Polls Give Encouraging News to Bush

Posted by Patrick-in-CA
Poor John Kerry isn't doing as well as expected:

Quote:

Polls Give Encouraging News to Bush
Associated Press
Friday, April 23, 2004

WASHINGTON — In Maryland, pollster Patrick Gonzales is surprised that Democrat John Kerry isn't farther ahead in such a solidly Democratic state. In New Hampshire, Republican Tom Rath is encouraged that President Bush has retained his footing in a state where he was pummeled relentlessly during the Democratic primaries.

Bush can tick off a number of states where polls now show him to be on better footing than he was at the end of his November 2000 showdown withAl Gore. But Kerry's camp says that's no cause for Democrats to be concerned. In almost every state, according to Kerry's campaign, Bush was doing better at this point in 2000 than he is this time around.

"Just because Bush is doing better does not mean he's going to win," said independent pollster Ed Sarpolus in Michigan, where Bush has held his ground against Kerry despite lukewarm job and favorability ratings.

"You have to understand that for the last 30 days, John Kerry's been invisible," Sarpolus said, noting that the public focus on Kerry dropped off sharply after his much-watched march to the Democratic presidential nomination. At the same time, he added, Bush was unleashing a barrage of TV ads that battered Kerry and promoted his own policies.

Nonetheless, there is some surprise that Kerry isn't doing better at this point in some states.

In reliably Democratic Maryland, Kerry had a slight lead in the latest poll.

"This is a state that Gore won by 17 points," said Gonzales, an independent pollster whose survey gave Kerry a 5-point edge. "I would expect Kerry at this point to be doing better."

Gonzales predicted Bush has hit his high-water mark in the state, though, and said he expects Democrats to close ranks behind Kerry once they get to know him better.

"Fundamentally, I think it is a case that people don't know enough about him," Gonzales said.

In New Jersey, where Gore thumped Bush by 16 points four years ago, the candidates are in a virtual tie this time.

"We are a 9/11 state," said David Rebovich, a political science professor at Rider University in Lawrenceville, N.J., referring to those who lost their lives in the World Trade Center attacks. "I think the president benefits residually from New Jerseyans rallying around the president."

Furthermore, he said, voters in a state so closely tied to Wall Street "may cut Bush some slack" because of the improving economy. "There may be some trepidation that John Kerry's economic policies will rescind tax cuts and scare Wall Street and affect people's jobs."

Despite all that, though, Rebovich believes New Jersey voters are likely to fall in behind a New England liberal when they consider the candidates' stances on issues such as gun control, abortion rights and the environment.

Bush has been slightly ahead in national polls, a strong standing that is showing up in some key swing states like New Hampshire and Pennsylvania. But with the nation narrowly divided and the polls relatively close, outside events like Iraq and the economy are influencing which candidate has the upper hand in a given week.

In some states, the latest numbers look just as tight as the 2000 election results. In Florida, for example, where the 2000 vote was so close it took the Supreme Court to decide the winner, Bush and Kerry were neck-and-neck in a survey released Thursday. In Iowa, where Gore edged Bush by 1 point four years ago, it's tight again. A Los Angeles Times poll released Friday showed Kerry leading Bush by 10 points in California, a slightly smaller margin than the 12 points by which Gore carried the state in 2000.

Kerry campaign pollster Mark Mellman cautions against focusing too closely on state-by-state polling results this early in the campaign. In New Jersey, for example, Bush had a slight edge on Gore at the start of May 2000, he said.

That month, Bush had the edge on Gore in Michigan but lost to the Democrat by 5 points in November. At this point, Bush and Kerry are neck-and-neck in the state.

"That strikes me as very, very good news for Kerry in the context of the volume of ads that President Bush has been doing over the last six weeks," said Ken Brock, a Democratic consultant in Michigan. "He's really poured it on." If Kerry can match Bush's advertising down the home stretch, Brock predicted, "he'll begin to take back some of what he may have lost."

