Posted by scotsboyuk
Möglicherweise ist eine bessere Idee, die unverständlichste Sprache zu versuchen und einzutippen, die wir finden können.
Posted by boto43
I can follow you but Elrond must translate it to me.
Posted by Elrond
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@boto Mozno ze je lepsi napad, aby sme vyskusali viacero jazykov a tipnut si, ktore sme nasli.
I will be here as translator.
Posted by scotsboyuk
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Or I could just post in English.
Posted by Elrond
That would be simplest.
Posted by boto43
Elrond try Polish or Russian.
Czech would be very easy to you becouse you are Slovak.
Must go watering my garden.
hm, my wife orderd to me.
Shes allways very unhappy to see me sitting in front of my all pcs.
:
Posted by Elrond
Sad for you. I can't write Polish or Russian. I just understand them, you know what I mean.
[ This Message was edited by: Elrond on 2004-06-19 17:33 ]
Posted by scotsboyuk
@Elrond
Äą ˙ äåėąž.
Posted by Elrond
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WTF is that?
Posted by scotsboyuk
@Elrond
It is supposed to be Russian characters, but they obviously haven't displayed correctly.
Posted by Elrond
They didn't. But I don't know azbuka. I just know what they say. Da?
Posted by boto43
What do ppl in ur countries think that no reference to christianity in EU constitution.
some religious ppl in EU. Do christians in EU have a right to ask supplement of EU constitution.Posted by Vlammetje
Nope.
Religion and basic universal human rights are two very different things.
Besides EU has a rather large group of inhabitants that are NOT christian.
A good, fair ans olid constitution that is fair to all and holds our basic rights (and duties
) is MUCH more important imho than a hint at any religion....... Isn't 'freedom of religion' one of those right sthat the constitution is supposed to guarantee all EU citizens????
How is it supposed to do that when it's written in the context of ONE religion??
Posted by boto43
many muslims countries have the official religion in their constitutions. we can hardly say they have only muslims inhabitants.
Posted by Vlammetje
And I obviously do not support that either
But 'because other countires have it and have had it since centuries, we should do it in our 21st century constituion' is a backwards logic I fail to understand.
Many muslim countries (and also the USA) have legal executions. Should we have those to, just because they do?
Posted by Elrond
@boto You are acting like a kid. As we say: 'If somebody would jump to the well, them you would jump either to follow him?'
Posted by boto43
I'm not absolutly against the executions! What the punishment is good for murder of a young child? Or maybe I'm a murderer too ? :-(
Posted by Elrond
@boto Just one question. Are you christian?
Posted by boto43
My god what a question! No, I am not. I'm a pagan !
Posted by Vlammetje
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I think the issue at hand is not that certain crimes certainly deseve death penalty, the issue is that humans are to determine ones guilt and humans are to execute.Humans are to determine where to draw the line.
Any idea how many people in jail are innocent? What if we executed all of them? Any idea how many 'justice' systems are fully and wholly corrupt? What if your life depended on that?
We humans are simply not capable to make that judgment. No matter how much we may like to occassionally. It is not our place.
Posted by michka
I fully agree with Vlam.
Organizing a society should have nothing to do with any kind of philosophy or religion. It is the only way to ensure freedom of speech and thinking.
And killing people because WE find they are guilty is a murder.
Not to mention what evil-intentioned people can do with such rules or laws for their own interest.
Posted by scotsboyuk
I also agree with Vlamm, it is absolutely vital that the State is seperate from religion, whatever that religion might be. Correct me if I am wrong, but England and Wales are unique in Europe, in that the State is not seperate from the Church, England and Wales can be said to be weak theocracies!
I am not in favour of the EU constitution and I feel that it will be strongly rejected in this country at any rate, but if we are to have one then I should certainly like to see no mention of any religion in it. The EU is, for all its faults, a good institution, in that it has laws to safeguard the rights of the individual and to protect freedom. If we should start to elevate one religion above others then we would be attacking those rights and that freedom. People are freed to choose whichever religion (or lack of one) they want and the State should have absolutely nothing to do with such a choice. Europe has sufferred for centuries because of religious differences, often dragging non-Europeans into the trouble too; I for one feel that it is time we put such things firmly behind us and concentrated on a peaceful Europe.
As for the issue of the dealth penalty, I really am aghast that such a thing should even be suggested. As has been stated before, we humans are not capable of making that judgement. Executing someone does nothing to correct the wrong and merely causes more sufferring and anguish, we would do much better to try and prevent crimes from happening in the first place. As many of you will probably already know, capital punishment does absolutely nothing to prevent or deter crime in those countries that have it, and, as has been stated previously, there is always the chance that an innocent man is put to death.
