Posted by Xajel
On 2014-05-08 10:34:56, Vipera ammodytes wrote:
Looks cool! But top bazel should have been even smaller.
Believe me, it's not okay.. that size is nice and good, smaller bezels tends to make some fuzz while holding the phone as when you stretch your finger to the far side, your palm will touch the closer edge...
you need some time to change your behaviour in order to avoid this... but it's annoying to control the phone with one hand with such small bezels...
Posted by motvikt
On 2014-05-08 09:52:43, Wintermute wrote:
Oh man, I hope this shuts some people up about Sony's bezels.
I will complain about the bezels in this phone. They are much bigger than the original ZL which is a shame. According to Gsmarena ZL2 is roughly the size of xperia z
Posted by hihihans
There will always be some bezels, for the time being. This looks very acceptable to me. And I love that turquoise colour.
Posted by Detox
A wild ZL2 appears
!
On 2014-05-08 10:45:39, motvikt wrote:
On 2014-05-08 09:52:43, Wintermute wrote:
Oh man, I hope this shuts some people up about Sony's bezels.
I will complain about the bezels in this phone. They are much bigger than the original ZL which is a shame. According to Gsmarena ZL2 is roughly the size of xperia z
Noticed that too:
Z: 139 x 71 x 7.9 mm
ZL: 131.6 x 69.3 x 9.8 mm
ZL2: 137 x 72 x 10.8 mm
LG G2 (5.2"): 138.5 x 70.9 x 8.9 mm
I guess the 20.7MP shooter and the 3000mAh battery are not entirely innocent on that score, however it also doesn't have an IR blaster for example...
Posted by king-james
Japanese people always get most storage...
Global version of this ZL2 get max. 16GB.
All in all ZL2 is mostly a complete device, only the display should be at least 5.2" big...
Still, I would go with the G2...
Posted by Detox
The best of Sony - only in Japan
.
They actually keep the distance:
144 mm (Z1) - 137 mm (ZL2) = 7 mm
139 mm (Z) - 131.6 (ZL) = 7.4 mm
I'm just glad that they have addressed the bezels and they stick with the 5" display, even though the result isn't that breathtaking this time. The Z2 with the 5.2" display is another 2.8 mm longer than the Z1:
137 mm (ZL2) + 2.8 mm = 139.8 mm
(If it's that simple...)
Congratulations, the smartphone formerly known as amazingly compact is now even bigger than the Z.
[ This Message was edited by: Detox on 2014-05-08 12:00 ]
Posted by HxH
What a shame about these bezel complaint.
THE 20.7MP CAMERA component alone required that bigger space than anything else.
Bezel (to me) is better grip and comfortable on hands in landscape view.
Posted by Gitaroo
ZL2 is really ZR2, don't deserve the ZL name, ZL means tiny tiny Bezel to me and super compact.
Posted by FMW300
The size of the flagship has grown from last year, so ZL2 is still in the spirit of the original ZL, as it's still a more compact version of the current flagship (Z2), just as ZL was to Z. I think Z1 compact is more like the ZR successor.
Posted by itsjustJOH
I just hope the Compact line would not actually grow in size, probably increase the screen size (4.5-4.6") and retain the body size like the Z2 to Z1.
Posted by amirprog
Zl2 can be compared to z2 , not to zl, since it carries similar internals. so the dimensions are relative to that. if you complain on zl2 dimensions then you should also complain on why sony didn't put smaller inferior camera sensor so the dimensions could be smaller like you want. you should also complain on why sony included stereo speakers, etc.
[ This Message was edited by: amirprog on 2014-05-08 18:11 ]
Posted by -XYZ
Sone should use the magnesium-aluminium alloy they use in DSLRs. That stuff feels SO good in the hand. It's ridiculously durable too.
If they can pull of their usual, glorious style, with the better thermal characteristics of an all metallic chassis......it would probably mean perfection.
