Posted by Luhccas-U1a
I think this is just some units with default sensor. (like n82)
This is totally acceptable.
I'm not crucifying the N8 camera when i show these problems.
It's just something that caught my attention because the N8 was appointed as photographic revolution and that is not what we see. Even with big sensor,Carl Zeiss lens,wide angle etc...
Posted by Vit
Yeah, I guess it might not be a revolution altogether. You may be right.
Even though, I guess itīs better to wait for some serious reviews that are still to come, GSM Arenaīs and Phone Arenaīs, for instance.
Iīve seen some pretty good shots at higher ISO speeds, specially those near ISO 800. The shot bellow, for instance, has been shot @ ISO 708:
Pre-orders in Brazil start tomorrow. List price is 1499 reais (http://nokia.submarino.com.br/detail/index.site?pid=22025139&cid=80291&pcid=80291). I will buy it, anyway.
Reasonable price, reasonable package.
Even if the camera doesnīt work wonders, I guess it will be a good addition and a pretty useful companion to my daily usage.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 02:10 ]
Posted by jake20
@vit
I guess my question is that if the sensor is so large on the N8, why does it have to select an ISO level as high as 708 for this shot?
I would think that ISO 400 would be more than bright enough this scene.
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 03:49:36, jake20 wrote:
@vit
I guess my question is that if the sensor is so large on the N8, why does it have to select an ISO level as high as 708 for this shot?
I would think that ISO 400 would be more than bright enough this scene.
Well, this question may be difficult to answer. Personally I think that the person got the exposure almost perfectly.
So itīs definitely not the case of excessive ISO resulting in overexposured pictures. In this case the ISO has been balanced by its Shutter Speed to make a good exposure.
If you look at the EXIF data, its shutter speed is rated @ 1/33s. Itīs already a tricky speed for someone with a shaky hand. If the ISO was lower, it would be necessary to have an even slower SS. That could lead to a problem for most users.
So we are left with three variables to consider:
=> The ambient light could be more dim than we think;
=> Its flash unit may not be that strong. If itīs a weak one, itīs possible that they had to perform an ISO boost to compensate for that.
=> A more sensitive sensor could have allowed them to dim the flash light to save battery life.
Either the second or the third option might be the best answer. If you look at the picture above, itīs been taken with ISO 337. And thatīs a close shot:
Getting back to that ISO 708 picture, we can also see that not only the girl is well exposed.
The area far from the flash influence region is also well exposed. Take a closer look at those tables and stools behind her. Looking this way, weīll conclude that the first option also need to be taken into account.
Itīs also unknow whether this has been taken in Auto mode or not.
So, itīs a pretty difficult question to answer. If I only had one now...
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 03:45 ]
Posted by AbuBasim
The photo gallery here at Esato has a few N8 photos uploaded. Two of them:
http://www.esato.com/phonephotos/viewphotos.php?pid=30494
http://www.esato.com/phonephotos/viewphotos.php?pid=30495
Open the full size photos and notice these also have the same fuzziness in the lower right corner?
Posted by Luhccas-U1a
@Vit,that price is a revolution
And the f**ked X6 have the same price
Who understand the brazilian price?
Posted by smithstore
Yes i am will buy it mail me phoneandelectronicstore@hotmail.com
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 11:49:29, Luhccas-U1a wrote:
@Vit,that price is a revolution
And the f**ked X6 have the same price
Who understand the brazilian price?
Yep, people were saying about that price and I never fully believed it. Until I saw the official page...
This time around theyīre making it here, too. Up there in Manaus. That helps a lot keeping the price low. And they had to now, with an imported pre-paid iPhone costing R$ 1799...
Some guys were also complaining about the ARM11 processor and the Symbian OS, but at this price tag I would never think twice! Theyīre saying that these specs are from 2009 devices. Ok, they may be right (apart from the camera), but thatīs also a 2009 price! And now Nokia have brought back a good GPU to the game, so the performance should suffice. Hardware wise itīs more or less the same as the Satio and the Vivaz.
I guess that both the N8 and the iPhone4 prices will ultimately bring all prices down in our market. The X6 has already dropped from 1499 to 999. The N97 mini is tagged @ 1299. And so on...
