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Nokia N82 or P1? For use for camera, music, ROM gaming, Internet, in USA |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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@nipsen
I wonder why I even bother responding to your post
[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2007-12-05 14:12 ] | |
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Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Noway
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Oh, but we were just about to discuss how the response times when switching programs is comparable between the p1 and the n95. And how the p1 mysteriously runs games at about the same speed, even though the processor and the hardware is "second grade", compared to the glorious n95.
The p1 Whiki - report your bugs, and add feature requests here. "Brothers and Sisters, believe! Believe in the salvation of Demand Paging, 'eah!" |
Tsepz_GP
Joined: Dec 27, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: Johannesburg, South Africa
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Well This has become pointless the P1 cleary wins with battery life THAT IS SO CUTE! But looses in most of the other things. The OP has chosen the TyTN-II and is still aware of N82 but has left P1,get over it. Honestly whats the point of arguing with this P1 guy when we know N82 and N95 with new fw v20 is better.
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Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Noway
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But come on! No one has even started to explain how "instant" in Nokia- speak means ~2 seconds. And how this just /floors/ the p1 with the messenger app taking /at least/ 3 entire, whole seconds, to go from a fresh start to when you can start typing a message! I mean, really. What ancient piece of rocking chair mechanics /do/ the customer- haters at SE use.
So, I mean, really, what is there to discuss? The n95 and n82 on the v20 (which, incidentally, FIXES EVERYTHING!! NOT THAT THERE ACTUALLY WERE PROBLEMS BEFORE, OF COURSE, IT JUST BECAME EVEN MORE PERFECTEST!!) is just best, and that's final.
And by the way, did I mention how you COULD use all the features on the n95 ALL DAY.. if it just wasn't for the lousy battery life? I think we know now how no other phone just can't compete in any way! And helloo!! The n82 beats the k850 too, just so we're clear! And that the k850 isn't actually a smartphone just once again shows how ridiculous SE is! Yeah! Bam, mother****!
The p1 Whiki - report your bugs, and add feature requests here. "Brothers and Sisters, believe! Believe in the salvation of Demand Paging, 'eah!" |
Dogmann
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: London England
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@Nipsen
Seriously you really need help you and reality just don't exist in the same space anymore besides which nearly everything you have said is just laughable rubbish.
Marc
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Nokia N95 8GB, SU-8W, Fring, Vox, Tom Tom 6, Shure EC2g
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-12-05 19:03 ] |
Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Noway
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So I'm lying? And the n95 and the n82 - with the new v20 firmware - easily lasts you over 24h if you spend two hours on the phone, an hour with video, an hour on wifi, and a writing a few e-mails, sms, as well as flipping around the menus a while, and playing a few games? I've tested it, you know. Only on one unit, I admit, but still - it did not appear to be faulty.
And.. I have no strange and inexplicable desire to go on the internet and blatantly lie about a phone I have never used. In fact, I dislike dishonesty of that kind - quite a bit.
The p1 Whiki - report your bugs, and add feature requests here. "Brothers and Sisters, believe! Believe in the salvation of Demand Paging, 'eah!" |
Dogmann
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: > 500
From: London England
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@Nipsen,
Well first your claims of how long it takes to get a message started on the N95 8gb i don't have the original is wrong and from P1 owners own reports it is taking longer than you claim. We get you love SE so stick with it if it makes you happy but the P1 is nothing more than a slightly improved M600 with an extra 64mb RAM WiFi and a camera and is nothing like the claims you seem happy to make whilst at the same time telling us all the alleged problems the N95 and N82 have. Your claims of 4 and half a days with that level of usage is just unsupportable, the only one that believes it is you.
To be honest i don't think any of us really care what you believe and you really aren't going to convenience any of us you are right either. The N95 was never that bad and after some initial build problems with the initial units it was fixed and even with V12 firmware was good which was also realeased quite quickly well especially compared to how long SE take to release new firmware. The fact Nokia continued to improve this as they could with demand paging can in no way be seen as a negative and your view of demand paging is just absurd it offers great improvements that UIQ3 users would be happy to have to claim otherwsie is just madness.
So go enjoy your P1 and be happy and stop saying things that are just unsupportable as it really is quite pointless.
Marc
_________________
Nokia N95 8GB, SU-8W, Fring, Vox, Tom Tom 6, Shure EC2g
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-12-05 20:19 ] |
Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Noway
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I could tell you the same thing, I guess - but you're not going to pass off demand paging as something it demonstrably isn't, either in practice or theory - and then just claim, without any reference, objective or not, that the n95 is better than it is, without anyone contradicting it.
The same goes for the comparison with the p1 - I'm not accepting your idea that since the n95 lasts for a number of minutes, it's impossible that anything else can last longer. Because that's not an argument, that's just bias. So again, I can respect your opinion about what you think a mobile phone should be - but I'll reserve the right to prove you wrong, irrational and horrendously biased, when you insist on things that are flatly untrue.
