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Sony Ericsson have not been innovative


Click to view updated thread with images




Posted by B.J.
i don't want to be biased to SE...they are also one of the leading innovators but mostly they have that 65:45 ratio of copying techs and innovating new design and technology

usually, after they innovate new things, the design evolves rather than creating a new one..
just like in the design of k750 which resembled the t610 since they saw the t610's beauty to be a hot cake, but nonetheless, the resmblance of the k750 from the other fones ends there

another example of SE when it's not on it's innovative state (i'm sory for those whoa are in this thread, i'm not onto you guys i just want to show that SE sometimes do things which are already done..)

http://www.esato.com/board/viewtopic.php?topic=88298




Posted by jack00
Quote:

On 2005-04-24 17:27:35, bart wrote:
not really. a good restructering would've sloved it aswell. and don't forget that the last line of ericsson was doing fine.
T66 was making good profit cause some people wanted the smallest phone availeble
T65 nice looking, and stronger then the averdge phone
T68m do i need to say? most historicle phone ever made untill today

keep in mind that the first couple of Q's SE had less marketshare then ericsson, even now they've got less marketshare.
and don't say that SE is more profitable, cause during the first Q's SE made a big loss.
like i said if ericsson restructured there mobile phone section, then they would've made it and we would've seen far more intresting things.



then tell me, why did they made the step and joined sony ericsson ?

Posted by B.J.
because they need to profit. i dont like where this is going.. my mind was right, i shouldn't have brought up this topic to you guys... i only want to prove that SE though copying ideas from other manufacturers are also innovators but slow in that aspect..

Posted by jack00
i think you don't have to worry, this is a normal discussion - we don't bang our heats together - i know bart, and i respect him, i only want to know what i don't know

and btw, sony came up with a concept for their ps3 that also concerns the sony ericsson department - i don't find the articel at the moment, sorry

[ This Message was edited by: jack00 on 2005-04-24 21:16 ]

Posted by B.J.
Quote:

On 2005-04-24 22:13:15, jack00 wrote:
i think you don't have to worry, this is a normal discussion - we don't bang our heats together - i know bart, and i respect him, i only want to know what i don't know

and btw, sony came up with a concept for their ps3 that also concerns the sony ericsson department - i don't find the articel at the moment, sorry




just don't touch the Sony department, specially the playstation, TV, and the camera division or else i'm gonna eat everything that i say! dont you think mate? Besides my aircon and my lamp, almost every electric thingy in my room are Sony! (oh yes! i even use my Sony 10,000watt compo as my multimedia speaker!)
no to mention that my car use a 12 inch Sony xplod in the trunk
_________________
1.3megapixel. .... nuffsaid.

[ This Message was edited by: B.J. on 2005-04-24 22:08 ]

Posted by S4k1s
I don't get this conversation ...
"Ericsson did, Bluetooth, and Color screens. (Not only 4 color)"...

If 4color -> 16 color is inovative .. then why isn't 0,3mp -> 1,3mp -> 2mp digital zoom innovative?

or one side to dual side phones ..

or SEs batterys .. <-- innovative stuff there ..

or the design of the phones .. I feel that is innovative

or the cameraphone style .. or the musicphone style ..

you can see this things either as innovativeor just improvements ...

else u got ..Motion Cam ROB-1 ..Bluetooth™ car CAR-100 ..Laserpen ILP-20 ..Bluetooth™mediacenter MMV-200 ..Blue Torch IBT-20 ..Bluetooth™ Media Viewer MMV-100 ..Advanced Music Mute HCE-16 .. the gamepad fomr z600 .. the list can go on and on

or do you expect SE to make a phone with a motorcycle case, so u can drive around in your bike? .. be a bit realistic plz

Posted by bart
because of SE the ericsson redjade was canceld otherwize it would've competed with the PSP.

jack they made the step to SE because ericsson had alot of debt, and the board of directors was seduced by sony.
sony it self is a great company i myself enjoy sony products and have several, but i know that other companies give me the same thing, or sometimes even more for less money.
sony has a good way of advertising and PR thats why ericsson took the bate.

a few years ago the CEO of ericsson changed, he's a smart person who brought back profit to the company, but on the other hand killed the dream of so many people incl many of ericssons empolyees.

oyea jack did you know ericsson was working and getting ready to lauch a new line of products, household products.
full controle over your house with your computer/smartphone.
ericsson even has such a house somewhere in sweden, the idea was to have such a house for most people within 5-8years, but i gues it sounds impossible now.

