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Apple unveils the 3G iPhone |
RyaN
Joined: Jun 24, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: By the hill, Sussex
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@Boinng However you try and dress it up, those apps are running. They are not dormant when you hit the home button. They are still open. Notice the difference in behaviour between a force quit & then open the app, and a minimize to home screen and then reopen the app? It's not just remembering where you left off - the app is still running! Maybe the iPhone isn't taking upon itself to have a party while you're gone...playing a tune or browsing the web as it sees fit while you're looking the other way, but it doesnt mean it's not running!
How do you explain then being able to double click the home button when the iPod app is as you say 'dormant' and you can carry on playing music where you left off without having to boot the app again? Thats right, 'cos it's still open, consuming memory, consuming battery.
When they are running in the background, they are consuming RAM... and RAM being consumed = battery drain.
Messages app alive at all time? Eh? It saves&quits. Messages is not running at all times.
@NoKia
Exactly!! How can something that is consuming that much RAM in the background NOT be consuming battery?
[ This Message was edited by: RyaN on 2009-07-01 15:41 ] Current phone: iPhone 3G Favourite  : S700 Follow me on Twitter!: Here | |
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anonymuser
Joined: Dec 17, 2002
Posts: > 500
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I've not said they aren't running, I just don't agree with you that they're still running "as if you were in the app", because they aren't - simple as that. They're designed to sit in the background without causing problems, and that's what they do. I've not said they don't use memory either, I'm just pointing out that in my real world experience they don't have any serious impact on battery life.
Put it this way - I've just spent the last 8-9 months having no real worries about battery life (at least compared to previous smartphones, all of which genuinely HAD to have background processes terminated as often as possible), no desire to install any form of task manager, no concerns about whether the app I closed was really closed at all, and all the advantages of having Safari, iPod, Mail etc open as quickly as possible whenever they were needed. Should I start worrying now? I don't think so 
The people who routinely complain about iPhone battery life are the people who either (a) never had a big-screen smartphone before, or (b) didn't actually use their big-screen smartphone before, and therefore never realised just how much of your "phone battery" can actually get wiped out by browsing, gaming, music, email, and all the other non-phone like things a device like the iPhone ends up being used for on a daily basis. It's nothing to do with background apps, which - by design - the iPhone limits to tightly integrated core apps anyway - unless you jailbreak, at which point you may well be using any number of apps that don't shutdown, don't powersave, aren't properly integrated (or may be conflicting with other processes) and so on.
[ This Message was edited by: Boinng on 2009-07-01 17:21 ] |
MWEB
Joined: Feb 13, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: somewhere nicer than you
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What do Boinng and the pope have in common ?, they both claim to be infallible 
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anonymuser
Joined: Dec 17, 2002
Posts: > 500
PM |
On 2009-07-01 18:59:19, MWEB wrote:
What do Boinng and the pope have in common ?, they both claim to be infallible
WTH does this have to do my infallibility, or cheap pope jokes for that matter? All I'm doing here is giving a truthful account of my daily experience with an un-jailbroken iPhone over the last 9 months, in the context of my equivalent usage of a string of other smartphones in the past. Do you have that same experience? Can you tell me I'm wrong, that my battery life is bad when it isn't, that I should be manually closing down apps that I've never needed to before? I doubt that.
I turn off 3G, wifi and location services when I'm not using them - that's common sense. I turn off my work email account when I don't need to be reading it, for my own sanity as much as anything else (although my exchange calendar and contacts are always in sync). When I start managing open processes and background apps, and fiddling around with programmes with names like "sbpsettings" to monitor what my phone is doing, then one of the biggest achievements of the iPhone will be lost, and I may as well go back to one of the POS phones I found myself "managing" before..
