| Author |
Religious/political threads on Esato - to be or not to be? |
axxxr
Joined: Mar 21, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Londinium
PM, WWW
|
Quote:
|
On 2006-03-18 03:27:06, dave_uk wrote:
I'm all in favour of a complete ban. It's not a question of free speech - it's a question of an inappropriate \"forum\" for such subject matter.
They are always posted by the same people, usually, as has already been identified, as opinion marketed as fact. No wonder it's the same people defending their right to free speech. I believe a certain Abu Hamza thought he had the right to spout vile, racial hatred-inciting vitriol, using the same justification. He ended up where he belongs, and where all those who attempt to stimulate the same sort of feelings, however clever the disguise, also belong, IMHO.
Now:
\"I love Nokia more than life itself\" - Discuss. 
|
|
Its not an inappropriate \"forum\" as you so describe when the disucssion is in the \"Mobile Free\" Area...thats why that part of the forum exsists.
Maybe its the same people who make most of the posts,but the fact is anyone can post what they like anytime (everyone is free to do so).Its usually the people who have a problem with truth and reality that don't like these sort of topics in the first place.
So let me get this straight...your useing Abu Hamza as an example,a man who incited murder with members on esato who like to discuss Religion/Polictics..I know some are desperate this is going to new lows...I can't recall anyone here ever inciteing Murder,Hatred and Violence?..you must have been going to the wrong forums mate! 
I personally think anyone who tries to suppress open and free debate regarding the injustice in the world needs to be locked up.
[addsig] | |
|
*Jojo*
Joined: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: > 500
PM |
Yeah, Pradhika just said the right phrase I guess . . . 
[addsig] |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
the bottom line is if people don't like the subject matter, or those who only come here for phone info, simply do not have to be involved in these debates.
Why read a thread and then complain about it's content? The thread topic is plain as day, so why go there if you can't handle it?
|
axxxr
Joined: Mar 21, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Londinium
PM, WWW
|
Quote:
|
On 2006-03-17 21:57:36, Jim wrote:
Actually I'm not against it, it's more the fact that sometimes they popup for no reason at all. Sometimes they look as propaganda than a real discussion, the thread of reference is a good example and should be banned as it has no purpose at all than to grow the hate against the US.
Another example: threads with anti US is allowed here and I respect that and the point of view from the poster but what happens if I post an \"anti islam\" (for example, don't take it seriously) thread ? ...
Only solutions: warnings like on the IPB forums.
|
|
If you think the thread of reference was to grow hatred against the U.S then you thats the way you view it,its entirely your opinion but that doesn't in no way mean you are correct.
At the same time your contradicting yourself by saying that anti U.S threads are someone else's point of view and you respect that?..make up your mind,because it does'nt make any sense.
If you post a Anti-Islam thread then that is offensive and wrong because you are attacking someones belief...I don't see how anti U.S threads and Islam have any relation?...Attack on political viewpoints is universally acceptable as is the case with U.S,but religion is out of bounds.
[addsig] |
axxxr
Joined: Mar 21, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Londinium
PM, WWW
|
Quote:
|
On 2006-03-18 04:21:57, max_wedge wrote:
the bottom line is if people don't like the subject matter, or those who only come here for phone info, simply do not have to be involved in these debates.
Why read a thread and then complain about it's content? The thread topic is plain as day, so why go there if you can't handle it?
|
|
Well said,...and thats what i've always been saying in the past,...if you don't like the subject matter,just stick to the mobile threads as is what most members come here to do.
I never read the threads i don't like the titles of,so why make unnecessary comments?..no need for it really.,unless your deliberate intention is to flame.
[addsig] |
amnesia
Joined: Jan 15, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Doha, London, Tokyo, Shanghai
PM, WWW
|
It's in my opinion that it is not an issue about whether religious or political topics cause rifts between members, but rather an issue where various members treat their own opinion as fact.
Nothing aggrivates me more when people refuse to accept another side, or at least try to empathize.
I wish forums had "small minds" detectors which automatically prevented members from posting in threads they can't contribute constructively to.
|
*Jojo*
Joined: Oct 15, 2003
Posts: > 500
PM |
I guess this THREAD will OUTBEST all of the other ones having discussed matters re: RELIGION and POLITICS !
