Posted by razec
On 2014-04-25 14:00:58, ascariss wrote:
Does Sony even have a 24MP cybershot sensor? Even if one was developed and sampled to customers, I feel the entire module would be too large to fit inside a thin cellphone. Would make no sense for Sony to develop 21 and 24MP sensors and give the high MP count to customers and keep the 21MP to themselves.
Whatever the truth, it will be interesting to see how Sony will decide to improve the camera on the Z3. Not much was improved hardware wise for the camera on the Z2, unless the optics were changed and comparing the disassembly photos of Z1 and Z2, the module is slightly different but the sensor seems the same and the aperture. So will Sony opt for a larger sensor? More megapixels? larger aperture? Or perhaps as mentioned, smaller sensor and larger megapixel count.
With the Z2 slightly behind schedule in varying markets, I wonder how this will affect the Z3 launch.
I wouldn't be surprised to see a 24MP sony smartphone this year, or even one with larger sensor size, afterall they just love cramming as much pixels as their engineering prowess could pull off. what worries me is that their JPEG engine saw virtually no improvements since the Z1 and seeing images from Galaxy S5, that thing did outperform Z2 Imho, DxO mark praised the Sony 20mp sensors as top notch but to be honest I couldn't really trust that website (given how many times they bashed Canon for their "lousy sensors" and exhorting Nikon for producing superior cameras Image quality wise) but I'd love to see them pulling a different approach like they did with A7s, for example a 12mp 1/2.3" sensor should suffice for mobile photography and even help the phone gain more F-stops without having to boost ISO or slowing down the shutter speed (and become more susceptible with the awful image blurring indoors) I don't know if OIS could possibly integrate with the camera module given the current size of the module relative to the physical size of the sensor, since we know OIS requires additional motors and circuitry which increases the size of the camera module. I'm not a fan the silly slimness race because this is usually the biggest limiting factor for attaining important camera hardware features we yearn for our supposedly "smart" devices
Posted by MartenR
@razec I guess I was the first to find that you're back. You changed your profile picture yesterday.
Posted by razec
On 2014-04-25 18:36:29, MartenR wrote:
@razec I guess I was the first to find that you're back. You changed your profile picture yesterday.
Really?
nice to see you guys around, it's been a while since the last time we chatted, I truly missed this place
Posted by josephnero
@razec
Welcome back dude
Posted by razec
@josephnero
Cheers mate
But hey where's ramu? shotokhan?
Posted by MartenR
@razec I think shotokan hadn't been active for more than 6-7 months. ramu is mostly on Z2 thread.
Posted by DexterMoser
Welcome back razec, too!!
Nothing really to rumor about atm, razec it's your turn
Posted by razec
Hi there DexterMoser!
Correct me if I'm wrong but so far we only have some info about Z3 (2H flagship) and its compact version. I wonder if the ZU line will have a new model to properly replace it
Posted by reeflotz
Welcome back razec, so was the infiltration to Sony HQ successful?
took you quite a while, so out with the goods. I want to hear it naow 
Been slow with rumors currently, a lot of OS and processor talk in the rumor thread while you were gone.
Posted by supercoolman
^you shouldn't be exposing our 008 like that
Posted by sami92a
Xperia A2... what´s this? Just the Z1 C with different colours or is it a new phone, Z2 compact?
http://www.xperiablog.net/201[....]e-a-z1-compact-in-new-colours/
[ This Message was edited by: sami92a on 2014-04-28 23:45 ]
Posted by supercoolman
On 2014-04-29 00:43:39, sami92a wrote:
Xperia A2... what´s this? Just the Z1 C with different colours or is it a new phone, Z2 compact?
http://www.xperiablog.net/201[....]e-a-z1-compact-in-new-colours/
[ This Message was edited by: sami92a on 2014-04-28 23:45 ]
isn't A the Japanese variant with better spec?
Posted by HxH
milukugiuniu, he right again
his last reply was confirmed no Z2C
Xperia A2 will be lower-end Wish-series for NTT Docomo to replace Xperia A and ZR last year lineup
it will launch alongside the Z2 Next-series in Japan this summer market
I think A2 will have plastic back same as Z1C in global, remember that Z1f has glass back.
----------------
As far as product line-up schedule goes this year
I starting to doubt about next flagship Z3's release timeframe
Sony shouldn't slap it own territory consumers by release newer device in IFA
which is barely three months behind Z2 / A2 releases in Japan.
the Z2 is also first-ever Sony flagship to release in Japan behind global roll out
maybe something that strain in supply capacity lead to this situation.