Posted by thecell
IMO, SE really innovative, let see :
- T610 ; the first smaller built in camera phone
- K700i ; the first smaller video phone
- S700i ; the first real digital camera phone
- P910i ; the first smartphone that have large screen on standard size (not too huge) which have many option for data input (Normal phone keypad, Qwerty keyboard, touchscreen, jogdial)
- K600i ; the first smallest 3G phone
- W800i ; the first real walkman phone.

Isn't that innovative ?? so what innovative do u guys talk about. What do u want from SE. I think SE doing a good job, they bringing us a phone that we really want.

Posted by B.J.
Quote:

On 2005-04-24 23:32:02, S4k1s wrote:

else u got ..Motion Cam ROB-1 ..Bluetooth™ car CAR-100 ..Laserpen ILP-20 ..Bluetooth™mediacenter MMV-200 ..Blue Torch IBT-20 ..Bluetooth™ Media Viewer MMV-100 ..Advanced Music Mute HCE-16 .. the gamepad fomr z600 .. the list can go on and on





i do think those really are times when SE is at its innovative state but that's the problem with too much innovation, it's not so much of a hot cake though those stuffs are cool i must agree... btw, how much is the motion cam and the bt car?

Posted by jack00
Quote:

On 2005-04-24 23:35:50, bart wrote:

oyea jack did you know ericsson was working and getting ready to lauch a new line of products, household products.
full controle over your house with your computer/smartphone.
ericsson even has such a house somewhere in sweden, the idea was to have such a house for most people within 5-8years, but i gues it sounds impossible now.




i know, you showed me the pics

Posted by Yazan24

The cell doesnt have a brain cell...

Hahahha: -

IMO, SE really innovative, let see :
- T610 ; the first smaller built in camera phone
- K700i ; the first smaller video phone
- S700i ; the first real digital camera phone
- P910i ; the first smartphone that have large screen on standard size (not too huge) which have many option for data input (Normal phone keypad, Qwerty keyboard, touchscreen, jogdial)
- K600i ; the first smallest 3G phone
- W800i ; the first real walkman phone.


T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
K700 not the smallest Vid Cam of its time
S700 not the first 1.3 MP Cam of its time
P910 based on P800 an ericsson product.
K600i Smallest 3G phone isnt an innovation
W800 walkman phone WOW, now our phone plays music, oh wait, didnt we already have that.

Posted by whizkidd
@Yazan, if not SE,which manufacturer is "innovative" according to you?

Posted by S4k1s
@ Yazan24

b4 u start bashing other people about brain cells ... stop a min and think of your own supposed brain cells m8 ...

I usually don't point stuff like this out but your post was _really stupid_

a person with some brain cells a functional IQ and some knowledge of the english language would understand this little minor thing ...
"the first" _is not the same as_ "of its time"

IMO, SE really innovative, let see :
- T610 ; the first smaller built in camera phone
- K700i ; the first smaller video phone
- S700i ; the first real digital camera phone
- P910i ; the first smartphone that have large screen on standard size (not too huge) which have many option for data input (Normal phone keypad, Qwerty keyboard, touchscreen, jogdial)
- K600i ; the first smallest 3G phone
- W800i ; the first real walkman phone.

T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
K700 not the smallest Vid Cam of its time
S700 not the first 1.3 MP Cam of its time
P910 based on P800 an ericsson product.
K600i Smallest 3G phone isnt an innovation
W800 walkman phone WOW, now our phone plays music, oh wait, didnt we already have that.
----
now you want to back this stuff u wrote up with some models?

like, wich small cameraphone came b4 T610? (and so on ..)

being first == u have to be innovative

making small phones like K600 that fits so much technology that other manufacturers phones with same tech. in them need to be double the size == u have to be innovative

being 1..2 step(s) ahead of competitors ==> releasing a mp3player phone makes you innovative ==> makes the others copycats

(having said that .. this don't make SE good/great)