The p1 Whiki - report your bugs, and add feature requests here. "Brothers and Sisters, believe! Believe in the salvation of Demand Paging, 'eah!" |
sunking101
Joined: Aug 08, 2007
Posts: 356
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I don't care how good the N95 is on paper, in reality it's a cheaply made hunk of fragile plastic with a wobbly slider. I could never get past that fact, no matter how badly I wanted one. I went with the P1i because it's built better - end of. The qwerty keyboard was a very nice bonus which, now I'm used to it, would be VERY hard to give up. So if poor build quality and a wobbly slider isn't an issue, go for the N95. Otherwise get something else. If you like good quality devices then the P1i is worth investigating. Sure it isn't the best smartphone out there but the build quality and keyboard makes it a strong contender. |
Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Noway
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Pff. That's just things that make the phone stupid and useless, and not original and interesting! And at least not a remarkable achievement as far as mass- produced mobile phones is concerned! And anyone who claims differently is a liar!
(Yesss! 300 posts! Thanks for today.)
The p1 Whiki - report your bugs, and add feature requests here. "Brothers and Sisters, believe! Believe in the salvation of Demand Paging, 'eah!" |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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On 2007-12-05 17:51:59, GUCCI.011 wrote:
Well This has become pointless the P1 cleary wins with battery life THAT IS SO CUTE! But looses in most of the other things. The OP has chosen the TyTN-II and is still aware of N82 but has left P1,get over it. Honestly whats the point of arguing with this P1 guy when we know N82 and N95 with new fw v20 is better.
No one has said that N95 has longer battery life than P1i. But the blatant B.S. crap from a disillusioned SE fanboy that N95 battery cannot last a day whereas P1i can last 4.5 days on the same usage (i.e. couple hrs wlan, couple hrs talk, few hrs music, etc) must be refuted.
Many owners of N95 has posted that v20 firmware improve battery life, more free RAM and faster with its demand paging. And yet this SE fanboy seems to claim that demand paging makes no different whatsoever. It is for everyone to see that N95 free RAM has improved from 19Mb to 30Mb on boot. The cam/web/music/gallery app also use much less RAM (30-40% less) compared to previously so multi-task is no longer an issue.
And we know for a fact that N95 has better performace in doing stuff like web surfing, video playing and other cpu intensive apps than P1.
From a neutral stand-point and comparing spec sheet, there is no doubt N82/N95/N95-8G are the better phones. Dont get me wrong. I am not even saying that everyone should get these over the P1. For some, P1i may be more suited when TS or qwerty is required. But if TS and qwerty is not essential, then there is NO WAY that P1i is a better choice over the N95/8G/N82.
I just don't get why some just slate the N95 with B.S crap in a desperate move to try and make P1i seems a better phone in general.
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Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: Noway
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On 2007-12-06 03:22:46, mib1800 wrote:
On 2007-12-05 17:51:59, GUCCI.011 wrote:
Well This has become pointless the P1 cleary wins with battery life THAT IS SO CUTE! But looses in most of the other things. The OP has chosen the TyTN-II and is still aware of N82 but has left P1,get over it. Honestly whats the point of arguing with this P1 guy when we know N82 and N95 with new fw v20 is better.
No one has said that N95 has longer battery life than P1i. But the blatant B.S. crap from a disillusioned SE fanboy that N95 battery cannot last a day whereas P1i can last 4.5 days on the same usage (i.e. couple hrs wlan, couple hrs talk, few hrs music, etc) must be refuted.
Ok. So now we've gone from "it's not actually that much better than the p1, I admit", to "all- right it's worse, but it's not as bad as the stupid SE fanboy says". And it even "has to be refuted". My, my. Go ahead, then. Refute that if you actually use the phone, the n95 tends to last you somewhere around 24h.
Because you see, that's what I got when I tested an n95, and that's what most other people seem to get. Even on light use. Example:
http://www.allaboutsymbian.co[....]ia_N95-part_5_Battery_life.php
So go ahead - "refute it". But until then - take a hint, and use smaller words.
Many owners of N95 has posted that v20 firmware improve battery life, more free RAM and faster with its demand paging. And yet this SE fanboy seems to claim that demand paging makes no different whatsoever. It is for everyone to see that N95 free RAM has improved from 19Mb to 30Mb on boot. The cam/web/music/gallery app also use much less RAM (30-40% less) compared to previously so multi-task is no longer an issue.
That's not multi- tasking. What you mean is that the program isn't restarted again and again, like I explained would save resources earlier. And no, I did not claim demand paging doesn't improve anything. I claimed that on well- written code, it would not have an impact. And I say that because of how demand paging works. Of course - you don't have to trust that I know what I'm talking about, and that I've had this on an exam or two - you can look it up with google. It's not industry secrets.
Also - the "I claim it's faster and better, in vague and unspecific ways - so that means any objection to my statement, or any statement about the n- series, no matter how well- founded, is false", doesn't turn into a better argument even if you or dogmann repeat it over and over. It persists being a desperate wish to ignore facts.
And we know for a fact that N95 has better performace in doing stuff like web surfing, video playing and other cpu intensive apps than P1.
Again with the blanket statements, about things you don't know how works? - What about the games, like I said, and other graphics intensive operations? They run at the same speed because it depends on such things as the bus- speed and the ram- access times. And that's why you still have the two- second "instant"s on the n95 and n82.
