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Author Sony Xperia Rumours 2017
Ricky D
Sony Xperia Z3
Joined: Feb 05, 2007
Posts: > 500
From: UK (living in Beijing)
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Posted: 2017-08-23 20:31
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@goldenface Yes looks like a metal unibody judging by the NFC needing to be somewhere not metal and the feint antenna lines.

This design should have been in the market three years ago to have been even nearly up to date. If all they can greatly improve is a metal body over plastic from last year then they have to question their R&D budget efficiency.

Does anyone remember the K608i? Didn't think so... looked like the XZ1 of 2005. My guess is this will not be a vintage Sony release. I do sincerely hope I'm wrong though. It'll bring a year to my eye if they have to eventually bow out of the mobile market.

Looking over the graph on XB of mobile units sold by Sony in the last 7-8 years, it's quite easy to see which handsets have sold really well and raised the status of Sony. Arc, T/TX, Z/Z1 and Z3 all furthered the sales of Xperia handsets, and mostly because they were strong evolutions in design. The downfall started when Z3 had largely publicised heat issues. Then the Z5 range was seen as a step backward in design and after that they regressed further to a complicated 'X' prefixed naming scheme where there was neither an obvious flagship, a quality design nor perceivably high end material choices. Two years of poor releases has undone three years of hard work.



Unfortunately, I don't see a way out unless they focus their R&D on what the fans have been asking for. Give your customers what they want, no excuses. If we counted this fanboy forum for the number of users asking for a metal unibody and how many asked for better screen body ratio I think I know what the result would be. Equally on a new design language or greater FPS video. Sony have lost touch with customers, market trends and their competitors.
[ This Message was edited by: Ricky D on 2017-08-23 20:06 ]
I have a dig bick
You read that wrong
ascariss
Sony Xperia Z3
Joined: Apr 06, 2013
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Posted: 2017-08-23 20:37
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On 2017-08-23 18:18:51, LumberjackX wrote:
Look at rear cam.
It looks different.
I know it is f2.0 but does not look like one..
When you look at XZP cam, it is flat.
The one of XZ1 looks a sphere..
[ This Message was edited by: LumberjackX on 2017-08-23 18:06 ]



Here is the full sized image from amazon

https://images-na.ssl-images-[....]ges/I/91dIXq40bOL._SL1500_.jpg

Maybe they are different but I feel if it was f1.9 or 1.8 Sony would have added that info on the sticker seen here
http://www.xperiablog.net/201[....]leak-yet-most-specs-confirmed/

I layered the XZ1, XZP and XZ1 in photoshop over one another, and while it is hard to tell with small images like above and scaling sis not always perfect, one thing is visible, there are some differences for sure.



As seen in this photo, the Area marked B (from ref photo) does seem larger in comparison to the lens (A) in the XZ1 than in the old XZ. But then looking at the photo of the XZ cam structure:

https://www.datart.cz/file/186471/xperia_xz_fotak.jpg

So it seems that part B from reference image is the actual camera module and the black ring (C) surrounding it is from the lens on the body meaning it can be changed very easily. Looking at the XZP camera:

https://c.slashgear.com/wp-co[....]ria_XZ_Premium_Silver_Back.jpg

It seems that it has a similar layout, ratio wise of the B to C and it appears sony has changed that on the new XZ1. What this means, I have no idea. I doubt we are looking at a lens with OIS, sony would have added that info on the XZ1 sticker (see xperiablog post above), so are probably not going to see any hardware changes for the cam, hopefully software, not counting on knowing sony.

Now wonder if Sony will venture into the realm of dual cameras, since it seems it might be the next trend.

If the next device will still be on the 835, and qualcomm states either 2 16MP cam or 1 32MP cam, wonder if Sony could jam in the 19MP and a 12MP secondary cam into a new phone lol. At this point, I'd take a 16MP and a secondary of 8MP if both had OIS. One can hope.

I will probably bypass the ifa xperia devices and wait for MWC, but there is a rumour of a f1.4 16mm APS-C lens for e-mount, so that is something I'd love to get for my nex.
[ This Message was edited by: ascariss on 2017-08-23 19:43 ]
LumberjackX
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Joined: Jun 15, 2017
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Posted: 2017-08-23 21:15
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@ascariss thank you so much for this great explanation. Pretty cool of you !!!! 😃
I wonder if it has to do with the 3D creator thing.