[ This Message was edited by: S4k1s on 2005-04-25 17:25 ]

Posted by Yazan24
I thought the facts were obvious

T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
-Several Phones by other Manufacturers are within the same size range smaller/larger by mm, eg. N7250-
K700 not the smallest Vid Cam of its time
-Several Phones by Nokia-
S700 not the first 1.3 MP Cam of its time
-Several other Phones eg. N7610-
P910 based on P800 an ericsson product.
-Do you need proof of this too, shall I get the release dates for you?-
K600i Smallest 3G phone isnt an innovation
-Not an innovation because its nothing extraordinary-
W800 walkman phone WOW, now our phone plays music, oh wait, didnt we already have that.
-Not an innovation because its nothing extraordinary-

Happy?


Whizzkid, I think samsung are pretty innovative, but keep inventing weird unpractical things, and motorola's joint ventures have released some innovative products, like the glasses headset with oakley.


Innovative but impractical again: -
http://www.esato.com/board/viewtopic.php?topic=90500

_________________
-Kamikaze-
Esato- The first Biased Sony Ericsson Forums
MP3 Ringtones? Oh yeah Laffen killed them.

[ This Message was edited by: Yazan24 on 2005-04-25 19:13 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Yazan24 on 2005-04-25 20:02 ]

Posted by bart
would you call this innovation?



Posted by jack00
just another thought about
Quote:
household products.
full controle over your house with your computer/smartphone.


of course for the time they would have come up with this it would have been totally amazing and innovative - but would the market need or even exept something like this ? would those products ever get recotnised by the mainstream - which would make them profitable
i only want to say that innovations are not equal to profit, its always the market that counts - take B&O for example, they are - in my opinion - the most innovative brand in terms of design,quality,technology(they also have this fullconnection over every electronic device in the house stuff, not for the household but for your multimedia stuff), in the world - of course quality is expensive and there are not many people who want to pay for quality, aslong as it is cheap it is good(but well this is a different topic)

Posted by bart
i think some people here would be happy with a small and acceptable profit, some of us just want to improve the each other lives, for the benifit of mankind.

Posted by Gigs
Erm not really bart, nice to see that in a phone factor but thats a laptop. (If we're arguing technology then comparing it to a laptop is fair)

Ericsson were innovative in making bluetooth, thats one no one can deny them, but bart, woulda, coulda, shoulda.

They would have had phones for everyone, they could have made phones for everyone, they should have trimmed the fat to not put theselves in the position they did.

By creating SE, S gets the bad rap because they trimmed alot of Ericssons fat to make both mobile makers profitable.

But lets look at the term: (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=innovative)

innovative

adj 1: ahead of the times; "the advanced teaching methods"; "had advanced views on the subject"; "a forward-looking corporation"; "is British industry innovative enough?" [syn: advanced, forward-looking, modern] 2: being or producing something like nothing done or experienced or created before; "stylistically innovative works"; "innovative members of the artistic community"; "a mind so innovational, so original" [syn: innovational, groundbreaking]

To be honest I don't see how you can't not apply reason 2. to SE there. Even people that dog on already state many times through out Esato that they are stylish. Therefore could be considered innovative.

If we're talking technologically innovative, well sorry, Ericsson boiliing down already existing technologies such as colour screens, laptop features and other things into a different form factor to me does not count as innovative. (If we REALLY want to argue it down to nitty gritty, which came first, the newton or the P800? Because if the newton came first then to be honest the P800 is simply a revamp of an already existing PDA technology and thus also becomes moot)

Designing prototypes that it seems none bar bart saw that were revolutionary? Hey good for you bart but the simple fact is prototypes mean nothing unless they're release models.

Scots would probably put it best saying this thread is tosh. It's a pointless thread in respects that by definition both mobile manufacturers are innovative, and probably by the same definition all mobile companies are.

As technology manufacturers, both Sony and Ericsson are innovative, as a combined mobile phone comapny, they will no doubt draw upon each companies expertise. As long as they're not broke, and still producing feature packed phones does much else matter?


Posted by S4k1s
@Yazan24
since when was innovative same as extraordinary?

also T610 is smaller than 7250...
P800 is a SE product...
as far as I know no Nokia phone have a camera you can compare to S700...
wich Nokia video phone is smaller than K700 and was released b4 the K700?

we need more proof!