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Peio
Joined: Sep 12, 2007
Posts: 152
From: Euskadi
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I agree with Boinng, I find the iphone battery to last a lot longer than my previous smartphone (htc diamond), and I won't jailbreak and apply tweaks/themes etc on iphone because it will remember me WM6. That's why I love my iphone, because I don't need to modify things every 2 days like on wm or UIQ |
RyaN
Joined: Jun 24, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: By the hill, Sussex
PM |
On 2009-07-01 23:43:45, Peio wrote:
I agree with Boinng, I find the iphone battery to last a lot longer than my previous smartphone (htc diamond), and I won't jailbreak and apply tweaks/themes etc on iphone because it will remember me WM6. That's why I love my iphone, because I don't need to modify things every 2 days like on wm or UIQ
A slightly naive comment. Jailbreak is A LOT more than just themes and tweaks. The main one being able to use an awesome app called GriP which handles Push notifications properly unlike the poorly thought out, intrusive design by Apple.
You dont 'need' to modify things, but it's half the fun of using a device IMO.
Enjoy your iPhone as it is tho yeah
On 2009-07-01 19:52:05, Boinng wrote:
and fiddling around with programmes with names like "sbpsettings" to monitor what my phone is doing, then one of the biggest achievements of the iPhone will be lost
Actually programs like SBSettings are a massive acheivement. You base you comment on little or no knowledge of what this app does.
But anyway, trying to get this thread back on the rails... How is everyone finding the Push system in general? More and more apps are coming out (slowly) with support, HeyWay is a cool little app which allows you to share your location with someone quickly and easily. I'm still waiting for a dedicated Twitter client with Push 'cos IM+ sucks tbh, I always seem to get the push notification twice for each message.
Also has anyone played the new version of Flight Control over local wi-fi? Any good?
Current phone: iPhone 3G Favourite : S700 Follow me on Twitter!: Here |
anonymuser
Joined: Dec 17, 2002
Posts: > 500
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On 2009-07-02 10:48:19, RyaN wrote:
A slightly naive comment. Jailbreak is A LOT more than just themes and tweaks. The main one being able to use an awesome app called GriP which handles Push notifications properly unlike the poorly thought out, intrusive design by Apple.
Is Peio's comment really more naive than installing third party always-resident software on top of Apple's own push notification system and then lecturing the rest of us on how to maximise battery life?
You dont 'need' to modify things, but it's half the fun of using a device IMO.
For you it is, for me (and I guess Peio) it's precisely no fun at all, because we've both had phones where you *did* need to tweak and modify all these things, and when it's a chore it's a bore. One of the biggest selling points of the iPhone is the fact that it simply works well as intended, background processes and all, and that's how I enjoy using the phone. Having tried most of the competition I agree with Apple's approach to third party apps, and the protection given to the core stuff from tweaks and third party add-ons, and whether you agree or not I'm making an informed choice not to jailbreak my phone. Is it a coincidence that my battery life isn't a problem, while you're obsessively shutting down background apps to save juice? Who can say.
Actually programs like SBSettings are a massive acheivement. You base you comment on little or no knowledge of what this app does.
No, I base my comment on the fact that one of the crowning achievements of the iPhone is that it's a useable smartphone that doesn't require software like sbsettings. It's no judgment on sbsettings, I'm sure it's just dandy, but it's something you have chosen to use for your own reasons, not something I need to have on my phone.
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RyaN
Joined: Jun 24, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: By the hill, Sussex
PM |
I'm not lecturing anyone on how to save battery life, I was merely pointing out or rather trying to help people. No need to get on your high horse about it
When it's a chore it's a bore? Exactly. Not that you care but what SBSettings enables you to do it toggle wifi, 3G, bluetooth etc etc without having to go through a series of drawn out pushes to turn these things off. Now that's a chore in my book.
And I would hardly say i'm obsessively closing down apps with SBSettings...hardly ever in fact. All I ever close down with it is Safari and iPod. Apart from Mail and Phone nothing else stays in the background
Again, dress it up how you want, but the fact is there are shortfalls with the way Apple implemented certain things IMO, but if you're happy with the way you use you phone then good, cos I couldn't really care less. Certain people don't know what the jailbreak brings so I merely post for the benefit of people that are interested to know what their options are.
Current phone: iPhone 3G Favourite : S700 Follow me on Twitter!: Here |
MWEB
Joined: Feb 13, 2005
Posts: > 500
From: somewhere nicer than you
PM |
"shortfalls" on the iphone Ryan  , that's a bit like waving a red rag at a bull where Boinngs concerned
I value your unbiased opinion and enormous experience on this greatly!