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 10:33:04, AbuBasim wrote:
The photo gallery here at Esato has a few N8 photos uploaded. Two of them:
http://www.esato.com/phonephotos/viewphotos.php?pid=30494
http://www.esato.com/phonephotos/viewphotos.php?pid=30495
Open the full size photos and notice these also have the same fuzziness in the lower right corner?
Yeah, but I guess that in these cases itīs some other reason.
These pics now have their right edges completely blurred, and some of the left edge, too. Itīs closer to be edge softness, IMO. The first picture (it seems to be @ Pisa) also seems to show a small degree of pincushion distortion.
The picture that Luhccas has spotted has a kinf of blurred blob @ the upper right corner.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 12:37 ]
Posted by Vit
One of these are from the Nokia N8. The other is from a Canon 550D, latest entry-to-mid level DSLR from Canon.
Can you tell who is who? (perhaps you can, but itīs surely a close finish!)
Posted by ok1907
@Vit that comparison is awesome. Here is the full:
Nokia N8 vs Canon 550D DSLR
Posted by Luhccas-U1a
I think the hardware is ok for a Symbian phone.
If it can handle fine hdmi output,it's ok...
My hope is exactly this,prices going down here.
Now talking about the samples above,is "easy" recognize the warmer colors of Canon.
N8 is neutral,eye like.
Posted by Vit
The only thing that pisses me off is that Nokia always put a lot of compression on their cameras... All these pics have a JPEG quality of 85. It should be around 90~95.
But I may be wrong... Thereīs also the JPEG table to take into account.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 13:52 ]
Posted by jake20
finally, USA Nokia site states pre-orders for the colors starting 10/8..
i just want this phone already
Posted by ok1907
Eldar's review: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n8-camera-en.shtml
I wonder how he succeeded taking that bad pictures with n8.
Posted by jake20
On 2010-10-04 20:01:01, ok1907 wrote:
Eldar's review: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n8-camera-en.shtml
I wonder how he succeeded taking that bad pictures with n8.
this is worse than the Engadet review
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 20:46:27, jake20 wrote:
On 2010-10-04 20:01:01, ok1907 wrote:
Eldar's review: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n8-camera-en.shtml
I wonder how he succeeded taking that bad pictures with n8.
this is worse than the Engadet review
To the hell with Eldar Murtazin. Once he was a great reviewer. Now itīs more than clear that heīs doing that just to damage Nokiaīs reputation.
By those standards, even a N95 would fare better than the N8.
For starters, he hasnīt even changed the N8īs default 16:9 cropped frame to the entire 12 MPixels, 4:3 one, under the allegation that itīs its default mode. Howīs that for an argumentation?
Virtually all N8 shots are out-of-focus and fuzzy. He must have passed butter on its lens.
That cup of tea is totally out-of-focus.
LOOK AT THIS PICTURE:
thatīs utterly hilarious!
Besides that, the comparison with the iPhone4 is totally biased. Itīs only a macro photography comparison. I bet that the N8 is in fully Auto. Ok, the iPhone is in Auto, too. But has it any other mode besides Auto mode? It doesnīt even pack EV compensation. The N8 has a shallower depth of field, which becomes even shallower for macro shots. So if we take a macro shot by a Nikon 3Ds with a f1.4 lens with razor thin depth of field, we can conclude that an iPhone4 is better than the N8, and that the N8 is better than the Nikon. Thatīs complete rubbish.
His shots taken with the Pixon12 are awful as well. He must have selected the highest contrast and sharpness setup available. They look just terrible. Just take a look at those two Iīve posted from my very own Pixon12 and youīll easily spot the difference.
Itīs not defending the N8 no matter what. Weīre just asking for a fair comparison.
Some sites manage to take great shots out of it.
The only ones that donīt seem to be able to do the same are those that throw it in the garbage.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 20:33 ]
Posted by etaab
I must be blind i cannot even see these blurred spots in those pictures mentioned.
As for Eldar Murtazin, the guy has a personal beef with Nokia so it comes as no surprise he'll slag off their products from now on. Its pathetic.
Posted by Luhccas-U1a
Eldar is a mid aged man with a peanut size brain.
Posted by mriley
The Canon 550D vs N8 comparison is stupid, you're just comparing the processing of the two cameras, they arent uploaded full size, 550D has much more resolution than the N8.
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 21:31:41, etaab wrote:
I must be blind i cannot even see these blurred spots in those pictures mentioned.