[addsig] |
Sammy_boy
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
PM, WWW
|
Quote:
|
On 2006-03-18 02:54:24, max_wedge wrote:
I see what you are saying, but I must also mention, I have been in a flame war or two myself, but I actually still like and respect those I've had flames with. For example good old mib1800, who seems to have left for greener Nokia pastures, was very dogmatic, but he stuck with you through a flame and eventually you could get him to see reason, and even if he didn't agree he would grudgingly admit you "might" be right. He also was prepared to give reasons for his position, so I actually have lot of respect for mib1800, despite his often anti-SE stance. (I might even get flamed for saying that  ) No matter how much we argued, mib never insulted me personally. It came close (on both sides) but ultimately neither of us was so adamant about our position that we thought it worth putting anyone down over.
When a thread descends into unreserved name calling, I think Mods need to step in and take action. Anything else is just healthy argument
|
|
That's how it should be! I've recently been in a bit of a flame war with someone, and was helping them in another thread at the same time!
My problem, as I say, is not against these types of threads, but some peoples' behaviour in them. The problem with religion and politics is that some people have very set and rigid views on them, and won't budge for anything or anyone, and if anyone questions their beliefs on a subject they get very annoyed and start hurling personal insults at them. It's that reaction I don't like, rather than simply acknowledging your differences and agreeing to disagree, rather like Max and Mib1800 did.
"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke
|
shaliron
Joined: Jan 15, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: Melbourne, Australia
PM |
Sorry about breaking the chain of discussion here, but I was reading on wikipedia about some pretty bad flame wars happening a few years back. Is that the example that you guys are referring to?
Anyway, being pretty new here, the worst fight on esato that I've read up to now would be the one where vanquish unlimately left. That was the one where us guys were discussing a change of theme for esato. That was pretty ugly and I can see what you guys mean when you say that you don't want personla attacks on each other.
A wooden spoon is a spoon made from wood. Source: WikipediaWinner of: Best Thread (Huge SE Portfolio) 2007, Best Post (Huge SE Portfolio) 2007, Best Signature 2007, and 2nd Best Nickname 2007. |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
well that's interesting gossip - never realised that was the thread that was the cause of vanquish's demise :-0 .
I did see fallout from the issue result in some vandalism of Esato's wiki - fortunantely it was able to be rebuilt from history.
@Sammy_boy, re: "That's how it should be! I've recently been in a bit of a flame war with someone, and was helping them in another thread at the same time!" Classic example mate Exactly what I'm talking about.
_________________
Get free themes from my themes site
[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2006-03-18 14:50 ] |
Jim
Joined: Jan 20, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: Belgium
PM |
Now we are just wasting our time as this has been discussed before and nothing will change as we have a freedom of speech here (unless laffen change the rules), so live with it !
Btw, sorry Axxxr I won't reply to the quotes you made on my first post as it's an endless discussion and I'm tired of that |
max_wedge
Joined: Aug 29, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Australia
PM, WWW
|
Truth is it's one big happy family here most of the time Like all happy family's there is the occasional feud or falling out
You get that.
|
absinthebri
Joined: Feb 11, 2004
Posts: 476
From: London, UK
PM |
Quote:
|
On 2006-03-18 03:08:49, axxxr wrote:
Sammy_boy you do have have a good point but we have all been here before with a similer discussion.The problem is not with the pollitical/religious debates but the members who can't respect the posters/members viewpoint,and lower themselves to petty insults...
|
|
Oh, the irony!
[addsig] |
scotsboyuk
Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: UK
PM, WWW
|
Quote:
|
On 2006-03-17 20:01:41, slattery69 wrote:
like ive said post opinions as such and post facts with research backup or run the risk of been called to task.
if we all did that then these discussions could exist
|
|
That's a good point you make. I think it's all too easy to say that one should respect others' opinions and make claims regarding freedom of speech, but I think that certain fundamental practicalities are being ignored. If one is intent upon posting controversial material then one should expect a response. If one wishes to discuss controversial issues then one should be prepared to defend one's views if they are challenged and not balk when substantiating data is required to either support one's own line of argument or to disprove another's.
It is all very well talking the talk and proclaiming that one should be free to discuss this that and the next thing, but if one is unable or unwilling to engage in reasoned debate and to support one's arguments when called upon to do so then one should not bemoan others challenging one's views and showing errors in them. If one cannot stand the heat then one should not be in the kitchen.
"I may be drunk my dear woman, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will still be ugly." WSC |
solidsingh
Joined: Jan 15, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: india
PM |
if people dont like policitcs and religion threads then dont read em, thats my one line summary
| |
|
Access the forum with a mobile phone via esato.mobi
|
Posted: 2006-03-18 03:54