@Ricky D ... It is not that simple. There are too many brands today.
Many chinese brands just upgrade storage, ram, cpu and gpu.
New phone for 250, 300 dollars...
Many people believe these phones are on pair with a XZP, S8, U11 ...
Then a lot of people end up with these phones..
Many brands just copy, no need for R&D.
Except Samsung, Huawei and Apple... The others are just stealing clients from each other..

S7 Edge costs about 220 dollars to be made.
How can any brand sell a flagship with 6GB/128GB/ S835 for 300 like some do?

Even many people that comment on tech websites ( not all of them) seem to care only about CPU, battery, gpu and storage.
A while ago HTC USA was selling U11 for 600 dollars.
Sales do not seem good lately. It is a great phone...

IMHO no matter what Sony and HTC may bring, websites will never consider the devices as good as a Samsung.
Android Authority gave to XZP a lower score than OP5.. How is this possible?
Phone Arena placed XZP same level of G6, both 8.7. U11 got 8.2.
Many people take their opinion, tell friends and family that they better get A instead of B.

Samsung logo on the phone makes the difference...
You find a Galaxy everywhere.
In my town it's easier to see a J5 or J7 than ants...
[ This Message was edited by: LumberjackX on 2017-08-23 20:44 ]
ascariss
Sony Xperia Z3
Joined: Apr 06, 2013
Posts: > 500
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Posted: 2017-08-23 21:50
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On 2017-08-23 20:31:22, Ricky D wrote:
@goldenface

Looking over the graph on XB of mobile units sold by Sony in the last 7-8 years, it's quite easy to see which handsets have sold really well and raised the status of Sony. Arc, T/TX, Z/Z1 and Z3 all furthered the sales of Xperia handsets, and mostly because they were strong evolutions in design. The downfall started when Z3 had largely publicised heat issues. Then the Z5 range was seen as a step backward in design and after that they regressed further to a complicated 'X' prefixed naming scheme where there was neither an obvious flagship, a quality design nor perceivably high end material choices. Two years of poor releases has undone three years of hard work.



The fall in sales can also be attributed to the entry of cheaper Chinese alternatives and maybe even with the poor US market availability? Regardless, a drop of 50% is rather large and unfortunate, I feel Sony may not recover it's sales much anymore and if they do pull out of the mobile business, I am sure Sony users will move on, just like vaio users had to move onto brands.
-XYZ
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Joined: Jul 26, 2012
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Posted: 2017-08-24 01:37
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@Ricky D

It is slightly sad, however IIRC Sony's smartphone division is one of the few that is actually profitable, despite the low sales. I think that's the issue - somewhat of a self-fulfilling prophecy I guess: R&D budget is low, which means sales don't need to be multimillion level for the device to be profitable, but at the same time the low R&D budget means there's no....incentive???...to produce a blockbuster smartphone - they're basically just solid functional devices. Not exceptional, but not terrible either. They do a job, but they don't excite.

That's what Sony needs to do. If for just one phone in the next few years. Just have that one singular Halo device that knocks everyone else to the floor. They certainly have the potential to do it - despite the massive bezels the design is solid and handsome - I genuinely think they could take the base and make something almost elemental in appearance.
Archdragoon
Sony Xperia Z5
Joined: Mar 18, 2015
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Posted: 2017-08-24 02:17
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What they need to do first is... being honest with their customer and fix the distortion issues !

Up until now they keep lying and that's unacceptable.
Device : Xperia XZ1
Headphone : MDR-1ALTD + MUC-S12SB1, ATH WS1100 + MUC-S12SM1
DAC/AMP : PHA-2A
supercoolman
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Joined: Jun 04, 2013
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Posted: 2017-08-24 04:56
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On 2017-08-24 01:37:55, -XYZ wrote:
@Ricky D

It is slightly sad, however IIRC Sony's smartphone division is one of the few that is actually profitable, despite the low sales. I think that's the issue - somewhat of a self-fulfilling prophecy I guess: R&D budget is low, which means sales don't need to be multimillion level for the device to be profitable, but at the same time the low R&D budget means there's no....incentive???...to produce a blockbuster smartphone - they're basically just solid functional devices. Not exceptional, but not terrible either. They do a job, but they don't excite.