Design wise, the ugliest phones they made was defo the Xperia T. Saw that in a shop. Absolutely hideous for a flagship. The asymmetric arc...the really rough textured back.....ugh.
Thankfully that was it. All other phones have looked glorious. Sometimes I place my Z1 compact on a desk.and just admire it. Real shame about the easily scratched polished plastic back, instead of glass. It's the one bad thing about the phone's design.
Posted by nodarsixar
Xperia Z3 camera?
http://www.sony.net/Products/[....]ro/march_2014/imx147lqt_e.html
or
http://www.sony.net/Products/[....]ro/february_2014/imx226_e.html
or
http://www.sony.net/Products/[....]ro/march_2014/imx147lqt_e.html
????????????????????????
Posted by cu015170
^ thanks for sharing!
This is really, really good
http://www.sony.net/Products/[....]uary_2014/imx226_e.html#Photo1
I am hoping that this is what Apple will have in the iPhone 6 with a precise lens and decent JPEG processing..
This is basically the same size as the Nokia N8 but with new tech which should further improve the IQ... very nice indeed.
According to them this performs better than a 2.8µm FSI equivalent, which is impressive.
This is the first small Sony sensor that looks really promising in a long while.
[ This Message was edited by: cu015170 on 2014-05-09 00:14 ]
Posted by -XYZ
On 2014-05-09 01:11:59, cu015170 wrote:
^ thanks for sharing!
This is really, really good
http://www.sony.net/Products/[....]uary_2014/imx226_e.html#Photo1
I am hoping that this is what Apple will have in the iPhone 6 with a precise lens and decent JPEG processing..
This is basically the same size as the Nokia N8 but with new tech which should further improve the IQ... very nice indeed.
According to them this performs better than a 2.8µm FSI equivalent, which is impressive.
This is the first small Sony sensor that looks really promising in a long while.
[ This Message was edited by: cu015170 on 2014-05-09 00:14 ]
Why would they give this to Apple?
Why would they give a competitor, a superior sensor than they themselves are using?
Posted by cu015170
^ Because they can place a very, VERY .. VERY.. large order and Sony can make lots of money ?
Apple have been using Sony sensors for years, and they have been bragging about "bigger" pixels since the 5s shipped.. so I believe that they will continue the trend with the iPhone 6 by advertising that it has 1.85um pixels instead of the tiny 1.1um that everyone else is using.
The sensor mentioned above sounds really good on paper, I am excited to see what it can do in real life.
[ This Message was edited by: cu015170 on 2014-05-09 00:34 ]
Posted by cu015170
The only issue is that it says that it was developed for security cameras
I don't know what that means, but I hope that its not too big for smartphones.. like I said the format is not that much bigger than the Toshiba sensor from the N8, so it can be put in a smartphone.
The IMX147LQT has a package size of: 12.8 mm (H) × 10.5 mm (V) × 1.95 mm (t)
there is no such info on the IMX226CQJ
1/1.7 is very cool
Posted by -XYZ
Doesn't matter if Apple demand volume. Sony make the best mobile sensors on the market, but they reserve the creme de la creme for themselves.
They make smartphones too. Why give apple competitive advantage. Smartphones offer much higher margins than Image Sensors.
Posted by Shino03
I don't think it would hurt them if apple would pay for a premium price but I really doubt this would be in the next iphone 6 since this sensor would greatly affect the design of the phone.
Posted by miromiromi
^because aside from their PS4, the mobile camera sensors are their only hit product in the recent decade. they can't afford to lose the market by refusing to sell the best. if the keep the best to them, their buyers may decide to go to another supplier or develop their own sensors.
Posted by cu015170
On 2014-05-09 03:05:59, -XYZ wrote:
Doesn't matter if Apple demand volume. Sony make the best mobile sensors on the market, but they reserve the creme de la creme for themselves.
They make smartphones too. Why give apple competitive advantage. Smartphones offer much higher margins than Image Sensors.
