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SE please put a CCD sensor in the next K/C series? |
EddieAdams
Joined: Nov 12, 2007
Posts: 251
From: L.I., New York
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On 2008-04-17 12:46:57, F-Lexx wrote:
Hey, EddieAdams is right. Sony Ericsson is all about choices. Why are you all saying stuff like "SE are concerned that the average user wants this or that" and "the trend is CMOS". Or that crap about marketing strategies, trying to sell their low-end camers. Come on people, Sony-Ericsson have begun building different phones for different purposes. There are always users willing to spend the extra cash if they want a good phone with a kick-ass camera, and at the same time there will also be users with lower budgets or who only need a camera and will buy the low and mid-end cameras. It's all about choices.
And I think it's really shameful for Sony-Ericsson that an almost 2 years old phone from Thailand beats the crap out of their so-called Cybershot flagship, and while using a Sony camera module. Oh, and read the reviews. The I-Mobile 902 has quite a good battery life, even by SE's standards.
That last paragraph of yours is what pisses me off the most. The 902 HAS a Sony camera module in it!They should be embarrassed. Was SE not aware of the "interweb" and that we would catch wind of the I-mobile 902 regardless of the Taiwan exclusiveness. |
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EddieAdams
Joined: Nov 12, 2007
Posts: 251
From: L.I., New York
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Tranced
That is a great idea. If someone could make this into a petition thread it would be greatly appreciated. Any taker's?
Hello, Exactly!-Eddie Adams a.k.a. Dirk Diggler a.k.a. Brock Landers. Boogie Nights. |
jcwhite_uk
Joined: Feb 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Dorset, UK Phone:Xperia Z1
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Having just looked at the Sony UK website. The top of the range Digital SLR (A700) listed has a CMOS sensor where as the cheaper models have the CCD.
Most SLR's now use CMOS rather than CCD as CMOS standards have been raised a lot in the past few years. CCD uses more power and are bigger. This means either having a bigger phone to accomadate a bigger battery and CCD, which people would moan about, or rubbish battery life, which people would also moan about.
For camera phones a good CMOS sensor would do. The CMOS that most phone manufacturers use are cheap. |
shyam335
Joined: May 25, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: 127.0.0.1
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I dont know,how much time do we all use the camera.
yes,high end CMOS has improved a lot,but mid-low end just don't follow such pace of development.
Still id say CCD would be better since these sensors are really small (1/2. ..
There are a terrible lot of lies going around the world, and the worst of it is half of them are true - Winston Churchill
We shape our buildings; thereafter they shape us - Winston Churchill |
F-Lexx
Joined: May 09, 2007
Posts: 163
From: Romania
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On 2008-04-17 16:16:55, jcwhite_uk wrote:
Having just looked at the Sony UK website. The top of the range Digital SLR (A700) listed has a CMOS sensor where as the cheaper models have the CCD.
Stop comparing camera phones to D-SLRs. Digital cameras afford to have MUCH bigger sensors than phones. And perhaps at those sizes, CMOS has become competitive.
But the fact remains, CMOS needs more light than CCD. And at the milimetric sizes that sensors come in phones, CMOS is a bad alternative. They take noisy, poor quality photos in bad lighting and increasing the exposure just makes the pictures shaky unless using a tripod. I just can't accept this happening in SE's "Cybershot" branded phones...
I'm not saying that all SE's camera phones should have CCDs. Most Walkman-branded phones have reasonable cameras without autofocus and nobody's complaining. I'd just like SE to offer the best they have in terms of camera in their Cybershot flagships, given that I-Mobile already showed us what can be done with a Sony module.
[ This Message was edited by: F-Lexx on 2008-04-17 15:53 ] |
jcwhite_uk
Joined: Feb 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
From: Dorset, UK Phone:Xperia Z1
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On 2008-04-17 16:40:50, F-Lexx wrote:
Stop comparing camera phones to D-SLRs. Digital cameras afford to have MUCH bigger sensors than phones. And perhaps at those sizes, CMOS has become competitive.
But the fact remains, CMOS needs more light than CCD. And at the milimetric sizes that sensors come in phones, CMOS is a bad alternative. They take noisy, poor quality photos in bad lighting and increasing the exposure just makes the pictures shaky unless using a tripod. I just can't accept this happening in SE's "Cybershot" branded phones...
I was only comparing them as other people seem to use them as a benchmark for some reason. I think we need to have the better quality CMOS rather than the cheap ones that the phone manufacturers use.