In New Hampshire, where Bush edged Gore by 1 point in 2000, Bush now has a slight edge despite the pounding he took during the run-up to the state's leadoff Democratic primaries.

"What's significant is that Bush has retained his footing," says Rath, a state Republican Party leader. "This state was really the belly of the beast. He got pummeled here for 10 months. ... For Bush to have come back is good."

Bush has edged ahead of Kerry in Pennsylvania, a critical swing state that Gore won by 5 points in 2000.

Mike Young, managing director of Madonna Young Opinion Research, attributes Bush's gains to his "persistent presence" in the state. Since taking office, Bush has visited Pennsylvania more frequently than any other state; his 27th trip was Monday.

_________________
Thanks for taking the time to read my post.

[ This Message was edited by: Patrick-in-CA on 2004-07-24 20:07 ]

Posted by BobaFett
I am a well behaived boy, so no comment of mr bush and his band. Off to the toilet...

Posted by Patrick-in-CA
Hey Bobafet - I hope everything comes out well in the end!

Posted by BobaFett
I ll pray for kerry! Wish @axxxr would be here! He ll love this thread!

Posted by batesie
its not my business who runs america, thats up to the american people. but www.stopesso.com shows a bit about the link between the worlds richest company, and the place with the most oil in the world (iraq)

Posted by boto43
Hey guys, who cares here about the elections in the USA? Not me.

Posted by BobaFett
@boto but maybe other do.

Posted by Sammy_boy
The thing is, what happens in America will probably have some effect on all of us, especially anyone living in a supposed 'axis of evil' country! (although I'd be more than happy to see N. Korea or Zimababwe's governments taken out, it'd be better if their own people got rid of them)

Especially if the person in charge of the US manages to make global terrorism worse with their 'war on terror'

Look at what happened in Spain in March this year.

Posted by BobaFett
Donnow much about kerry, but anybody is better then this cowboy.

Posted by kimcheeboi
I expect something unprecedented this election- major turnout of minorities and young voters.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-25 03:56:15, KiMcHeEbOi wrote:
I expect something unprecedented this election- major turnout of minorities and young voters.

I hope you're right. It would be very nice to see more involvement in the political process here.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Posted by Blexcroid
Nice pic m8. Now that he's 'hip' mebbe his alcoholic daughters will actually listen to him! Lord knows that none of the rest of the kids in the nation take him seriously.

Posted by axxxr
Patrick that bush TURBANATOR pic is RACIST and offensive to a lot of muslims and sikhs alike, who in both faiths wear Turbans as a religious symbol.You may find this funny but i certainly don't.Once again you have proven that Republicans don't have any respect for muslims,hence your war on Islam.

Posted by kimcheeboi
yeah @axxxr i gotta agree with you--as a joke the picture would have been funny, but now, considering some of the most important issues in this world, its not funny at all.

Posted by Sammy_boy
@patrick I'm guessing you're not actually racist - at least I hope you're not! That 'Turbanator' poster, whether it's meant or not does look racist.

I've got a short-wave radio, and can pick up one or two of those 'religious right' stations - one of which does quite openly promote a war on Islam and the Christianity is and should be the only world faith. This worries me - is this opinion widespread in the US? I sincerely hope not.

Posted by axxxr

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 09:43:21, Sammy_boy wrote:
@patrick I'm guessing you're not actually racist - at least I hope you're not! That 'Turbanator' poster, whether it's meant or not does look racist.

This poster may not look racist but it does send out a very racist message.By posting such a statement confirms that the person is a racist!

Posted by Patrick-in-CA
Well - it's called humor.

And where is it racist? Point it out to me please. I need a little help on this one.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 09:43:21, Sammy_boy wrote:
I've got a short-wave radio, and can pick up one or two of those 'religious right' stations - one of which does quite openly promote a war on Islam and the Christianity is and should be the only world faith. This worries me - is this opinion widespread in the US? I sincerely hope not.

It is not. And just keep this in mind. There are many opinions. And in any group of large size there will be a minority whos opinions are extreme and outrageous. We are no exception. We are actually interested in fighting the "extreme" elements of Islam, not becoming an "extreme" element of Christianity ourselves!