Next Z Ultra, I think it could have SD801 as well for easily to provide software support
then make a leap jump into SD810 in 2015, same as they once skipped SD600 last year.
btw, Apple's latest conference call is mention that iPhone market share in Japan already break at 55%.
[ This Message was edited by: HxH on 2014-04-29 14:52 ]
Posted by jjjajjj
the Samsung K zoom was announced today with 20.7MP 1/2.3'' sensor size
Is it Sony's sensor ?
Posted by -XYZ
Probably not.
Samsung already had a 1/2.3 sensor at 16 Mpx. It wouldn't be too surprising if they updated the fabrication to 20.7Mpx.
I'm waiting to see if Sony produce a 1/2 sensor
Posted by cu015170
1/2 might require a HUMP... I don't think they would bring themselves so low and incorporate such monstrosity into their phones.
I am waiting for someone to put a 1" sensor into a smartphone.. I would buy it immediately. Sony should use that beautiful sensor from the RX100/II
[ This Message was edited by: cu015170 on 2014-04-29 18:29 ]
Posted by DexterMoser
On 2014-04-29 19:28:25, cu015170 wrote:...
I am waiting for someone to put a 1" sensor into a smartphone.. I would buy it immediately...
[ This Message was edited by: cu015170 on 2014-04-29 18:29 ]
Me too
Posted by -XYZ
Erm....if a 1/2" sensor would require a hump.....what the hell kind of hump would be required for a 1" sensor?
That would be thicker than the Galaxy K.
And Sony should be able to find a way to design the phone, such that the hump isn't noticeable, with a 1/2" sensor. I'd take the extra thickness for a notably larger sensor and superior optics (5-6 lens elements, f2.0 or f1.8. Plus they can make the phone rounder to improve ergonomics while creating an illusion of thinness.
I'm sure that Sony's designers can maintain their simple, elegant monolithic look, while doing all of the above.
I'd also love for them to remove the Sony logo from the front, so that it looks truly monolithic. Have a Xperia Gx style glowing logo if necessary so that it disappears when the phone is locked.
Posted by vivftp
Maybe someone more knowledgable can answer this. Would the addition of a curved sensor allow them to require fewer lense elements?
Posted by Gitaroo
go back to their arc design, bump out top and bottom portion so they can maybe fit sensors behind screen. Also decrease the top and bottom bezel and make the phone easier to hold.
Posted by -XYZ
On 2014-04-30 02:56:01, vivftp wrote:
Maybe someone more knowledgable can answer this. Would the addition of a curved sensor allow them to require fewer lense elements?
From a pure physics/common sense perspective, I'd say it would require more, to allow for proper focusing. Unless some genius can figure out and replicate how the natural eye's lens works.....
Sounds really complicated and would also increase the volume the sensor stack would take up.
Posted by Wintermute
A glass Arc design would be the sexiest phone EVAR. I would be foaming at the mouth to buy that thing.
Posted by miromiromi
will also be the most fragile design ever
Posted by razec
On 2014-04-30 09:03:00, Wintermute wrote:
A glass Arc design would be the sexiest phone EVAR. I would be foaming at the mouth to buy that thing.
Then it must be made of diamond to survive sharp drops
Posted by Muhammad-Oli
In my opinion, the Arc design is stupid. Basically they're making the top and bottom fatter to make up for the huge chunk out of the middle. It's not efficient design at all.
It looks interesting, and it might sit in the hand well but there are other ways of doing that. As said above, a glass Arc phone would be fragile, so it would more likely be plastic if Sony ever made another one, and therefore it would probably feel quite cheap, just like the Arcs that have gone before.
I personally think it's unlikely, and also hope Sony don't do it.
Posted by -XYZ
On 2014-04-30 09:34:51, Muhammad-Oli wrote:
In my opinion, the Arc design is stupid. Basically they're making the top and bottom fatter to make up for the huge chunk out of the middle. It's not efficient design at all.
It looks interesting, and it might sit in the hand well but there are other ways of doing that. As said above, a glass Arc phone would be fragile, so it would more likely be plastic if Sony ever made another one, and therefore it would probably feel quite cheap, just like the Arcs that have gone before.
I personally think it's unlikely, and also hope Sony don't do it.