Posted by Yazan24
P800 is an ericsson product, the design was just modified by SE.

Its difficult to compare phone sizes because the competitors dont have identical products.

The 7250 is only bigger by 2m. Not much of an improvement.

Size isnt an issue because usually competitors products are very close in size. So its not a major step.

So learn ure facts.

Posted by S4k1s
P800 is not a ericsson product. Ericsson had prototypes.. still don't make P800 a Ericsson phone like T68..

and yes mm matters ... look att T610 hardware and compare it to any nokia from T610 release date and 1 year on .. screen size .. resolution .. bt .. voicememo .. voicecall .. it knocked every phone for over 6 months! .. since you wanted to talk facts .. T610 is 2mm smaller and yes it counts, but the point is look beneath the shell

If you want to talk, first go get release dates of the phones .. and specs.

and since when was innovative same as extraordinary?


Posted by batesie
Quote:

On 2005-04-25 22:49:04, bart wrote:
i think some people here would be happy with a small and acceptable profit, some of us just want to improve the each other lives, for the benifit of mankind.




A small voice in a big crowd, but i hear you bart

Posted by Yazan24
T68 is an Ericsson Phone, and if ericsson made prototypes of the P800 before SE what does that tell you, the specs and technology were done, only slight tweaks and modifications, and changes in design occured afterwards.

Nokia isnt the only competitor compare the T610 to other brand at the time, the T610 was a good phone which was feature packed, it wasnt innovative.

Innovative is partially extraordinary,

Innovation is something completely new, something completely new in comparison with the ordinary is what, extraordinary.

Posted by whizkidd
What features does samsung phones have which are completely new??

Posted by Yazan24
A phone by samsung was recenetly released that detected 3d motion, so you can twirl the phone and it would launch the camera and so on. Or write sms letters, or answer the phone by a particular movement.

That is innovation, but kind of impractical.

Posted by jcwhite_uk
Quote:

On 2005-04-25 20:11:57, Yazan24 wrote:
I thought the facts were obvious

S700 not the first 1.3 MP Cam of its time
-Several other Phones eg. N7610-
The S700i was the first camera phone that used a 1.3MP CCD reciever to produce a better quality pics than other 1.3mp camera phones.
P




Posted by jcwhite_uk
Quote:

On 2005-04-26 01:23:15, S4k1s wrote:
P800 is not a ericsson product. Ericsson had prototypes.. still don't make P800 a Ericsson phone like T68..

and yes mm matters ... look att T610 hardware and compare it to any nokia from T610 release date and 1 year on .. screen size .. resolution .. bt .. voicememo .. voicecall .. it knocked every phone for over 6 months! .. since you wanted to talk facts .. T610 is 2mm smaller and yes it counts, but the point is look beneath the shell

If you want to talk, first go get release dates of the phones .. and specs.

and since when was innovative same as extraordinary?



The P800 was released as an SE phone but Ericsson did most of the developing before they became SE. Iwould say that it is a SE phone but the innovation is all down to Ericsson as they did most of the work before Sony came on board.

Posted by otokx
u want an innovative brand? try supermaster in nigeria; then you will surely be satisfied, check out the proudly nigerian forum for more details.

Posted by S4k1s
Quote:

On 2005-04-23 17:08:01, Yazan24 wrote:
Sure they provide quality handsets, which have innovative aesthetics, but theyve never introduced a totally new innovative feature.

Ericsson did, Bluetooth, and Color screens. (Not only 4 color)

However Sony Ericsson arent much of innovators, which is surprising as both companies are innovators on their own, but the venture isnt as prosperous

_________________
-Kamikaze-
Esato- The first Biased Sony Ericsson Forums
MP3 Ringtones? Oh yeah Laffen killed them.

[ This Message was edited by: Yazan24 on 2005-04-23 16:30 ]



Yazan24 you are so stupid ... this is not innovative ... that is not innovative ... this is not extraordinary ...

How is a color screen EXTRAORDINARY?
How is a Phone with a Pen EXTRAORDINARY?

It's not even slight innovative, first is just a minor upgrade and the second is just putting 2 things together ...

You put a pen+phone together and you think it's EXTRAORDINARY ...