Posted by axxxr
TURBANATOR pic is RACIST and offensive to a lot of muslims and sikhs alike, who in both faiths wear Turbans as a religious symbol.You may find this funny but i certainly don't..You have again proven yourself to be racist as is your republican stance on Islam.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 14:26:45, axxxr wrote:
TURBANATOR pic is RACIST and offensive to a lot of muslims and sikhs alike, who in both faiths wear Turbans as a religious symbol.You may find this funny but i certainly don't..You have again proven yourself to be racist as is your republican stance on Islam.

Well Axxxr ... I, in all honesty, cannot deny that from time to time I have used stereotypes about the perceived race of an individual to come to a premature and incorrect conclusion about them. It isn't right and it is a trait I try hard to face about myself and not repeat. I have made mistakes in the past about being a real racist. As I continue to talk to people and break down the negative stereotypes I've once believed in the racism I've had in me becomes weaker and weaker.

I've noticed that many people throw around the word racist to label and marginalize people they don't want to have to listen to. It is an ugly thing to call someone and it is a serious accusation. I wouldn't blame you if you felt upset or even rage if someone unfairly called you a racist in public.

But about the Turbanator poster. Is it racist? Let's see. What race wears the Turban? Is the turban a symbol of any particular race? What is "Race"?

race n.

A local geographic or global human population distinguished as a more or less distinct group by genetically transmitted physical characteristics.
A group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic distribution: the German race.
A genealogical line; a lineage.
Humans considered as a group.

Honestly people ... think about this one before jumping to a conclusion.

Being offensive isn't necessarily being racist.

Being racist is always offensive.

rac·ism n.

The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Was there any prejudice or discrimination in this poster directed at a race? Or is it directed more at a symbol of a particular religion? Does disagreement - or even hatred of a particular religion - count as racism? I think to hate all people perceived to be of a particular religion or who are perceived to adhere to a particular cultural practice is bigoted - don't you think? Honestly ... help me on this. I sincerely want to learn this. I'm open to know if I've been misunderstanding this.

And if I'm wright - and the picture is bigoted ... does it make me bigoted to post it? Who does it show? When you look at it, tell me if it makes G.W. Bush look good or bad. I'm going to venture a guess. Many of you think it shows G.W. Bush in a poor light - yes? I just happen to agree. I saw it and laughed. It, I believe, is critical of Bush ... not pro. SO ... if you posted a picture that tended to show someone as a bigot - does that make you a bigot or racist?

So - back to the ugly slurs people throw at each other. Although I deal with the racism I've grown up with all the time ... and although I know I have lots to learn ... I am not as toxic a racist as Axxxr has accused me of being.

I suspect Axxxr is just unwilling to discuss the real issues in a real head on debate. Many may not agree with my positions - but I promise I will not label you in order to get people to marginalize what you say or to try to stop you from expressing your arguments. But I will make a good argument for my side of the debate.

P.S. - I'm not Christian and I know far too little about Islam to judge it in any way at this time.
P.S.S. - But if I did know enough about it to have an opinion on it - that still wouldn't make me a racist - EVEN if I didn't agree with any part of it at all.

Posted by anish
Well said Patric. Some people did need a lesson on what the meaning of racism is since they run around shouting racism a lot.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 16:30:42, anish wrote:
Well said Patric. Some people did need a lesson on what the meaning of racism is since they run around shouting racism a lot.

It is an unfortunate reality. I try not to label people carelessly. I am lots of things - and many of them may not be all that good - but I'm not a racist. And if I am - I don't want to be - and I'm willing to learn.

And as someone wise once said: The truth shall set you free!

Posted by axxxr
Well patrick giving long and detailed explainations does'nt put in the clear and the TURBANATOR poster refers to killing of many thousands of taliban and Afghan people by american troops!who wore TURBANS by the way in case u did'nt know!!..