And, that's why you can't - for example - stream a 640x480 video- clip at 25 frames per second, together with a 128kbs mp3 sound- track from a flash- disk, without some deterioration in quality.
So while a bigger processor is nice, it's not everything, or something that must improve performance in every aspect. In other words, there's no doubt that some things do go faster on the n82 and n95 - but blanket statements about how it must be quicker on everything involving the processor is ridiculous.
Which, obviously, just means that specs on a phone isn't everything, and certainly does not translate into a phone being "generally better" than anything else. As if we didn't know that on beforehand.
From a neutral stand-point
lol!
I just don't get why some just slate the N95 with B.S crap in a desperate move to try and make P1i seems a better phone in general.
You're entitled to your opinion, of course. But if you're going to "prove" it with technical details and abuse of technical jargon, it probably would help if you had at least some idea of what you were talking about.
The p1 Whiki - report your bugs, and add feature requests here. "Brothers and Sisters, believe! Believe in the salvation of Demand Paging, 'eah!" |
mib1800
Joined: Mar 18, 2004
Posts: > 500
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Ok. So now we've gone from "it's not actually that much better than the p1, I admit",
Are you stoned or what?  Where did I ever say N95 battery life is better than P1?
to "all- right it's worse, but it's not as bad as the stupid SE fanboy says".
And it even "has to be refuted". My, my. Go ahead, then. Refute that if you actually use the phone, the n95 tends to last you somewhere around 24h.
My N95 last me 48 hrs with moderate use. So will you be so stupid to say the with my kind of usage your P1 can last 9 days? Wait... you will
I claimed that on well- written code, it would not have an impact. And I say that because of how demand paging works.
Then I say you sure hell dont have any idea how demand paging works. Your 10Mb web browser code is well written but let's say most of the time only 30% of it is actively executing. Demand paging will only load 3Mb into RAM instead of 10Mb thus freeing more RAM. It saves on power as less RAM needs to be powered up. And big app starts up faster as less code needs to be loaded RAM.
And that's why you still have the two- second "instant"s on the n95 and n82.
Tell me, what is the "instant" the very first time you start your Opera on P1 (i.e. when it is not already started in background). The instant is more like 5 seconds instead of 2. 
but blanket statements about how it must be quicker on everything involving the processor is ridiculous.
Maybe you should go enrol for a reading class. . I said "cpu intensive" apps like video, browser.
[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2007-12-06 09:00 ] |
benjijk
Joined: Oct 23, 2007
Posts: 64
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Hi mib1800
Now I don't claim to know how demand paging works exactly, but....!!
Can you briefly explain to me with a little physics, chemistry and math if required, how much battery are you seriously gaining or losing by loading 70mb into RAM as opposed to 10MB? Claiming better and improved battery life with demand paging seems rather silly to me.
Yes, I do agree that messaging and the Opera web browser takes 4-5 secs to load on my phone. Its a small phone with a small processor, better looking and designed than the n95 in my opinion, (though I do like some things about the n95.) 4-5 seconds, hmm, let me see. time for me to take a sip of coffee, time to walk 3-4 slow steps or catch a breath, time to check the time on my watch, time for a lot of things. Will I die or grow old cos my P1 took 3 seconds longer than your N-series to load the web browser? Goodness people... how much more childish can this get?
Also, my p1 lasts me 2 days with moderate use and a lot of wifi browsing. And that's with close to 20 applications including tomtom running in the background. Is there an issue? Seems to me like my phone doesn't need this glorified 'demand paging' to do what it needs to do. And I can watch movies too with all that loaded in the background. I've heard a lot of complaints with the n95 and chose to go with the p1. N95 did have horrible battery life and even Nokia acknowledged this, there's no need to refute this fact.
Is the p1 great with battery life? No, my K750 would go upto 3 days without a charge, but couldn't do half of what my p1 did.
At the end of the day, S60 needed 'demand paging' to keep their devices running smooth, while the P1 doesn't. That says a good deal about the P1 already. So let's move on.... |
benjijk
Joined: Oct 23, 2007
Posts: 64
PM |
And to okalydude
I'm going to leave this post rather vague and unreasonable. But for deciding to go with a WM device? I don't know.... Welcome to the land of crashes and resets, install software and see them crash/fail and sometimes the entire device. And maybe eventually viruses.
I moved from Windows a long time ago to Macs. How much of WM is built on the same code as Windows, I don't know, but I've heard many stories of people having their WM devices crash on them during mid-call. And if you like to navigate thru several windows to achieve a simple function, then that's you're choice. Eventually I do hope you'll get back to some other OS like the upcoming Android, or newer or current versions of Symbian and UIQ.
Based on the reputation of Microsoft, I always hesitate to take chances. And so far, I haven't regretted my decision. Microsoft hasn't come out with anything in recent history that's fascinated me, ahem!! except maybe ... the Xbox, and that's only cos I loved playing Halo. (I don't own one yet though... I can't control how much time I spend on the dang thing.!!)
[ This Message was edited by: benjijk on 2007-12-06 10:43 ] | |
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Posted: 2007-12-05 14:47