The problem is that there will never be an ideal solution. If they put in CCD's the phones will not hold a charge for a s long and will cost a little more, which people will complain about. If they put in the cheap CMOS they make the phones with better battery life and a bit cheaper but people still complain as the pictures arent as good. Whatever happens people complain. |
yanyanyan881
Joined: Jul 16, 2007
Posts: 58
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I agree that we should start a petition. I also want VGA video recording and xenon flash in high-end cyber shot phones |
crossmatched
Joined: Jan 05, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: RP
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i second the motion. here is hoping that "true" DVD quality video recording (not just "DVD-like") will be implemented in the next flagship Cybershot phone..
not unless Sony will bring the Handycam branding to phones..well, thats another story.
www.secondmanonthemoon.blogspot.com
we are all works under progress |
AbuBasim
Joined: Nov 04, 2005
Posts: > 500
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On 2008-04-17 16:51:17, jcwhite_uk wrote:
I was only comparing them as other people seem to use them as a benchmark for some reason. I think we need to have the better quality CMOS rather than the cheap ones that the phone manufacturers use.
The problem is that there will never be an ideal solution. If they put in CCD's the phones will not hold a charge for a s long and will cost a little more, which people will complain about. If they put in the cheap CMOS they make the phones with better battery life and a bit cheaper but people still complain as the pictures arent as good. Whatever happens people complain.
Jc, not the first time you bring in dSLRs when defending CMOS against CCD, is it? 
I agree with you about the need for better quality CMOS sensors. But since you mentioned the A700 dSLR, Sony's huge IMX021 12 MP sensor is of course a great improvement over older CMOS sensors but still quite a long way to reach the IQ of CCD sensors. Read the specs and compare the IMX021 with the ICX495 5 MP CCD used in the i-mobile 902. Pay attention to the cell size (pixel size) and sensitivity on page two of both PDFs. Notice that the cell size is six times larger in the IMX021 while it's sensitivity is only three times higher. Wouldn't that mean that a EXMOR sensor has to be twice as large as a CCD sensor to reach the same sensitivity?
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EddieAdams
Joined: Nov 12, 2007
Posts: 251
From: L.I., New York
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On 2008-04-17 16:51:17, jcwhite_uk wrote:
On 2008-04-17 16:40:50, F-Lexx wrote:
Stop comparing camera phones to D-SLRs. Digital cameras afford to have MUCH bigger sensors than phones. And perhaps at those sizes, CMOS has become competitive.
But the fact remains, CMOS needs more light than CCD. And at the milimetric sizes that sensors come in phones, CMOS is a bad alternative. They take noisy, poor quality photos in bad lighting and increasing the exposure just makes the pictures shaky unless using a tripod. I just can't accept this happening in SE's "Cybershot" branded phones...
I was only comparing them as other people seem to use them as a benchmark for some reason. I think we need to have the better quality CMOS rather than the cheap ones that the phone manufacturers use.
The problem is that there will never be an ideal solution. If they put in CCD's the phones will not hold a charge for a s long and will cost a little more, which people will complain about. If they put in the cheap CMOS they make the phones with better battery life and a bit cheaper but people still complain as the pictures arent as good. Whatever happens people complain.
The I-mobile 902's battery life is just fine as someone already mentioned. In terms of sensors the size that are used in cell phones, CCD is the only quality option as of now. CCD uses more power but, with the size of sensor used in phones how much of a impact can it have on battery life? Impact on battery life will only be relative to camera usage anyway. If the phone can deliver 4-5 hours talk time and take HIGH quality photos and be a decent music player, how could it not be a best-seller?
Hello, Exactly!-Eddie Adams a.k.a. Dirk Diggler a.k.a. Brock Landers. Boogie Nights. |
razec
Joined: Aug 20, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: Mars
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If CCD wastes battery that much, how come my friend's S700 lasts at least 2 days? at that time S700 only uses 780mah li-ion battery. battery consumption is also amplified by it's monstrous(at it's time) display. so if S700 with high resolution display and CCD camera manages to have very decent battery life then what more with new SE phones that has been blessed with higher capacity batteries? imobile-902's physical size simply lambasts the preconceptions and prejudices that CCD requires larger form factor to fit with.
10 years at Esato |
EddieAdams
Joined: Nov 12, 2007
Posts: 251
From: L.I., New York
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On 2008-04-18 03:04:38, razec wrote:
If CCD wastes battery that much, how come my friend's S700 lasts at least 2 days? at that time S700 only uses 780mah li-ion battery. battery consumption is also amplified by it's monstrous(at it's time) display. so if S700 with high resolution display and CCD camera manages to have very decent battery life then what more with new SE phones that has been blessed with higher capacity batteries? imobile-902's physical size simply lambasts the preconceptions and prejudices that CCD requires larger form factor to fit with.
Yeah what he said^
Hello, Exactly!-Eddie Adams a.k.a. Dirk Diggler a.k.a. Brock Landers. Boogie Nights. |
crossmatched
Joined: Jan 05, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: RP
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CCD sensor (if it will ever be implemented this 2008) imo will be most appropriately placed on a C phone and not a K.
The C series carry the cybershot name now..
www.secondmanonthemoon.blogspot.com
we are all works under progress |
F-Lexx
Joined: May 09, 2007
Posts: 163
From: Romania
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You're right. And i'm having a bad feeling about the C902's camera quality.. |
bavlondon2
Joined: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: > 500
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And so you should be as it sucks.
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Posted: 2008-04-17 15:45