I'm inclined to agree. The arc design has already been used twice. They should be able to come up with something new and equally ergonomic, but with better space efficiency.
Posted by amirprog
Fellows, milukugiuniu said in earlier page: "The designing of Xperia will change a bit for the 2nd half with the edge getting round." i don't know about you, but i trust him. it doesn't sound like an arc design, but more like z2 design with find 7 like top and bottom curves or like ben ling's z3 concept design which also looks pretty nice: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2725781 some people i read complain about the edges being too sharp so i guess sony is listening.
@razec
wb.
i think you missed that design rumor.
Posted by smclion102
Xperia Designs have become boring I want something fresh not a BAR phone
Posted by amirprog
@smclion102
Agreed.
a find 7/oneplus like top and bottom curves with omnibalance with shorter bezel could be a nice change.
Posted by lewko
Hello,
What i would like to see from Sony this year (hope someone can confirm):
- a WP phone... decent one , mid-ranger is enough
- a ipad mini competitor - something like LG G Pad 8.3, but with S800 and a decent camera and IP58
For a cameraphone I wich sony takes the optics from their T range cybershots (Carl Zeiss ones, but probably they cannot due to licencing restrictions - remember CZ lenses in mobile devices are licensed to Nokia/MS). This periscope optics can fit into a smartphone body nicely at one of each ends.. it provides true optical zoom, OIS and superior resolution. I am actually quite surprised Sony hasnt used this idea so far. Bump on a top or bottom edge is not an issue and remember satio? My god that was a picture quality there... unmatached so far if you ask me... xenon flash, superior sensor, i never minded the 12mm bump. It was a nice one to hold. now with the periscope optics from T range cybershots you can easily built it into something like 10-11mm and make the rest of the body 7-8mm...
That is what i would love to have..
Posted by Ricky D
Why reinvent the wheel?
There really aren't many ways to out a large touchscreen with appropriately sized bezels together. The only real area for making a point of difference is the back and sides, which Sony does with omnibalance (sides are very very nice and quite unique) and did with arc (again very nice and unique).
Curved screens have been regarded as gimmicky when tried by other manufacturers. Bulging backs feel 'fat' in the hand and aren't really that ergonomic.
Other form-factors are inconvenient or inefficient.
I bring back my suggestion to Sony that they have two running clear design styles t once each line with identical specs just a different shell.
Imagine:
Xperia V-series: V3, V3C, V3 Ultra, V3 Tablet (maybe an arc shaped tablet isn't necessary, but it would be earth shatteringly cool)
Xperia Z-series: Z3, Z3C, Z3 Ultra, Z3 Tablet
Both series run with the same specifications but one has a distinct arc design and one the omnibalance design. It'll be important to match the series numbers to each other even if it means sight confusion in the beginning when reviews ask 'where was V1 and V2?', but the consumer will be given a clear choice and both choices are within the Sony family.
With the spec races slowing slightly this is the way the market will go (similar to the way feature phones were a 8 years ago). Same specs different cases like the W800/K750.
The processors in current handsets are already faster than most people need or indeed notice. Most people make their choices now on design, friend's opinions and the camera (which is increasingly less of a USP).
Posted by bronxdude
how about the Xperia NXT (S,P,U) series? That one is really cool especially the LED strip.
Posted by -XYZ
Sony should definitely NOT have to identical series of phones, with slightly different designs. They will compete with each other and confuse the market.
Simplicity in the portfolio, is best.
Maximum 9 phones per year.
Z series - flagship series
S series - midrange series
M series - low range
Compact, standard and Ultra variants for each series.
Simple.
Common Design language for the three series.
Make the owners of the lower end models, feel like they own flagships. Compromise on internals only. Fit and finish shouldn't be identical, but still of a very high quality. Soft touch, HQ plastics in place of metal as needed.
As for the design language itself....let Sony work their magic. Arc design is pretty but overrated. Space is inefficiently used due to the shape. Convex shape is better because silicon can be stacked in a pyramid shape. Camera bump is a huge nono. If needed the design needs to make it look like it isn't there. Provide an illusion of thinness if the thickness of the phone needs to be increased to accommodate a larger camera sensor, battery etc.
The vacuous space left by a so-called arc design, can be filled with a few extra hundred mAh of battery capacity. Bigger battery is more important than reviving the arc-design ethos.
[ This Message was edited by: -XYZ on 2014-04-30 15:31 ]
Posted by HxH
bezelliness guys will moan like hell, if NXT comeback to life again
unless Sony can find new way to implement the transparent bar on device.