You put a phone+camera+mp3player+BT+BiG 260k color screen+radio+lots of other stuff in a small slick case .. and what do we get? A pathetic not innovating little phone according to you... makes me wanna

[ This Message was edited by: S4k1s on 2005-04-26 14:41 ]

Posted by Yazan24
Its not just a pen phone, if that was what it was Id have an innovation by combining a pen and a phone with tape, its a phone which is in the shape of a pen, and u can write sms using the pen on any surface, its innovative just impractical.

The MP3 in phone concept is an old one, the first phone to play music would be considered an innovation, the high res screens is also an old thing and its a small jump from the rest, a color screen is innovative because theres nothing like it on the market, at all, the 4 screen thing was nothing ok red blue green etc. But with the T68 you could have color backgrounds etc,

Dont call me stupid because I know what Im talking abt, dont try an insult me when u dont have an argument.

Let me summarize what I said for you, since you cannot grasp it as fast as others because I said it 20 times already.

Color Screen-> Innovative, totally new idea (16 colors capable of backgrounds etc) Nothing like it on market.

Pen-> Nothing similar on market,


Both are not ordinary devices, and what is something thats not ordinary??? EXTRAORDINARY.

SEE LEARNING IS FUN.


MP3 in Phone-> Been there done that got the tshirt,

High res screens, we're already capable of having backgrounds etc with our regular screens, what does a high res screen bring thats new besides clarity?

Etc.

Now please STFU and let the grown ups talk.

Posted by S4k1s
ROFLMAO
4 colors -> 16 colors is an UPGRADE not something EXTRAORDINARY

"Pen-> Nothing similar on market, "
Yeah right, you have pens on the market + you have phones .. 2 products combined == Not Innovative.

"Dont call me stupid because I know what Im talking abt, dont try an insult me when u dont have an argument. "
You said Nokia 7250 was smaller than T610 ..

"and STFU"? WTF do u think you'r talking to, your mom?

"let the grown ups talk"? way to go you grown up, thinking that showing a background is innovative

MAC having backgrounds and graphic GUI + mouse back in 1992 == EXTRAORDINARY, not Ericsson having BG in phones 2003..

"since you cannot grasp it as fast as others"? heh
Try to grasp this my friend ...

From what you saying when a copmany other that SE combines 2 EXISTING things, lets say a ... pen and a phone, it makes them innovative ... but when SE combines 2 things it makes them pathetic ..

"Color Screen-> Innovative, totally new idea (16 colors capable of backgrounds etc) Nothing like it on market. "
I still can't let this go .. 16 colors is innovative
My Casio calculator had Color Screen back in 1997

Anything you can come up with as EXTRAORDINARY I can shoot it down just like that .. cuz what is Innovative to YOU might be crap to ME and vise versa.

First time I replied to your msg was cuz you said TheCell didn't have braincells, Only cuz he thought some things is innovative and you didn't.
You got personal with him and then with me. I could drag this conversation along untill Esato bans me just to show u how stupid you are.

I guess we all have different levels of what we see as Innovative .. but then we must use same judgement on everything.

Now some one making a device to slap you over the net == Innovative, EXTRAORDINARY

Posted by vivek_h
have you ever thought...
taht dint release a 3d motion phone cause its a shit idea..no point in making a phone that does stuff when u move it...
why make an innovation when its of no point at all..thats not an innovation..its just a waste of money and time...

samsung...are losers..they are making all these 5mp, 7mp phones...why..cause they are losing out on the camera cell market.....so they just jumped to 7 mp..u think any other manufacturer cant do that?..sony with its cybershot experience can do that anyday....but why dint they...cause they are business minded..not out there for to have fun...they gonna make the most of eevry step in the cameras thouroughly...

and yazan my mate...the 7610 aint got a 1.3 mp camera...its got a 1 mp camera
do ur homework before u make ur claims...