As for Eldar Murtazin, the guy has a personal beef with Nokia so it comes as no surprise he'll slag off their products from now on. Its pathetic.
Heīs completely ruining his reputation.
Posted by davidsic
N8 vs Nikon Coolpix S220/SE X10/Satio : http://hi-tech.mail.ru/review/misc/Nokia_N8-camera.html
[ This Message was edited by: davidsic on 2010-10-04 20:40 ]
Posted by etaab
I went off mobile review quite a long time ago. They underwent a site revamp and their reviews were pretty unrealistic compared to how i would have reviewed various phones. I hardly ever visit the site anymore, i use other more unbiased sites now. I only tend to go to mobile review due to their live images.
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 21:35:09, mriley wrote:
The Canon 550D vs N8 comparison is stupid, you're just comparing the processing of the two cameras, they arent uploaded full size, 550D has much more resolution than the N8.
Everybody knows that.
Who on earth would say that a N8 would be capable of generating the same level of quality as a full fledged APS-C sensor equipped camera?
Nevertheless, even with resized pictures, weīre able to compare things like dynamic range, saturation, flare performance, etc.
Posted by mriley
On 2010-10-04 21:44:39, Vit wrote:
Who on earth would say that a N8 would be capable of generating the same level of quality as a full fledged APS-C sensor equipped camera?
You'd be suprised how many people
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-04 21:38:01, davidsic wrote:
N8 vs Nikon Coolpix S220/SE X10/Satio : http://hi-tech.mail.ru/review/misc/Nokia_N8-camera.html
Hum... This review shows the Satio leading the way, IMO...
Still waiting for GSM Arena veredict, though.
Posted by etaab
OMG, just flicking through MR's review of the N8's camera..
..they cant say a single good thing about it. They say its worse than the Wave, iPhone 4, Pixon 12..
..that site has lost its marbles. All Murtazin can say is Nokia cannot handle this.. Nokia cannot handle that.. !
What the hell !? does he really think people are so stupid to take everything he says, everything negative against Nokia as true ?
What a complete moron ! the last time i saw this level of attempts to bullsh!t on such a vast scale was Apple's Steve Jobs with the antennagate issue !
Posted by Vit
Well, if itīs been proven that the N8 camera is that bad, I will seriously wait for the new Lumix Phone, TBA tomorrow.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 21:02 ]
Posted by etaab
Do you honestly think it will be though ?
No ? me neither. Murtazin reckons the Satio, Pixon 12, even the damn Samsung Wave has a better camera than the N8. Now i dont own my N8 just yet since it has not been delivered, but ive had serious hands on use with my girlfriends Wave and even though it has a nice camera, its resolution, colours, image quality cannot match my Satio's. Raw images ive seen from the N8 trounce my Satio's image quality also.
Im getting pretty annoyed at all this anti N8, anti Nokia, anti Symbian crap. Im actually now looking forwards to getting my N8 and proving them all wrong. Murtazin even reckons that the N8 is trying to take on Apple in terms of their UI. Anyone who like Symbian would know this is not true. Symbian 4 and MeeGo will have that job next year. The N8 and Symbian 3 is simply a gap filler between generations of Symbian and Nokia handsets.
I really am starting to believe the whole world is full of complete idiots who're easily bought. Gizmodo, Engadget, Stuff and T3 all give biased reviews.
Difficulties facing the company cover all areas and the lack of R&D investment in cameras
All Nokia have done is talk about their attempts to create a really high quality camera. Damian Dinning's almost step by step blogging of the development of the N8's camera shows how much effort has gone into it.
This kind of mud slinging PR to damage the chances of a product doing so well its intolerable !
Posted by etaab
This video is quite entertaining:
Video answer to Gizmodo (How Usable Is Nokia's New N8?)
Posted by Vit
I am hoping for the best.
This phone is about to be released here in Brazil, and its price tag is actually pretty interesting. It would be a big letdown if the camera didnīt live up to its specs.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-04 21:28 ]
Posted by jackau
On 2010-10-01 10:11:01, AbuBasim wrote:
Today Engadget posted a shootout between the N8 and the iPhone 4 here. Full size crops and video samples also available. Quite interesting actually. Overall I'd say the N8 is better but not with a wide margin. Here is one of the samples:
[ This Message was edited by: AbuBasim on 2010-10-01 09:23 ]
That Engadget article is done either by Apple diehard or iSteve pay them do it
N8's camera is by their own test miles ahead, some guy already use engadget's own data to tell the truth:
http://shoppaholicdaily.com/n8/
But... the infamous russian site mobile-review sent out another piece aim to de-myth N8 camera as well...
http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n8-camera-en.shtml
Posted by Vit
I was just thinking...
