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P1i fails on m.youtube.com |
pnf1973
Joined: Oct 04, 2007
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Well it all depends where the problem lies. I was thinking that it was a driver issue at the SE level, however, I have seen some very similar posts to these on nokia forums. Maybe this IS a symbian issue after all?
Again, the common theme to the Nokia forums seems to be, DHCP timeouts causing the phone to report connected by not browse the net, sudden disconnects etc etc. They also say turning off the power save seems to help alot.
Given the number of different manufacturers of APs I guess its not too surprising that there are incompatibilities between them all. Its hard enough to diagnose wlan issues on a pc, SE should do something to make it easier on the p1/p990 & W960. | |
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Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
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Mm. But it wouldn't really suprise me if it's something simple like the beacon interval. For instance, if there's a mininmum save profile on the p1 as default, it would have to re- initiate the handshake, or negotiate the speeds, every time a new connection request comes up - if the AP doesn't agree with the implementation. I've seen that before, too.
Still, the strange hangs and long freezes.. it should be able to handle even a bad connection and all the rest, without stopping like that. It's as if some of the requests to the wlan api in symbian isn't programmed well, and the entire thing freezes if there are more problems than expected.. *shrug*
(edit: all right, no more shamanic debugging for now)
[ This Message was edited by: Nipsen on 2007-10-17 12:34 ] |
Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
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Um.. Just happened to push this link, and thought it was pretty interesting.
http://www.telexy.com/Support/Publications.aspx?PublicationId=6
These guys found much of the same strange behaviour on nokia- phones....? When trying to figure out why they would get so low speeds on g-mode, and wifi in general, and so on.
And they conclude it's probably a limitation or a problem in the hardware- layer, or on the modem.
Strange. So, either it's a symbian implementation of the hardware abstraction, or it's a hardware fault, or some sort of translation issue going on with the chipset.. |
bwian
Joined: Oct 19, 2007
Posts: 8
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On 2007-10-14 13:35:05, henkeee wrote:
A note: in order for you to watch streaming media through your WiFi-connection, the router needs to support the RTSP-protocol.
Word. |
pnf1973
Joined: Oct 04, 2007
Posts: 403
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Ha. That just goes to show. It must be the symbian implementation of the network layer then.
I'll bet they simply don't allow a negotiated connection over 11mbs with a router - regardless of its mode.
I will also bet that this is a power saving function. It also offers some hope that a firmware update will allow the user to set the speed of the connection - and drain their battery in 5secs flat 
[EDIT] Having just read that through again, it seems that the n91 they used basically connected at the SAME speed for either a b or g connection! Does that mean that the p1 WILL connect to a g only router - it will just get b speeds?? I might try that later!
[EDIT] that should have said 11 from the start, not 1 o_O
[ This Message was edited by: pnf1973 on 2007-10-22 15:28 ] |
Nipsen
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lol. ..no, I haven't tested the phone too much, but you can get somewhere around 10mbit in good conditions. So it's not some sort of limitation problem like that.
I think it would be about the same power- drain as well, if the transfer was better.. The node broadcasts at the exact same frequency and power every, say, 100ms anyway. So if it worked as advertised, there would be about the same power- drain per Mb. In theory, anyway. |
pnf1973
Joined: Oct 04, 2007
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@Nipsen
Only at the wifi transmit stage though, i'm betting its the extra cpu cycles needed to deal with the incoming data stream that would eat the battery... for the p1 with its 200mhz anything over the 11mbs mark might be too much for its poor old cpu to cope with anyway.
Not sure what excuse the n91 would have though  |
Nipsen
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
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 .. yes, well.. if we look at this loogically - we could say that on a b- network the target would be 11Mbit, and the "optimum" throughput would be somewhere around half that, say 4-5Mbit. Since half would be overhead and packet loss, which would be necessary to get that much useful junk across the gap. And in theory, then, if we would have 2Mbit as a target, there would still be the same amount of frames generated. In other words, the same amount of overhead for useful packages as well, and the same amount of power per Mb. It would just be spread out thinner.
So there's no reason (except maybe heat or hardware weakness) to set it lower as a default. So what's probably happening is something like this: the AP receives a request - it sends it on, the p1 goes into wait, and checks every 100ms when the frame is ready. At some point the frame is ready, the AP signals the phone, and the p1 tries to retrieve it. At that point one frame - which is tiny - will either get through, or not get through (or it might be fragmented, and so on). And I think that it's here things start to be difficult. Since the module is not programmed very effectively, or something of that sort, and the AP starts to have synch- problems. It would then try to rescue the connection by setting the frequency for transporting frames slower, and the negotiation would continue, and the overhead would just pile on. And there would be (on APs with less quick response) overhead in addition to pauses, and so the throughput would reach bursts on about 200kb/s and over, and then average on around 60 or so (half of lowest rate, at best) very quickly.