_________________
...i maybe wrong, but then i might even be right...

[ This Message was edited by: vivek_h on 2005-04-26 18:00 ]

Posted by slattery69
samsung...are losers..they are making all these 5mp, 7mp phones...why..cause they are losing out on the camera cell market.....so they just jumped to 7 mp..u think any other manufacturer cant do that?..sony with its cybershot experience can do that anyday....but why dint they...cause they are business minded..not out there for to have fun...they gonna make the most of eevry step in the cameras thouroughly...

is this why with all se experience they couldnt make a decent cam phone till the k700 and in reality only have 2 good cam phones out the k700 and the s700.
if you think se are innovitive fine if you dont fine, but really this thread shouldnt be getting personnal and slagging each other off.


Posted by bart
the platform that SE uses for there phones is made by ericsson, remeber that, the platform it self has got much more potential and features that SE uses (wants to use).
ericsson (together with psion and nokia) invented symbian, thats something new, i would call it innovation.
a flipphone with touchscreen (before the motorola accomplia 008) its called innovation. ericsson has got over 100 patents and some of them are used in several phones.

and if size does matter what about the T66? that was a very small one, SE's T600/T200/T100/T105 where much bigger.

the only thing wi'll be seeing that S added in the future is new pda's running on palm OS. why? sony has decided to put its CLIE line in hands of SE, so SE would also have the right to use palm OS. devices with linux will be lauched aswell, the first one is the ROB-1 (thats inovatoin, but its an acc, and thats rather easy to innovate).

Posted by vivek_h
@slattery69..
my argument is not that se are innovative..
i just dont like the way yazan is dissing every thign that se made as being non innovative......
does he mean to say that se are the worst brand in the mobile scene? i mean..he comes to a site for se...then he starts sayin se sucks...i mean comeon...what kinda response du u expect....

and all this bout ericsson being the innovator and not sony...i dont see how it makes sense...ericsson is now 'sony ericsson'... so they can only add to their innovations...doesnt anyone notice that ericsson still exists?

Posted by thecell
Yazan24
- T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
It was smallest and with large screen and bluetooth.

- K700 not the smallest Vid Cam of its time
Even K700i smaller than T610, which phone had unlimited video recording smaller than K700i

- S700 not the first 1.3 MP Cam of its time
I didn't say it has 1st 1.3mp CAm, i say it really looks like a real camera phone, it design looks like camera and it CCD and Sony implement their digital camera technology and design on S700i.

- P910 based on P800 an ericsson product.
Yeah, if P800 not SE, you will never see jogdial on it.

- K600i Smallest 3G phone isnt an innovation
U think it easy to make a 3G high tech phone on small size ??

- W800 walkman phone WOW, now our phone plays music, oh wait, didnt we already have that.
It special cause it ability to turn off the phone and run the walkman featured, SE will never call this phone "Walkman" if it doesn't have different to other music phones.

Posted by slattery69
i wasnt having a pop at you over it just both side should be able to argue without name calling. i noticed you managed and bart from the opssing view managed to present there arguements without having a personal digs and long may that continue.
nothing wrong with people having opposite opinions thats what makes these boards interesting the personal attacks aint intesresting

Posted by thecell
Yazan

May i ask you what the innovation that u really want to see from SE, please give a little example.

Posted by slattery69
i must confess i dont think the w800 is anything more than great marketing it doesnt do much that a normal phone with built in mp3 player can do appart from flight mode. which alot of airlines dont give a monkeys about they just tell you to turn it off.
its very innoviative from a marketing stand point at the end of the day i think you buy what suits you i can see where yazan is coming from but i can see the other side and how people can be wowed by certain things

Posted by S4k1s
slattery69 I guess I got personal to

But it is things like _this_ that makes me angry!

"Oh and biodegrable phones arent innovative, they utilize existing technology (biodegradable plastics) and implement them in phones, and itll probably only be available to Japan, so its not that important. "

The guy p00ps at everything SE does as non innovative!

I don't say SE is most innovative brand or that I love SE to death .. u can check my comments on other treads here about what I think is good/bad about SE..

But plZz, Yazan24 say "they utilize existing technology ... and implement them in phones" << this kind of stuff is what I think is so stupid with his comments. According to this comment _nothing_ SE, Nokia, Moto or any other company will make is innovative, but still for Yazan24, combining a PEN (existing technology) with a PHONE (existing technology) ... (pen implemented in phone) is EXTRAORDINARY

Pen Phone is Innovative .. biodegrable phones arent innovative..