Posted by Sammy_boy
I'm all for the separation of church and state as well, I wouldn't like the idea of any religion getting a mention in the constitution, espeically as we all live in a much smaller, more multi-cultural world now.
@boto - I'm here!
Didn't realise my presence was missed.
One question - do we think of ourselves as Europeans now, or as British/French/Dutch/Czech/etc etc? I don't think I've heard a single person in this thread saying they look forward to a single European superstate!
Posted by Vlammetje
Speaking for myself, I am Dutch in the first place. I may be European by reasons of geography, but I don't feel more European today than i did when I lived outside Europe.... the concept means little to me, although it is slowly growing, not because anything Europe has doen to improve awarenes, but because the world as a whole is becoming a more grim place and being part of a bigger unity (europe) may be a necessity over being part of a small unity (my country)
Posted by boto43
Think everyone feels what he and she is ! Now it looks that everyone from Europe should feel like a member of big unit. I personally think that 4 or 5 generation ahead will lose their national identity. :-l
Posted by scotsboyuk
I sincerely hope that is not the case.
Posted by Vlammetje
it won't be in our lifetime anyway
Posted by scotsboyuk
A European superstate isn't in the best interests of Europeans in my opinion, we are much better off as we are at the moment.
Posted by Sammy_boy
I, probably like a lot of people here in the UK, would like to see an EU with close ties, like trading ties and ones that make movement of people and resources around without too much hassle, but not to the point where national sovereignty is compromised and countries are unable to, say, raise/lower taxes or interest rates without Brussels' say so.
Posted by scotsboyuk
@Sammy_boy
Hear hear!
Posted by boto43
anything new for europeans except killing of our ppl in iraq?
Posted by boto43
Hey ppl, what's the best mobile phone made in EU? I think any nokia's phone! Or better there are still any phones made in EU.
- that's for me. 
Posted by Sammy_boy
Good point - do any major phone manufacturers still make phones in the EU? I've notice some Nokia batteries are made in Hungary - but are the actual phones made here still?
Posted by boto43
Think sonyericsson batteries are made in Sweden. Or it was in past. When I had t 68i I had noticed it. Now I am not sure If batteries to present s e fones are still produced in Sweden. That's a reason of rising unemployment in the countries of EU. :-(
Posted by scotsboyuk
@boto43
I think the rising unemployment in many EU countries is more to do with the fact that their economies are stagnant along with general world trends.
Posted by boto43
Since today we have new chairmanship country in EU. Holland.
Posted by boto43
Since today we have new chairmanship country in EU. Holland.
Posted by Vlammetje
yes
Posted by scotsboyuk
@Vlamm
Should we address you as Madam President then?
Posted by boto43
Sure Mrs or Miss president. :-D I think president is from Portugal or not. Yesterday he was on the soccer match. I didn't provoke to any Dutch. It seems to me today is turn to go home for Czechs. We will see. ;-)
Posted by Vlammetje
you didn't provoke? And this is such a special event you need to mention it?
yes the chairman is some portuguese guy whos name I've already forgotten
And scotchboy I would be most pleased if you would not address me as madam
Posted by boto43
It was by accident. I am very glad you understand it. ;-)
Posted by superfot
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i hope Greece wins we played very good footbal with french and i would like to see my country in the finals
Posted by boto43
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I think president is from Portugal or not. Yesterday he was on the soccer match. I didn't provoke to any Dutch. It seems to me today is turn to go home for Czechs. We will see. 
Posted by boto43
Well, Czechs are out. I'm not a prophet but had the strange feelings this morning.
Posted by superfot
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why do you use a laugh smile? we play very good today and we have won the best teams in europe,we didnt got to the final because we are lucky,we go to the finals because we have played a very good football with great defence and attack.
Posted by boto43
Seems to me more luck than skills. But you won! First final match for Greeks in the history. Cong to all greeks.
Hope I use appropriate smileys. 
Posted by superfot
so you say that because of luck went so far?you cant have luck in so many games my friend.these guys are gods!!!!
Posted by boto43
I meant only your match with Czechs.
Posted by superfot
i thought you say about all the games.
i cant say that was only luck but i can say that in this game Czechs lose many oportunities but we had great defence and attack in this match.if you have seen the game you would say that both teams play equal in both halfs but in the extra time we play a lot better from Czechs.
they werent just lucky they have skills and they prove it again.
i want to be fair so i can say that in the game with Czechs we have God in our side and skills
[ This Message was edited by: superfot on 2004-07-02 22:55 ]