And that /could/, at least, explain the bad wifi- connections most people get (and this goes for loads of other units, not just the p1 or symbian..). I guess that would be the same even if the tx was set to target 5.5Mbit in the first place, though. |
pnf1973
Joined: Oct 04, 2007
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I'm not so sure, if that was the case you would see the signal speed improve. I'm not seeing that at all. I connect my p1 to my netgear and immediately ALL packets are broadcast at 1mbps, packets being transmitted at higher speeds simply stop.
Not withstanding that this could just be the router being rubbish, I still think the p1 negotiates a 1mbps connection from the get-go, at least with my setup. As an alternative to power saving, it may well be that it does this to get maximum range from the wlan.
This is not to say that the implementation is still bad, those graphs from SYMSMB were very interesting indeed, the massive drops with a 32k packet were especially interesting, and hint at a poorly written driver OR poorly written network layer.
[EDIT] Okay. Now I give up too. I tried (and failed) to get the p1 and my netgear router to talk at wifi g - they don't - and then set the netgear to "auto 108mbs" and suddenly i'm getting a nearly full speed download from my laptop WHILE streaming audio from BBC with the p1. Something it just did not want to do before. ARG!
[EDIT AGAIN] AND now I have a full strength 54mbs connection from my laptop. Don't you just hate wlan?
[ This Message was edited by: pnf1973 on 2007-10-22 21:04 ] |
Nipsen
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*nods*. Nice when it works, though. I mean, I live in the belief it might've happened sometime.
..and this negotiation synch would happen before the first ip- packet comes to your phone. It's almost instant, so.. But I think you're right there's something set in the software or something that f**ks things up, specially with the "budget" APs (read: $499 and downwards).  |
pnf1973
Joined: Oct 04, 2007
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Yes, absolutely. You have to admit, given the range of devices available, its a blooming miracle that these things work at all 
I think that the SE and Nokia wlan implementations suffer from similar problems - a large number of people get connection issues with the power save polling for example.
I guess we are just stuck waiting for SE to fix this - which isn't looking too hopeful IMHO. As much as i like my p1 and find using it a positive experience I really think that SE are struggling with uiq3 - i think they have tried to do too much too quickly and we are now paying the price. |
Nipsen
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People with htc and other devices have similar problems, though. The synch- problems are pretty common, on laptops for instance. Or just when there are two different modems on a network, etc. But if it's a synch- problem like that, then it's very likely that a fix on just the timing settings for the p1 will improve things a lot. |
1m.dm
Joined: Sep 22, 2006
Posts: 4
From: Ukraine, Kiev
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I found a solution!
You need to configure your router to handle RTSP protocol properly.
RTSP is a Real Time Streaming Protocol.
It's used to control a video stream over RTP (Real-time Transport Protocol).
RTSP uses port 554 for both UDP and TCP transports.
RTP have no standards assigned and generally configured to use 16384-32767 UDP ports.
But, for example, QuickTime uses RTP via 6970-6999 ports range.
So, I, having a D-Link DI-624+ wireless router, configured it via Special Applications section (or how it named?).
I already had a default QuickTime profile that I changed a little.
The trigger port remained unchanged and defaults to 554.
I changed only data ports to 1024-65525 (defaults to 6970-6999) to cover all the port range and applied the rules.
Guess what? It works now!
Enjoy.
[ This Message was edited by: 1m.dm on 2007-10-24 15:15 ]
[ This Message was edited by: 1m.dm on 2007-10-24 15:15 ] |
pnf1973
Joined: Oct 04, 2007
Posts: 403
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I believe I already said that earlier on in the thread
Its not all of the solution anyway, there is a definite issue with wlan and symbian - its not restricted to SE and p1 but it appears that nokia also suffer with wlan probs. |
1m.dm
Joined: Sep 22, 2006
Posts: 4
From: Ukraine, Kiev
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Maybe. But I described the solution for D-Link wireless routers with help of which I got streaming video to work on my P1i.
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Access the forum with a mobile phone via esato.mobi
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Posted: 2007-10-17 13:08