I read this tread and I laugh

[ This Message was edited by: S4k1s on 2005-04-26 19:13 ]

Posted by vivek_h
yea slattery, i agree with ya...
the w800i is just a k750i with a walkman tag, a 512 mb stick(instead of 64), flight mode, and funky colours...
the 750 got everything else it has...for a much cheaper price...
buts tahts business...make a similar phone, add a couple of features, and add a well known brand tag to it...and voila..people think its somethign completely different...

i doubt w800i will sell a lot....whoever wants an mp3 player wudve bought the 750 by the time the 800 releases...


Posted by Yazan24
VIVEK, I agree with you the W800 is very close to the K750, just marketing, similar to the approach Nokia take.

Pens are existing technology and phones are existing technology,

are pen phones existing technology, its not a normal pen dumbass, its writes SMS, through movement detection, There are things like that in the market but the first people to come up with the movement detection are innovators.

Biodegrable phones arent new, Moto had a similar idea, and trashed it as bart said, WHEN THE PHONES COME OUT (Another 10 years) and theyre biodegrable we'll argue about that.

Calm down, I use normal insults, you insulted my mom, real mature. How old are you again?

But seriously, the color screen by Ericsson was an innovation, due to the fact that it opened up new possibilities, the 4 color screen didnt allow anything but a partially colored screen, and if you were old enough at the time and used it you wouldve realized it was a normal siemens just with colors allocated somewhat randomly.

However the 16 color screen allowed backgrounds themes etc, something that was never available before, it opened up ENDLESS possibilities that we still see today. Hence it wasnt just a color upgrade, it allowed endless functionality advances.

Bluetooth, one of the best mobile innovations in the past decade.

Lets keep this thread going on on the right path, so watch what you say, Im trying to prove my point, I dont want the thread to be locked, if you dont have anything nice to say, please dont say anything at all.

ALSO- I didnt say the Nokia was smaller, I said there were phones that were in the same range as the T610 smaller/larger and it is only larger by 2mm in one dimension, so WHO DOESNT KNOW WHAT THEYRE TALKING ABT NOW.

_________________
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MP3 Ringtones? Oh yeah Laffen killed them.

[ This Message was edited by: Yazan24 on 2005-04-26 19:50 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Yazan24 on 2005-04-26 19:52 ]

Posted by vanquish
This thread is hilarious, you're all going round in circles.

Lets work out what the word innovative actually means and then compare Sony Ericsson to Ericsson.

"1: a creation (a new device or process) resulting from study and experimentation [syn: invention] 2: the creation of something in the mind [syn: invention, excogitation, conception, design] 3: the act of starting something for the first time; introducing something new; "she looked forward to her initiation as an adult"; "the foundation of a new scientific society"; "he regards the fork as a modern introduction" [syn: initiation, founding, foundation, institution, origination, creation, introduction, instauration]"

Okay, Ericsson may have been more innovative in terms of the SECOND point in this dictionary reference. They created things new because back then new technologies were suddenly taking off. Colour screens, bluetooth, gprs, active flips etc.

Now that technology is very advanced, there is alot of additional innovation to already created models. This is where Sony Ericsson come in. I feel they are more suited to the first point in the dictionary reference "a creation (a new device or process) resulting from study and experimentation " . They have done much experimentation and consequently not created something out of the blue and new as such but something refined and individual and amazing. This sums it up to be innovative because they have created something after it has undergone extensive experimentation and research. There are 2 megapixel phones out there, but the K750 was the first to adapt a candy bar style, or one of them, in Europe. The K750 was experimented and worked on for a long time, thus does it not have the right to be called innovative? It may not be on the same level of innovation as the T68m but its on its own level of innovation in a world where technology is advancing and the timescale between newly developed microchips is shortening. Just because something isn't a major breakthrough like what Ericsson had up its sleeve doesnt mean it isnt innovative.

I hope what i have said makes sense and i am quite happy to clarify my points to you, its late and im busy watching television .

Posted by goldenface
Title says SE have never been innovative - the reason? basically because for everything SE have ever done, it has never invented Bluetooth like Ericsson did.

@Yazan. So putting a 1.3mp cam, Radio, Organiser, Video Recorder, sound recorder, Internet Browser, 3G, BT, USB port etc, into a package the size of small cigarette packet isn't innovative? come on! Inventing the wheel is innovative. Does that mean inventing the Pneumatic Tyre isn't? You have a funny idea of innovative.