Itīs not only Eldar Murtazin who seems to hate Nokia... Have you seen what Nokia has done after the media has published the infamous antenna problem?
They have put a very funny text on their site: http://conversations.nokia.co[....]8/how-do-you-hold-your-nokia/. Funny for everyone, except for those people there @ Cupertino. They must have been pretty pissed off with that.
Now that article from Engadget does make all the sense. Comparing the N8 to the iPhone4 and stating that the iPhone has a better camera would be a perfect revenge.
A more reasonable shoot-out would be against a dedicated camera, or against the Pixon12 and the Satio.
After that, Eldar puts out his shitty comparison.
And even that one comparing it to the Satio and the X10... Eldar is russian. That site is russian. And that comparison looks much like Eldarīs. Thatīs suspicious.
Even though, I guess that even those favourable reviews lack a more scientifical approach.
We needed a definite one to put an end to this story.
If I happen to buy it in the next few days, Iīll do my best to provide a comprehensive side-by-side shoot-out of these four:
A Nikon D5000, a Pixon12, an iPhone4 and the N8. I would like to throw the Satio in as well, but I donīt have it anymore.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-05 03:38 ]
Posted by Vit
OMG!!
I went a little bit deeper into his comparison with the Pixon12. I knew that one of Pixon12īs weaknesses was High ISO performance. Look @ what he has written about the following two shots:
Let's compare our camera with PIXON12. I thought Nokia N8 will have an advantage due to bigger sensor. It provides more light, but we have to pay increased noise. Look at the picture of a well lit street. Signs on the opposite side from Nokia N8 are impossible to understand.
I will not say more, because bad conditions did not encourage good results. Both cameras are bad, though PIXON offers higher resolution of signs and fonts. Nokia N8 blurs fonts as you can judge by the shot of a nearby shop.
FIRST THINGS FIRST: THIS IDIOT HAS CONFUSED HIMSELF IN THE MIDDLE OF HIS ANGER TO DESTROY NOKIA. THE SHOT WITH THE HIGHEST resolved RESOLUTION IS CLEARLY THE N8īS.
Hereīs the N8īs shot:
And the Pixon12īs:
SECONDLY, THE N8 HAS USED ISO 671, WHEREAS THE PIXON12 HAS USED A PRETTY SLOW ISO 200. EVEN SO, THE N8 MANAGED TO RESOLVE QUITE A LOT MORE DETAIL THAN THE PIXON12.
ELDAR MURTAZIN: Youīre not only a decadent reviewer. Youīre a f**kinī retarded.
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-05 02:45 ]
Posted by Luhccas-U1a
Eldar hates Nokia,Motorola,Apple,Sony Ericsson,Samsung,HTC,LG,Blackberry and hates Chris...
Everything in the world isn't good enough for ya.
[ This Message was edited by: Luhccas-U1a on 2010-10-05 03:26 ]
Posted by etaab
Heh, after seeing all these counter reviews of the camera i really cannot wait to get my N8 even more !
I cannot believe in this day and age people like Murtazin, Engadget and Gizmodo etc are attempting such brainwashing over their readers.
Heavily biased morons to say the very least !
Posted by skblakee
Hyperx has managed to up the frame rate from 25 to 30 fps already. Check it out. Check out the video too.
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-05 14:55:55, skblakee wrote:
Hyperx has managed to up the frame rate from 25 to 30 fps already. Check it out. Check out the video too.
Fantastic. They already managed to decrease its JPEG compression. Hello 11Mb pictures.
Posted by DarkKrypt
@skblakee - nice thanks for the link.↲@vit - its raw format no compression on the photos.
Posted by Vit
I am beggining to get sick by those reviewers. Even those pro-Nokia. Those reviews are pretty useless. They know nothing about cameras. Allaboutsymbian has managed to take good shots, but also pretty horrible ones. This is careless handling of the device. I refuse to believe that the following pictures came from a N8. Itīs more than clear that its lens were pretty dirty. Take a look:
At the same time, theyīve managed to take these:
Posted by jake20
On 2010-10-05 14:55:55, skblakee wrote:
Hyperx has managed to up the frame rate from 25 to 30 fps already. Check it out. Check out the video too.
how do they do this? is this a firmware mod?