I dunno... are we sure that the sensor in the 1020 is not a Sony one ?
Posted by itsjustJOH
They do make sensors exclusive to them, right? Which is supposedly better, like the one on Z1 and Z2.
Posted by randomuser
On 2014-05-09 03:59:35, cu015170 wrote:
I dunno... are we sure that the sensor in the 1020 is not a Sony one ?
Lumia 1020 has a Toshiba Sensor.
[ This Message was edited by: randomuser on 2014-05-09 04:28 ]
Posted by cu015170
Oh its a Toshiba again.. so I guess Nokia only worked with them on the camera flagships, except the 920.. if you can call it that, it had a Sharp sensor.
Either way, Sony are known for selling image sensors to other companies.. the masterpiece in the Nikon D800 is Sony as well
I think most of the iPhones are as well..
I just don't know if the IMX226CQJ http://www.sony.net/Products/[....]ro/february_2014/imx226_e.html
is going to be used in a phone.. it might be too big for all the OEMs obsessed with thinness.
A lot of people are saying that 1 inch sensor will be too big (requires big optics, etc.) but I am not so sure..
The sensor in the Sony RX100/II is amazing.. I really like what it can do, so I would really like to see that kind of tech into a smartphone one day.
Just for size reference
The RX100 has a sensor that measures at
13.2 x 8.8 mm
the Toshiba sensor in the 808 measures at:
10,67 x 8 mm
2.53 x 0.8 mm difference ... would that affect the size of the device that much ? Looking at the Galaxy K, they could certainly fit a bigger sensor in there..
here is a little comp with some FFs
oh, the table above is how many Mpix you would need if you were aiming at 3.0um pixels
[ This Message was edited by: cu015170 on 2014-05-09 05:51 ]
Posted by HxH
On 2014-05-08 20:59:34, -XYZ wrote:
Sone should use the magnesium-aluminium alloy they use in DSLRs. That stuff feels SO good in the hand. It's ridiculously durable too.
If they can pull of their usual, glorious style, with the better thermal characteristics of an all metallic chassis......it would probably mean perfection.
Design wise, the ugliest phones they made was defo the Xperia T. Saw that in a shop. Absolutely hideous for a flagship. The asymmetric arc...the really rough textured back.....ugh.
Thankfully that was it. All other phones have looked glorious. Sometimes I place my Z1 compact on a desk.and just admire it. Real shame about the easily scratched polished plastic back, instead of glass. It's the one bad thing about the phone's design.
Sony once used magnesium alloy with Xperia ion, and it failed in misery. As for Z1 Compact you also can get glass back as spare part.
Posted by rss_ndrsn
^I think magnesium alloy would look great on Xperia Z2 and Z2L or their succesors. The metal back would give a new twist to the omni-balance design. I can imagine how sexy Z2L would look with metal back instead of plastic.
Posted by randomuser
The sensor discussed above is not meant for smartphones and won't be used in any.
Z3 as mentioned before will use 1/2.4" 20.7 MP sensor.
Iphone 6 might have a 1/2.6" 8 MP custom Sony Exmor RS.
[ This Message was edited by: randomuser on 2014-05-09 13:38 ]
Posted by -XYZ
On 20-09 09:10:19, randomuser wrote:
The sensor discussed above is not meant for smartphones and won't be used in any.
Z4 as mentioned before will use 1/2.4" 20.7 MP sensor.
Iphone 6 might have a 1/2.6" 8 MP custom Sony Exmor RS.
[ This Message was edited by: randomuser on 2014-05-09 08:11 ]
See that 8MPx 1/2.6" sensor is a good idea.
I don't know why Sony didn't make themselves. Custom 13MPx 1/2" Exmor RS sensor, instead of
Of lifting the sensor out of one of their compact cameras....if 1/2" is too big, then 1/2.3" but at 13MPx instead of 20.7MPx.