That's what Sony needs to do. If for just one phone in the next few years. Just have that one singular Halo device that knocks everyone else to the floor. They certainly have the potential to do it - despite the massive bezels the design is solid and handsome - I genuinely think they could take the base and make something almost elemental in appearance.


the mode you are talking is not sustainable. it's like people who spend all their monthly paychecks every month and end up with balance of 0. they don't survive when some unexpected things hit
nh1402
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Joined: Aug 13, 2017
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Posted: 2017-08-24 07:05
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The other thing about Sony phones is that they make most of the components themselves, Screen (via JDI), battery, speakers, cameras. Most of the others buy a lot of the components from Sony and others.
yuunanase
Sony Xperia Z3
Joined: Sep 30, 2006
Posts: 274
From: utopia
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Posted: 2017-08-24 07:27
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On 2017-08-23 20:31:22, Ricky D wrote:
Unfortunately, I don't see a way out unless they focus their R&D on what the fans have been asking for. Give your customers what they want, no excuses. If we counted this fanboy forum for the number of users asking for a metal unibody and how many asked for better screen body ratio I think I know what the result would be. Equally on a new design language or greater FPS video. Sony have lost touch with customers, market trends and their competitors.
[ This Message was edited by: Ricky D on 2017-08-23 20:06 ]



If you ask me, I would think the opposite. The numbers only indicate the number of units sold, without the specific models. So I would think that all low end market is gone, i.e. E4, C3. I really doubt that they were selling more high end models than lower end ones, if you ask me. They have also stopped selling tablets.

Whats the point of selling all these products that are losing money, to bump us the sales figures anyway?
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LumberjackX
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Posted: 2017-08-24 12:43
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It is complicated...

Android tablets are usually used for games and movies. They are not good for other stuff.
Many people buy them to give to their children. And they want a simple one.
I would like the Z4, but after 2 years you cannot find it under 600 dollars.

I would be satisfied with a " XA1 Tablet", but it would be in my country at least 700 dollars, it is enough to get an iPad.

About the low ends, Sony has the L1. E5 last year.
Here E5 and XA 2016 can be found same price of Samsung J3 2016.
J3 still has better sales.
Even Moto G no longer has same success of its older generations.

Z phones seems to be more popular than E, C or M.
X phones do not sell well but bring more money, money to keep mobile division alive.

badassmam
Sony Xperia Z1
Joined: Nov 07, 2007
Posts: > 500
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Posted: 2017-08-24 12:47
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Xperia Z, Z1 and Z2 looked similar. Z3 and Z3+ similar. Z5. XZ and XZ1 look similar.
Samsung S3, S4, S5 similar. S6 and S7 similar. S8.
iPhone 4 and 4S similar. iPhone 5 and 5S similar. iPhone 6, 6S, 7, 7S similar.

People just want small bezels and nothing more, the XZ1 will probably be the fastest and best performing device this year. I think it will smoke the XZP and even the Note 8 in everyday tasks. The bigger question is how loaded the XZ1 Compact will be and if it is as loaded as the XZ1, surely it has to be one of the best devices this year alongside the XZP.
nikos_se
G900 Brown
Joined: Nov 04, 2007
Posts: 187
From: england
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Posted: 2017-08-24 19:16
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Xperia XZ1 and XZ1 compact,just don't feel right after XZ Premium.XZ1 and XZ premium are very similar,only difference is 4k screen(and that's only on 4k content).For me,Sony should have released something different both design wise and screen wise.Repeating the same strategy for 4th year in a row,just screams laziness.
nh1402
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Posted: 2017-08-24 20:04
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On 2017-08-24 19:16:54, nikos_se wrote:
Xperia XZ1 and XZ1 compact,just don't feel right after XZ Premium.XZ1 and XZ premium are very similar,only difference is 4k screen(and that's only on 4k content).For me,Sony should have released something different both design wise and screen wise.Repeating the same strategy for 4th year in a row,just screams laziness.


It's a much better solution doing the XZ Premium in the first half of the year, and the normal XZ in the second. They're different sizes. At least it's not like the Z and Z1 or the Z2 and Z3. They're completely different phones, targetting slightly different people.
Xpecreg
Sony CMD MZ5
Joined: Jun 05, 2017
Posts: 18
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Posted: 2017-08-25 03:16
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XZ1 Compact rendering
https://sumahoinfo.com/xperia[....]r-option-revealed-price-docomo
LumberjackX
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Posted: 2017-08-25 03:35
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NFC on the back.
No antenna lines..
It is probably same of X Compact..
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