Hugely enjoying my 3G S BTW
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Barachus
Joined: Sep 16, 2004
Posts: 240
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well on any iphone jailbroken or not, having safari in the background hogging 40mb of ram will have a performance impact whether u want to admit to it or not, having safari and ipod open in the background and then running a navigation program like navigon( or even some games) will cause the app to display a memory warning and crash back to the springboard or it will run sluggishly, the only way to solve this in a stock non-jailbroken phone is to reboot it or go around reopening and force closing all open apps, now to claim this is an example of the brilliant apple memory handling capabilities is laughable
Obviously everyone has their own preference of how they want to use their device and we can all respect that, but lets not bury our heads in the sand and pretend there are no issues |
RyaN
Joined: Jun 24, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: By the hill, Sussex
PM |
@MWEB Lol Yes, it's hard for some people to believe that Apple's design isn't flawed. Personally I feel Apple engineers have pinched many ideas from third party apps over the years cos they're too damn lazy to think of proper functional ideas themselves OR it just takes em far to long to think them up! In a way to a certain extent the App Store has become the brainchild for the whole system whereby Apple get other people to do the leg work for them and then reap the benefits. For example apps like 'Camera Zoom' in the App Store adds a simple yet necessary function to a poorly designed stock Apple app.
I'm pleased you're getting on with the iPhone this time round though
@NoKia - Amen to that dude
Current phone: iPhone 3G Favourite : S700 Follow me on Twitter!: Here |
anonymuser
Joined: Dec 17, 2002
Posts: > 500
PM |
@Ryan - nobody's saying Apple's way of doing things is perfect. What I'm saying is that it's quite workable for most people, and the need for hacks, tweaks, and jailbroken apps is FAR less than that on pretty much any other smartphone platform. Symbian, Windows Mobile, of course you need a task manager, of course you need to force close apps, and of course you need a whole host of UI-addons, tweaks and improvements just to make it workable and address the many shortcomings in the generally very poor design of their UIs. With the iPhone? Not so much. Tapping a few on screen buttons with your thumb to toggle the wifi, for example, is nothing compared to having to whip a stylus out and delve into a tabbed control panel. So while something like SBsettings is an unquestionable MUST on other platforms, it's only ever going to be a "quite nice" on the iPhone, and "quite nice" doesn't necessarily pay the bills.
@MWEB - always nice to hear from you.
@NoKia - I've already mentioned the memory issues, yes that can happen, no it doesn't happen often, no I've never said that it was a perfect situation, what it isn't is a big problem or one that has any significant impact on my battery life, given that I don't close those apps down and my battery life pretty much equals or marginally betters that of most other iPhone users as far as I can see. I'm guessing you probably see a lot more memory shortages than I do if you also have a long list of apps like sbsettings, Grip, winterboard etc all sitting in the background.
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Barachus
Joined: Sep 16, 2004
Posts: 240
PM |
Ryan, did u get round to fixing your phone? did they give u a new one? |
RyaN
Joined: Jun 24, 2002
Posts: > 500
From: By the hill, Sussex
PM |
On 2009-07-02 14:08:51, NoKia wrote:
Ryan, did u get round to fixing your phone? did they give u a new one?
Not yet - i've had a failed visit to White City (no Genuis Bar slots) and also when I could get to the Bluewater store they had zero availability, but that was the around the weekend of the 3GS launch so i'm not surprised!
My limited warranty runs out on August 7th, so as long as I get to a store before then all is good.
The Concierge guy in the White City store inspected my phone though and said straight out that they would just swap it out for a brand new one.
A store is opening up in Brighton soon - but I dont think soon enough for me!
Current phone: iPhone 3G Favourite : S700 Follow me on Twitter!: Here |
masseur
Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: > 500
From: Sydney, London
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I last heard that Brighton is due to open in September, and that will suit you and me both. Its about time they had one down our way.
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Posted: 2009-07-01 16:41
: S700