I also don't know why they're making their sensor smaller...because of the thickness fad? The Z2 isn't even that thick. If they rounded the back they could get away with HTC One thicknesses and put an even bigger sensor in there....maybe even with OIS.
Posted by amirprog
@-XYZ
The 1/2.4" 21 mp is said to be dedicated to sony smartphone from q4 which means that z3 will be the first smartphone to carry it, not z4, like z1 had the 1/2.4" 20.7 mp first: http://appleinsider.com/artic[....]el-horserace-with-2014-iphones
[ This Message was edited by: amirprog on 2014-05-09 13:27 ]
Posted by nodarsixar
it's next sony cameraphone pixels????????
Posted by amirprog
@nodarsixar
Why make assumptions? this i don't understand. sony write it clearly that the sensors are intended "for cameras", "security cameras", etc. which means not for smartphones.
[ This Message was edited by: amirprog on 2014-05-09 13:39 ]
Posted by nodarsixar
And what will be Sony's next-gen camera in cameraphone?
Posted by amirprog
@nodarsixar
If you trust that appleinsider article then it is that 1/2.4" 21 mp sensor. i trust it.
Posted by nodarsixar
On 2014-05-09 15:04:02, amirprog wrote:
@nodarsixar
If you trust that appleinsider article then it is that 1/2.4\" 21 mp sensor. i trust it.
When Sony announced imx230? That is false information
Posted by -XYZ
On 2014-05-09 19:55:48, nodarsixar wrote:
On 2014-05-09 15:04:02, amirprog wrote:
@nodarsixar
If you trust that appleinsider article then it is that 1/2.4" 21 mp sensor. i trust it.
When Sony announced imx230? That is false information
False information? That's pretty hilarious coming from a guy like you.
Also, I think it's in the production pipeline.
Posted by ascariss
if the sensor will be smaller and same resolution or even larger, this might add more noise to the images and need a lot more post processing, and well Sony isn't that great on that end from the smartphone division. Unless this time the imaging division will help out, doubtful.
Any know if Sony will introduce new updated QX lenses this fall at IFA?
Posted by nodarsixar
Well, then, after Sony's flagship 21 megapixel camera will have, and what will be the new Flagship of the camera sensor? 21MP CIS sensor?
Posted by motvikt
I wonder if D5103 has been canceled. Haven't heard anything about it recently. Sony seems to have trimmed down the number of phones this year. It's basically just z2, m2 and e1
Posted by kurtdean
The successor to dragontrail glass. The new DragonTrail X glass http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8erRvEI0Amw I hope z3 comes with this glass.
Posted by razec
On 2014-05-09 20:39:02, ascariss wrote:
if the sensor will be smaller and same resolution or even larger, this might add more noise to the images and need a lot more post processing, and well Sony isn't that great on that end from the smartphone division. Unless this time the imaging division will help out, doubtful.
The secret lies in a good pairing between image processor and architectural improvements on the image sensor, the Bionz-X processor on A7 camera for example enabled an ISO1600 output to look completely noise free and appear as if it was taken on an 8-stops lower ISO setting, this is in stark contrast to the ancient A900 or A99 (which uses the same exact sensor according to Sony) which couldn't output a clean noise free photo of the same ISO level without resorting to strong Noise Reduction effectively smudging fine details in the process. I do believe the sensor on Z1 is more than capable, Its the software-based Bionz engine that couldn't bring the sensor's true potential. QX100 and Z1 were both equipped with the same image sensor design(not chip) but the former wipes the floor with the Z1 on the JPEG Engine.
[ This Message was edited by: razec on 2014-05-10 10:15 ]
Posted by ascariss
On 2014-05-10 11:14:43, razec wrote:
On 2014-05-09 20:39:02, ascariss wrote:
if the sensor will be smaller and same resolution or even larger, this might add more noise to the images and need a lot more post processing, and well Sony isn't that great on that end from the smartphone division. Unless this time the imaging division will help out, doubtful.
