM licences are stored within the user's own control, since they did actually pay for the music. I don't think many people would be interested in buying music and downloading direct to their phone over mobile internet, with no way to back it up onto computer.
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scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: UK
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Walkman is certainly the dominant music brand in the mobile phone market, but I wonder what will happen if and when Apple release an iPod mobile?
The ROKR was quite frankly pathetic, but I imagine Apple themselves will release a better product. However, will they release a range of iPod mobiles? If they want to be successful in the mobile market over the long term then they would have to; part of the Walkman's success is that there are a range of handsets for people to choose from.
iPod is probably the only serious competitor Walkman could face in the mobile market; there are simply no other major music player brands that have the same status.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
goldenface
Joined: Dec 17, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Liverpool City Centre
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@scotsboyuk
I don't think the iPhone can be a serious contender unless Moto radically overhauls the current hardware they have.
Ease of use as a phone and ease of use as a MP3 player is what I think has made the  become all the rage.
Also, will the iBuyer want a second MP3 on their handset when they already possess an iPod? How will Apple convice the consumer that they need another device?
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max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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Yes exactly. Now if apple worked with OEM's to brand a phone with ipod, but with the ability to sync playlists from your "daddy" ipod. ie: plug the phone into the ipod and suck songs off it without need of computer, that would appeal to people who use the ipod as the music source for their home stereo. On your way out of the house stop off at the ipod and transfer a playlist to your phone. Another thing they could do is make ipod accessory to phone adapters, so ipod gear can be used on your ipod branded phone.
And if Apple are smart they could develop a system that can be easily branded onto any mobile phone, or atleast a range of phones, to give the same choice that SE buyers have with the Walkman range.
That is what I would see as their way forward. They won't just start a phone manufacturing company IMHO, that would take a massive undertaking in new development. And branding only one phone model won't give people choices.
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goldenface
Joined: Dec 17, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Liverpool City Centre
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Yeah but its too late for Apple.
They made this contract with Moto last year amid all the hype about the great impending music phone wars, when each mobile manufacture was beating their breasts about who will come out top.
Why Apple limited the ROKR to 100 tunes I'll never know.
If someone needs to buy a mobile phone - which is an essential piece of equipment these days - did Apple really expect them to make a decision between that and an iPod?
Likewise, to an iPod owner, an iPhone that holds only 100 tracks will be useless! |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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I know, that whole iphone thing was a debacle.
I'm pleased, because I wanna see apple get a caning.  I liked the ipod at the start but got jacked off with their proprietary attitude over the years, just the same as I did with MiniDisc and ATRAC (actually that was worse).
So it's about time they got taught a bit of humility, IMHO.
Sony on the other hand have already started coming around to providing what the market wants. SE's quick response to the Walkman demand will soon show a flagging in ipod sales. 
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Jea-cea
Joined: Jun 18, 2006
Posts: 12
From: Queens NYC
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"ATRAC is hardware based not software"...You learn something everyday.
Sony's turn around is in reponse to what the public wants. After trying so hard they finally gave up...Power to the people.
Now the Walkman brand can walk all over most DAP's if they were to incorporate as many formats as they can into it. The walkman's original format was the cassette then cd(nothing else to compete with it) then md(alot of format comp) all hardware! Now MP3,WMA,AAC,Ogg...etc. That would bring the Walkman back to popular status. . . and a better phone.
Till all are won.t300-k700i-? |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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Quote:
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On 2006-07-18 21:28:20, Jea-cea wrote:
"ATRAC is hardware based not software"...You learn something everyday.
Sony's turn around is in reponse to what the public wants. After trying so hard they finally gave up...Power to the people.
Now the Walkman brand can walk all over most DAP's if they were to incorporate as many formats as they can into it. The walkman's original format was the cassette then cd(nothing else to compete with it) then md(alot of format comp) all hardware! Now MP3,WMA,AAC,Ogg...etc. That would bring the Walkman back to popular status. . . and a better phone.
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Yep, ATRAC requires an ATRAC chip on small devices like phones and mp3players. The codec and encryption process is too complex to tack on to the existing AAC/MP3 decoder chip in use in SE phones currently. To support ATRAC, you need a whole extra chip on the mainboard, or else double the size of the existing chip to include ATRAC. Have you ever seen how crowded those things are? It'd be a nightmare for SE to have to include ATRAC on their phones - it's either one or the other not both. So it's goodbye ATRAC.
You may not see OGG supported anytime soon, because it is still a rare format. If the market embraces it as they have mp3 however I'm sure they'll include it in due course.
The K800 supports an increased portfolio of formats: AAC, MP3, WMA, MP4, 3GP, WMV, RealVideo (along with amr, mid etc).
I think WM format support is a smart move. They are obviously aligning themselves with Microsoft in preparation for competing with Apple! Now you can use music stores to buy WMA music and download to phone, using Windows Media Player 11 for licence management and WMA audio (which does compress quite well) on the phone. You can make playlists and synchronise with removable drive letters in WMP11.
Who needs itunes?
Bring it on 
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kalleboo
Joined: Nov 03, 2005
Posts: 218
From: Lund, Sweden (walking distance
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Quote:
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On 2006-07-19 02:21:52, max_wedge wrote:
Now you can use music stores to buy WMA music and download to phone, using Windows Media Player 11 for licence management and WMA audio (which does compress quite well) on the phone. |
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Hmm, I was under the impression that it only supported unprotected WMA files? |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
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Quote:
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On 2006-07-19 08:35:42, kalleboo wrote:
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On 2006-07-19 02:21:52, max_wedge wrote:
Now you can use music stores to buy WMA music and download to phone, using Windows Media Player 11 for licence management and WMA audio (which does compress quite well) on the phone. |
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Hmm, I was under the impression that it only supported unprotected WMA files?
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Actually, my bad, I think you are correct. Mind you I don't think many mediaplayers can play protected wma anyway? Also, it's a simple matter to burn a cd, then rip an unprotected track from the cd you made. Only so you can play it on your music device of course 
Certainly there are third party players that support wma protected, but no third party players can play protected m4a, because apple want to force you to buy an ipod.
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Posted: 2006-07-18 11:24