And Anish you have made it absolutely clear to me your dislike and hatred of muslims.and what does that make you??...Yes correct a RACIST!...so don't try and hide behind cocky remarks.

Anish and patrick and can form there own little club now!!!

Posted by whizkidd
Hey guys is this getting serious? Please stop this. We have had similar discussions in the past. We have better things to discuss than racism.

Posted by anish

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 16:50:33, axxxr wrote:
And Anish you have made it absolutely clear to me your dislike and hatred of muslims.and what does that make you??...Yes correct a RACIST!...so don't try and hide behind cocky remarks.

Anish and patrick and can form there own little club now!!!

If some people don't learn even after reading then we can't do any thing to help them I thought the explanation Patric gave above was so well explained in simple english that a 6 year old could understand that

but once again even if I hate all muslims, which I don't and have made it amply clear that I have many friends who are muslims and I come from a country which has the second highest muslim population in the world, that doesn't make me a Racist by the definition of the word racist try to understand that. What I said in the other threads is about the extremists like Abu hamsa here in UK (thank god he is behind the bars )

now you always mention about hiding behind forums and posts (you said the same in the george bush thread), I don't know where you got that illusion that I am hiding, I am here on a public forum for a over a year have made more than 500 quality posts helping people about phone issues (not garbage and copy pasting) and I am even using my own name as my username something which you are not brave enough to do so it's well clear that its you who are hiding behind a pseudonym and shouting RACISM when ever you find it hard to make a rational well supported argument. Also it is not me who requests through PM not to reply to your posts and not to challenge your arguments, thats very brave as well I assume.

Posted by batesie
ive known extreme rasists. ive gone out of my way to help them open there mind to the subject, and remove their hatred, but ended up putting as much distance from them as possible. all of them have the same trait. narrow-mindedness. this always seemed to be due to fact that they treat people of other races as in-animate objects. like a picture, for instance... if patrick knew someone that wears a turban, he wouldnt have posted that picture. narrow minded people dont want to know that some people of other cultures have different beliefs, so all they see is a picture. it OBVIOUSLY doesnt help with a extremist leader in america blinding the people to the real truth behind the other motivations of the invasion of iraq.... anyway, wish i had more time to follow this up, but i'll second, whatever @axxxr writes.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 16:50:33, axxxr wrote:
Well patrick giving long and detailed explainations does'nt put in the clear and the TURBANATOR poster refers to killing of many thousands of taliban and Afghan people by american troops!who wore TURBANS by the way in case u did'nt know!!..

Thank you for continuing to talk to me ...

Yes... The Turbanator does refer to exactly what you say. As I mentioned in my "long and detailed" post above - which you apparently didn't take the time to read - the poster tends to show bush as a killer of those who wear Turbans ... not a good guy.

Let's see if I can make this easier for you to comprehend.

IT ... IS ... AN ... ANTI ... BUSH ... POSTER

I'm afraid I'm not going to be able to make it any more plain - so I hope you understand what I'm saying now.

For everyone else reading this post just think of it this way:
If Axxxr posted that picture we would all assume it was an Anti-Bush poster and that even though it showed Bush as a Bigot or Racist ... it would not have made ANYONE think Axxxr was a Racist.

Quote:

And Anish you have made it absolutely clear to me your dislike and hatred of muslims.and what does that make you??...Yes correct a RACIST!...so don't try and hide behind cocky remarks.

I know you're not talking to me anymore, Axxxr, but as you've asserted that you don't talk to Racists ... you sure seem to do a lot of talking with those you've labeled as such!

And once again - I ask - how does hating a particular religion (read: Belief system with ways of worshiping and relating to the world) make one a racist? If you hate people just because they belong to a particular religion it might be reasonable to call you a bigot. But if you hate a religion ... well, I guess you just hate that religion.

Remember there are Muslims of just about all, if not all, races. (this assumes that you believe in the concept of actual races - which I have a hard time with because it is all about perception, not scientific reality)

Now I haven't read all Anish has posted so I don't know for sure if he is a racist or bigot OR not. But if you were as quick to call Anish a racist as you were me ... then I can only assume your accusation against him is just as credible.