Posted by razec
On 2014-04-30 11:59:44, amirprog wrote:
Fellows, milukugiuniu said in earlier page: "The designing of Xperia will change a bit for the 2nd half with the edge getting round." i don't know about you, but i trust him. it doesn't sound like an arc design, but more like z2 design with find 7 like top and bottom curves or like ben ling's z3 concept design which also looks pretty nice: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2725781 some people i read complain about the edges being too sharp so i guess sony is listening.
@razec
wb.
i think you missed that design rumor.
Yeah I missed this, thanks mate
Posted by motvikt
Fully agree with XYZ, good post.
In other news, where is Xperia G (or whatever it will be called)?! Wasn't is certified in Indonesia a couple of weeks back? Sony has been slacking with their mid-ends recently
[ This Message was edited by: motvikt on 2014-04-30 17:54 ]
Posted by Wintermute
On 2014-04-30 09:14:30, miromiromi wrote:
will also be the most fragile design ever
Not if it's sapphire.
Posted by HxH
Not sure if anyone has mention about Corning can make curve glass already
but I wonder if it suitable to fit it into arc-shape design?
Posted by CrownedAkuma
On 2014-04-30 16:33:52, HxH wrote:
bezelliness guys will moan like hell, if NXT comeback to life again
unless Sony can find new way to implement the transparent bar on device.
Xperia SP seems the way!
I love its design! It has that sexy transparent bar at the bottom and the aluminium Corning!
Sexy
Posted by razec
Some off topic news from SAR, Sony were about to announce A77 mark II (which I'm really eager to see
) and RX100-mark IIIlater this evening (8PM tokyo time) with XAVC-S video format like the video centric A7s, now I wonder if that format would ever come to an Xperia device? [ This Message was edited by: razec on 2014-05-01 08:29 ]
Posted by >>SAMEH
^ ^
that's very cool.. I'm eager to see the RX100 III, never thought they will do a new version so soon. let's hope it will get a proper price tag
Posted by cu015170
I really like the RX series .. the 3rd one should be pretty amazing. The price tag will probably be around the same as the first two.
I really hope they put a wider lens on there this time around.
Posted by FMW300
When should we see Q1 2014 results? Last quarter, Sony shipped 10.7 million. Should we see an improvement? Hopefully Z1 compact sold well....
Posted by MartenR
I guess next week. They issued a warning today and revised their previous forecast; now expecting 1.3B loss( vs. 1.1). I guess 9.5 million units sold would be a good guess.
Posted by Tsepz_GP
Are their losses at least going down year-on-year though?
I often wonder to myself how long Sony can last on this path.
Posted by HxH
hey, look what we've have for our us pals
I guess, 10.5M shipped
[ This Message was edited by: HxH on 2014-05-01 15:33 ]
Posted by MartenR
@Tsepz_GP Last year they returned profit and they have been profitable 2Qs this year and were expecting profit but they decided to undertake a restructuring which is taking its toll.
Posted by Ebato
On 2014-05-01 16:42:08, MartenR wrote:
.... but they decided to undertake a restructuring which is taking its toll.
To offset the results of the previous restructuring.
Still refusing to take money from Microsoft, competing with Samsung with no retail presence in NA, and the list goes on.
Sony is the Sony's worst enemy.
Posted by Gitaroo
people complain about their US presence but they don't realize that Sony don't even have the resources to compete with decent marketing to begin with to do their marketing and advertisement world wide. If they do split their resources for NA, their marketing campaign would still be tiny compare to something like Samsung or apple and basically wasting all of the resource for other regions where they are strong at. Sorry for the people that want the Z2 in NA, which you can still buy it if you really want to; however for the company its best to focus on countries they are strong at like UK, or South East Asia. Not to mention they already have their supply chain issue which cause the delay of Z2 already.
Posted by Wintermute
On 2014-05-01 18:25:33, Ebato wrote:
On 2014-05-01 16:42:08, MartenR wrote:
.... but they decided to undertake a restructuring which is taking its toll.
To offset the results of the previous restructuring.
Still refusing to take money from Microsoft, competing with Samsung with no retail presence in NA, and the list goes on.
Sony is the Sony's worst enemy.
So you're under the impression that continuing to take losses in the Vaio division as far as the eye can see into the future would have been preferable to selling it and taking a one-time hit? No offense, but there's a reason you're not on the board.