The secret lies in a good pairing between image processor and architectural improvements on the image sensor, the Bionz-X processor on A7 camera for example enabled an ISO1600 output to look completely noise free and appear as if it was taken on an 8-stops lower ISO setting, this is in stark contrast to the ancient A900 or A99 (which uses the same exact sensor according to Sony) which couldn't output a clean noise free photo of the same ISO level without resorting to strong Noise Reduction effectively smudging fine details in the process. I do believe the sensor on Z1 is more than capable, Its the software-based Bionz engine that couldn't bring the sensor's true potential. QX100 and Z1 were both equipped with the same image sensor design(not chip) but the former wipes the floor with the Z1 on the JPEG Engine.
[ This Message was edited by: razec on 2014-05-10 10:15 ]
The A7's new bionz-X surely helps here. the QX100 has the 1 inch sensor, so not the same, I believe you mean the QX10, which has a 1/2.3 sensor.
While I cannot find a QX10 teardown, I have found a QX100 teardown from sony
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aH0_dAtKofw
As mentioned in the video, there is a dedicated bionz processor to deal with the images, I am guessing the same bionz is used in qx100 and qx10.
http://presscentre.sony.eu/co[....]px?NewsAreaId=2&ReleaseID=8804
press release has bionz for both models, so it easily explains why the images from the qx10 are better than the Z1. I am hoping sony introduces updated lens cameras and makes them thinner if possible. But I will take a thicker lens camera if Sony decides to stick in a APS-C sized sensor in it.
Posted by razec
Yes I do meant the QX10, I've wrote my post during midnight so my mind's quite shabby that I needed rest
Well I hope the QX line matures further and the integration becomes much more seamless, with greater control on the lens camera features in phone like a full Manual mode and faster pairing.
I'd also love to see a dedicated mobile Bionz-X chip powering the Z3 or Z4 if ever.
Posted by Detox
Reports from Japan indicate that the Xperia ZL2 will come with a VA panel, similar to the Xperia Z1, which may disappoint some who were hoping to see Sony adopt IPS panels for all of its future high-end phones.
http://www.xperiablog.net/201[....]l2-hands-on-photos-and-videos/
zomgbbqftw confirms:
Yes, but it's a turnaround using old unused parts from the supply chain. Including the horrible screen from the Z/Z1. Sony really committed to too many of those screens. Plus it's KDDI only, the Z2 is still going to be released in Japan exclusively on NTT.
Posted by ascariss
Sony's own fault really, probably overestimated the Z1 demand and those crappy panels have to be used somewhere, no use in wasting parts.
Posted by nikola1970
ZL2 display still looks better then the Z1.
Posted by XperiaJunkie
@ascariss your right in what you've said but demand for the Z1 was much higher than any other Sony Xperia device. It was also their best selling smartphone by some distance within the first 6 months of release. So unless sales of the Z1 dropped off big time then I can't see many panels left.
[ This Message was edited by: XperiaJunkie on 2014-05-11 19:03 ]
Posted by ascariss
Has Sony released their numbers for the Z1 for the previous quarter? And any idea what the total Z1 sales figures are so far?
Posted by XperiaJunkie
Not sure of the exact amount but the original Xperia Z sold 4.6m in 40 days and the Z1 was said to of bettered that but actual figure for the Z1 haven't been released or I can't find them.
Posted by randomuser
On 2014-05-11 21:21:04, ascariss wrote:
Has Sony released their numbers for the Z1 for the previous quarter? And any idea what the total Z1 sales figures are so far?
Sony never releases device specific shipment numbers. But from what I know, Z1 shipments were below 2 million for Q4.
Posted by king-james
Like I said, Z1 won't top the Z. I hope Z2 can...
RaMu did you switch to Apple?
Any rumors about the Z2 Ultra so far?