Quote:

Anish and patrick and can form there own little club now!!!

Woo hoo! Can I be the president of the club?

Posted by whizkidd
I would like to make one point clear. Just accusing somebody of being a racist on the basis of a paragraph he has written isn't right. I am not supporting or against anybody. Also i can't see that pic on WAP so i can't comment on that.

Posted by axxxr
Yeh whatever Anish....Its best if i do not get into any debate with the likes of you..I would love to meet you face to face the see how much of a man your really!..thats asumeing your a man at all!..I suggest you refrain from getting into any kind of debate with me as we obviously don't see eye to eye on anything.

Goodbye!!

Posted by anish
Oops I was late in claiming my presidetial post of the club, Can I be the official news editor of the club, that is if the club needs one.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 17:14:59, batesie wrote:
ive known extreme rasists. ive gone out of my way to help them open there mind to the subject, and remove their hatred, but ended up putting as much distance from them as possible. all of them have the same trait. narrow-mindedness. this always seemed to be due to fact that they treat people of other races as in-animate objects. like a picture, for instance... if patrick knew someone that wears a turban, he wouldnt have posted that picture. narrow minded people dont want to know that some people of other cultures have different beliefs, so all they see is a picture. it OBVIOUSLY doesnt help with a extremist leader in america blinding the people to the real truth behind the other motivations of the invasion of iraq.... anyway, wish i had more time to follow this up, but i'll second, whatever @axxxr writes.

Point well taken ... it is indeed a narrow mind that thinks of people as inanimate objects. Dehumanizing your opponent is one of the ways of being able to motivate your side in the act of war against them. Making your opponent non-human makes it easier to kill them. It is a sad but real truth.

However (and you knew my "however" was coming)!

I think of this as an Anti-Bush picture. Not Pro-Bush.

And how do you know I don't know of anyone who wears a turban? Well, you're right ... I don't. So what? You don't know all the cultures of the world, do you? Are you personally acquainted with at least one person from each and every culture and religion on the face of the earth? No - I don't think so! So does that make you insensitive to them? Only as much as you accuse me of being insensitive.

Instead - let's take a look at the picture itself. It's an Anti-Bush picture that shows him as one who is picking all people who wear a turban and marking them all for termination. It's a play on words. Ya know ... if Axxxr had posted this Anti-Bush poster I highly doubt you would have called him a racist and insensitive to those who wear turbans.

It is my opinion that some here need to lighten up and not take themselves so seriously. I am not the keeper of ultimate truth - nor are you.

Posted by anish

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 17:20:22, axxxr wrote:
Yeh whatever Anish....Its best if i do not get into any debate with the likes of you..I would love to meet you face to face the see how much of a man your really!..thats asumeing your a man at all!..I suggest you refrain from getting into any kind of debate with me as we obviously don't see eye to eye on anything.

Goodbye!!

Oops should I be scared !!!!! that you want to meet me face to face

Again you don't know how to make an argument or to do a debate do you? Try to grow up Axxxr instead of calling people names try to prove your point by making logical arguments. If you took the time to read and understand what I wrote in the previous post you would see I gave enough reasons to make you understand that I am man enough to use my own name as a user name in a public forum and to be in this forum for over an year. I also challenged your credibility for making similar arguments and instead of proving my arguments wrong you are back to name calling. Once again is it running away from arguments and debates what you call manliness in your country? I pity you.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 17:20:22, axxxr wrote:
Yeh whatever Anish....Its best if i do not get into any debate with the likes of you..I would love to meet you face to face the see how much of a man your really!..thats asumeing your a man at all!..

Oooooooo Oooooooo ... He's questioning you manhood!

Hey Anish ... forgive me. What gender are you?

Quote:

I suggest you refrain from getting into any kind of debate with me as we obviously don't see eye to eye on anything.

I suggest we all debate ... isn't that what we came here for? And, if your real careful and try real hard ... you might learn something. I know I will. Now don't take this wrong, but not seeing eye to eye is no reason not to debate (hell, there'd be no debate at all if we all saw eye to eye). However, the only good reason not to debate is when you cannot defend your opinion.