Posted by Yazan24
It is, but it has already been done before,

Someone said in the late 1800's everything that is worth inventing, has already been invented.

Which is exactly what your suggesting now, its only because if we knew what the next big innovative thing was, we'd patent it and be billionaires.

So its difficult to suggest what innovative is now, all we can describe it as is something big, new and will change the industry its implemented in forever.

I guess we'll have to wait and see.

Lets just keep it at that, and LOCK this thread. Hehehe.

Posted by S4k1s
there u go personal again ... me a dumbass? hehe
Quote:
Calm down, I use normal insults, you insulted my mom, real mature. How old are you again?


I didn't insult your mom dude .. use your brain cells and read it again
And as far as my age goes ... you are on need to know basis on that
So here we go again ... (I hope u understand by now I do this for fun only )

quotes are from your (Yazan24) posts in this thread..
Quote:

Oh and biodegrable phones arent innovative, they utilize existing technology (biodegradable plastics) and implement them in phones


So utilizing existing technology and implement it in phones is not Innovative.

Quote:
There are things like that in the market but the first people to come up with the movement detection are innovators.


Quote:
But seriously, the color screen by Ericsson was an innovation


So are you saying Ericsson Invented the color screen?
No, in fact Ericsson implemented the color screen in a phone wich according to you my m8 isn't Innovative.

Quote:
I dont want the thread to be locked, if you dont have anything nice to say, please dont say anything at all.


Don't be calling other people names then or degrade them in any way.

Quote:
ALSO- I didnt say the Nokia was smaller, I said there were phones that were in the same range as the T610 smaller/larger and it is only larger by 2mm in one dimension, so WHO DOESNT KNOW WHAT THEYRE TALKING ABT NOW.


Actually you said:
Quote:
T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
-Several Phones by other Manufacturers are within the same size range smaller/larger by mm, eg. N7250-


N7250 ... mm ... 3mm is 3mm ... == 3mm BiGGER
And I told you to look at the tech. specs m8,
Man. SE Nokia
Model T610 7250
Height 102 105
Talktime (m) 840 300
Email Yes No
Bluetooth Yes No
Number of colours 65536 4096
Voicedialing Yes No
Display height 160 128
Voicememo Yes No
And T610 is a smaller phone
Btw wich one came out first?

Quote:
Bluetooth, one of the best mobile innovations in the past decade.


Yes, agree .. but still BT in the phone is not Innovative .. it's just a implementation.


And while I'm at it, lets end this m8, you are exactly proving me wrong here ok

Posted by batesie
/// Ericsson - Innovators in Telecommunications
Sony - Innovators in High Quality electronics.

b4 and since They have raised the standards in Mobile phone technology so much, most people take it for granted.

Posted by Yazan24
You quoted me saying this: -

T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
-Several Phones by other Manufacturers are within the same size range smaller/larger by mm, eg. N7250-

Which Says smaller/larger. So read clearly,

Bluetooth is not an implementation, ERICSSON INVENTED IT.

If you read the other posts, it says that the biodeg phones wont hit the market for a while.

And Implementing with modifying which will lead to several major changes in the future, are partially innovations, theyre called incremental designs.

Please I thought this thread was settled but clearly, you're too immature to leave it at that and want to be right at the end.

But your not.

Live with it.



Posted by Yazan24
[quote]


Quote:
ALSO- I didnt say the Nokia was smaller, I said there were phones that were in the same range as the T610 smaller/larger and it is only larger by 2mm in one dimension, so WHO DOESNT KNOW WHAT THEYRE TALKING ABT NOW.


Actually you said:
Quote:
T610 not the smallest camera phone of its time.
-Several Phones by other Manufacturers are within the same size range smaller/larger by mm, eg. N7250-




READ THIS LINE

-Several Phones by other Manufacturers are within the same size range smaller/larger by mm-

IT MEANS, SOME PHONES ARE IN THE SAME SIZE RANGE.
Idiots piss me off.

Please lock this thread.



Posted by goldenface
But innovative doesn't mean big and new and the K600 IS innovative simply because of its size and features.


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