Posted by ok1907
N8 against N82-N86-Motorola XT720
Posted by Vit
Man, thatīs also less compressed video. Absolutely stunning quality! THE SMART ZOOM DOES WORK ALMOST AS GOOD AS AN OPTICAL ONE. Media info reports this:
Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Baseline@L3.1
Format settings, CABAC : No
Format settings, ReFrames : 1 frame => ONLY ONE REFRAME!
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 30s 244ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 11.9 Mbps => HOLLY SH*T - THATīS AMAZING. GOOD TO KNOW THAT ITS HW CAN HANDLE THIS BITRATE.
Width : 1 280 pixels
Height : 720 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 29.394 fps
Minimum frame rate : 7.260 fps
Maximum frame rate : 30.030 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.438
Stream size : 42.7 MiB (99%)
Encoded date : UTC 2010-10-05 08:51:35
Tagged date : UTC 2010-10-05 08:51:35
Audio
ID : 2
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format version : Version 4
Format profile : LC
Format settings, SBR : No
Codec ID : 40
Duration : 30s 80ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Stream size : 470 KiB (1%)
Encoded date : UTC 2010-10-05 08:51:35
Tagged date : UTC 2010-10-05 08:51:35
[ This Message was edited by: Vit on 2010-10-05 15:06 ]
Posted by jake20
ok, so if I have an N8 how do I apply this hack?
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-05 16:14:54, jake20 wrote:
ok, so if I have an N8 how do I apply this hack?
Hello, Jake. I donīt know for sure. Perhaps its a modded firmware. People do that for the 5800, for instance.
But I guess itīs not released for the public just yet.
Posted by Vit
The modder even reports that the photo gellery handles those 11Mb pictures very well. Take a look:
hey! @hyperX
can u confirm the problems told about the freezing symbian when opening the galery function on n8 after you have taken a couple of pictures???
No canīt confirm, i have also no problems with my (new) BIG photos, everything is running very fluid
can u confirm the problems told about the freezing symbian when opening the galery function on n8 after you have taken a couple of pictures???
No canīt confirm, i have also no problems with my (new) BIG photos, everything is running very fluid
Posted by Vit
On 2010-10-05 04:25:46, Luhccas-U1a wrote:
Eldar hates Nokia,Motorola,Apple,Sony Ericsson,Samsung,HTC,LG,Blackberry and hates Chris...
Everything in the world isn't good enough for ya.
[ This Message was edited by: Luhccas-U1a on 2010-10-05 03:26 ]
Everybody hates Chris!
Posted by Vit
For all brazilian people here @ esato:
Nokia has confirmed that the pre-orders for the N8 will begin tomorrow, exclusevely at Nokiaīs page.
It should be delivered by the second half of this month.
Posted by jake20
On 2010-10-05 14:55:55, skblakee wrote:
Hyperx has managed to up the frame rate from 25 to 30 fps already. Check it out. Check out the video too.
but why wouldn't Nokia implement this out of the box?
there has to be some kind of negative impact with this.
also N8 review part 2 is up at all about symbian
http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/reviews/item/12162_Nokia_N8_part_2-camera_and_cam.php
[ This Message was edited by: jake20 on 2010-10-05 16:27 ]
Posted by etaab
Im not really into hacking, i think the N8's current example pictures are just fine and so is the video, no need for any custom camera hacks.
Good news !
Today i held a Nokia N8 in my hand for the first time. Vodafone near me had one in their shop. Normally i wouldnt venture in there but they had an advertisment in the window saying coming soon. Then in store there were 2 dummy units on a display unit. I asked the guy who worked in there and they had one real N8 !
Symbian 3 is so much better than my Satio's version ! it was blindingly fast ! unfortunately they wouldnt let me use it, he just showed me by flicking through the menus. Apparently the one they had was for next week when they begin receiving them for contracts only. Theirs was for demo only to brush up on the new phone before demonstrating it to customers.
So, im hoping this time next week mine will be here !
[ This Message was edited by: etaab on 2010-10-05 16:33 ]