Posted by anish
I just noticed, that was a very sexist remark by axxxr above does that mean you wouldn't talk to me if I were a woman?

Posted by axxxr
Which part of i do not wish to get into any debate with do you not understand?..I can get into a civilised debate with civilised people yes.but sorry i don't feel that i can have a civilised discussion with you.Just coz you think you have used your real name in does'nt make u some kind of hero!.In the majority of Forums 90% of people use nicks so your suggesting the ppl who use nicks are cowards?..grow up mate!..And for your Information in our country we only debate with people who think are worthy of it..so sorry to dissapoint you mate but i don't find chatting to you entertaining or inspiring!..i might still consider learning a few things from patrick as he is a college professor.

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 17:48:33, axxxr wrote:
Which part of i do not wish to get into any debate with do you not understand?..I can get into a civilised debate with civilised people yes.but sorry i don't feel that i can have a civilised discussion with you.Just coz you think you have used your real name in does'nt make u some kind of hero!.In the majority of Forums 90% of people use nicks so your suggesting the ppl who use nicks are cowards?..grow up mate!..And for your Information in our country we only debate with people who think are worthy of it..so sorry to dissapoint you mate but i don't find chatting to you entertaining or inspiring!..i might still consider learning a few things from patrick as he is a college professor.

I'm a student. But thank you for the compliment.

Posted by axxxr
You told me that you were a college proffessor..LIAR!!

Posted by anish
Alright calling people stupid, idiot, ignorant, racist, uncivilised etc are definitely marks of a great civilisation and could you please name that civilisation, as I am ignorant.

So its ok for you to use nic names but you still think I am hiding behind the forums, you are good in making logical assumptions

And finally I don't think education is the only factor which makes a person knowledgable even then for your kind information I am First class graduate in commerce and also have Master degree in Business Adminstration with specialisation in Information Management.

Posted by axxxr

Quote:

And finally I don't think education is the only factor which makes a person knowledgable even then for your kind information I am First class graduate in commerce and also have Master degree in Business Adminstration with specialisation in Information Management.

Congratulations!...shall i send u some flowers??

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 18:03:23, axxxr wrote:
You told me that you were a college proffessor..LIAR!!

Once again labeling people without doing you homework. If you can show me where I said that then you're right. If not, you're beginning to get real ugly with these false accusations ... calling people stupid, idiots, racists, and liars.

Posted by axxxr
Take it easy mate!!..

Posted by anish

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 18:22:16, axxxr wrote:
Quote:
And finally I don't think education is the only factor which makes a person knowledgable even then for your kind information I am First class graduate in commerce and also have Master degree in Business Adminstration with specialisation in Information Management.

Congratulations!...shall i send u some flowers??

Again running away from the actual issue or debate . Quoted half of my post and tried to answer for the least important bit in that post
Hats off to you

Posted by axxxr
Which part of "I DON'T LIKE TALKING TO YOU"do you not understand??

Posted by Patrick-in-CA

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 19:53:37, axxxr wrote:
Which part of "I DON'T LIKE TALKING TO YOU"do you not understand??

Odd... I can't speak for anyone else but ... just so you know ... I'm not debating with you for your pleasure.

Posted by axxxr

Quote:

I can't speak for anyone else but ... just so you know ... I'm not debating with you for your pleasure.

I was'nt refering to you patrick!...My comment was for Anish.

Posted by anish

Quote:

On 2004-07-26 19:53:37, axxxr wrote:
Which part of "I DON'T LIKE TALKING TO YOU"do you not understand??

If you can read look back and you can see you still talked to me twice after saying that line. Try to be consistent mate. Further if you don't like talikng to me then its you who have to stop not me, or is it also part of the civilisation????

Posted by masseur
I guess we only need one bush thread so lets keep it there... well as long a it stays on topic and friendly, anyway

George W. Bush;s Resume (C.V)