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Why does the X1 need so many Tweaks to run smoothly?


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Posted by Dogmann
Hi all,

Now please don't get the wrong idea about this thread it is not about bashing the X1 it is about trying to understand it though.

Now i know most of these tweaks are quite simple and in fact due to the hard work of some they have even been combined into one package.

But my question is this why does the X1 need these in the first place when very similar devices like the Touch Pro or Touch HD don't. Both of those still have a need to be tweaked to perform better but they don't seem to need tweaks to address the same issues as the X1 has.

What i am talking about is the Tweaks and fixes like the ones below not the tweaks adding additional functionality such as Touch Flo 3D or additional keyboards or panles.


Bluetooth turning off with MortScript

Xperia Tweak not all of it but some of it.

Data connection/auto disconnect tweak.

As all three devices are running WM6.1 and have very similar hardware and this is why i can't really understand why some of these problems are only on the X1. Anyone have a good explanation of why?

Marc

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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-23 12:11 ]


Posted by originalas
Maybe cuz this is the first Sony Win Mobile phone.. I hope, this is the last one with windows too. Hate that Microsoft crap..

Symbian UIQ is dead, so i guess that's why X1 went with Win, but i hope soon Sony will show new Symbian Aliance or whatever device. Maybe Android OS would be even better.

Posted by WhyBe
...or even Windows Mobile 7.

I have no major issues with my X1i. My issues are largely with Windows Mobile itself or individual software. Also, TouchFlo and Panels are two different beasts with their own idiosyncrasies. So I wouldn't compare the two so directly.

Tweaks don't necessarily mean deficiencies, but merely differences in individuals' preferences.

I think a lot of the "deficiencies" of the X1 can be chalked up to rushing to get it on the market in time. There were a lot of things taken out of the feature list like: PlayNow, DLNA, active panels and etc (I'm sure there's a lot more). Now 15fps h.264 encoding is supposedly not supported. just wasn't finished with the thing, so they said, "just release it with what we've got finished so far." Heck, they even promoted the hell out of the panels, yet, there is/was no decent selection of panels when X1 was released (I was expecting more choice for a start...BIG letdown).

I will be happy if I get:
*ALL the features promised from
*a respectable selection of eye-candyish/finger-friendly panels.
*WM7 or 6.5 gives a better user experience than 6.1 and it's sluggishness.


I think the tweaking being done is largely due to X1 not being fine-tuned and polished before it hit the market. This is fixable with software updates, so all is not lost This put's us in the same league as any other "x.0" smartphone.

Posted by aksd
Like I mentioned sometime ago, WM is a very "hands on" OS, very configurable. I quite like the fact that tweaks give you that little bit more.

Posted by WhyBe
Tweakability is great, but, it should always be an option and not a requirement...especially in the iPhone era.
I don't want to spend more time tweaking than using.

@aksd:
Haven't seen you in a while. I thought you were either in jail, tired of us, pregnant or D-All of the above

Posted by max_wedge
they took dlna out? wtf



Posted by Dogmann
@Max

I seem to remember big arguments when some suggested that SE don't always deliver what they say even in White Papers and then go back and edit it all away like it never existed. Looks like some of those that were berated for blasphemy may of been talking the truth after all, as yet once more history and bad behavior repeats itself. It could also be argued that they haven't delivered anything like what they said they would with the 9 active panels either especially as currently they are all static images and just shortcuts to the actual apps which isn't even close to what they said they would be now is it?.


Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-24 18:08 ]

Posted by WhyBe
@Dogmann:
I'm hoping is still hard at work finishing the X1's software. If they don't, it's still a good device. It's just short of my expectations as of now.

Posted by max_wedge

On 2008-11-24 17:57:11, Dogmann wrote:
@Max

I seem to remember big arguments when some suggested that SE don't always deliver what they say even in White Papers and then go back and edit it all away like it never existed. Looks like some of those that were berated for blasphemy may of been talking the truth after all, as yet once more history and bad behavior repeats itself. It could also be argued that they haven't delivered anything like what they said they would with the 9 active panels either especially as currently they are all static images and just shortcuts to the actual apps which isn't even close to what they said they would be now is it?.

maybe but I'm quite sure I wasn't in those arguments. I know I've stuck up for SE often in big heated arguments but it's never been my impression that SE ALWAYS stick to their promises or whitepapers. tbh I don't know any OEM who does.

I agree that the active panels things was a backtract, but I'm also not surprised since I always thought it a bit optomistic of SE to think that the WM platform hardware as it is currently was anywhere near capable of running active content like this. I never even run active content on the today screen for this very reason - it sucks juice hard and sloows down the device. I'm not a fan of active content in standby. Maybe in a year or two general winmo hardware will be fast enough.

DLNA is a disappointment, but it doesn't make me hate SE. I mean they have a job to do who am I to question what's possible and not within the constraints of their budgets and timetables. I can be disappointed about it without having to go on a crusade. Sometimes we don't get what we want in life, that's all their is to it

As to the connectivity issues and such like, I see no reason SE won't fix these with firmware updates just like they do on their other platforms. They're just bugs and every ohone by every oem has bugs there is no getting away from this. Look back on my posts, you will see I have always maintained that OEM's, and SE is no exception but neither are they alone, need to do more testing prior to release but tbh I don't think they will ever stop using the general public to beta test their devices.

Posted by Dogmann
@Max

I wasn't accusing you of being a culprit i was just stating what happened and whilst of course i agree no device is perfect on release and indeed needs some fixing. The issues i have raised concern basic functionality besides the panels of course and once again the point is these are not problems on other WM6.1 devices but are on the X1 so why is it so?

I also can't agree that SE had time constraints as this was a device announced in February and released September/October which is 7-8 months later and that really has to be plenty of time to have tested and fixed them. Just how long will it be before SE even release an updated firmware? Lets face it if it wasn't for some brilliant work by users who have developed and shared these tweaks where would a lot of users be? What about the users that don't visit forums and don't know about these tweaks and fixes?

Also i never suggested we should hate SE for this but surly they should be held accountable for their actions or in this case lack of.

Marc

_________________
Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.190, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year

[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-25 00:06 ]

Posted by aksd

On 2008-11-24 07:31:43, WhyBe wrote:
Tweakability is great, but, it should always be an option and not a requirement...especially in the iPhone era.
I don't want to spend more time tweaking than using.

@aksd:
Haven't seen you in a while. I thought you were either in jail, tired of us, pregnant or D-All of the above


LOL! I missed you too old chap . I've moved country, am in the UK now, doing my Masters so not much time to come online.

BTW I got a TOuch HD rather than the X1 .

Lke I said the X1 is no where close to an iPhone competitor(for the end user), enjoy it for what its worth and the tweaking is part of the parcel.

Posted by max_wedge
good to see you back aksd!

I will probably get an X1 primarily for the formfactor. The curved slide and the general ergonomics.

I also think the X1 camera, while not as good as SE other platforms, is pretty damn good for a winmo.

Also, as disapointing lack of dlna (or tv out) it's not a feature I plan to use mcuh so I won't miss it. Like you say with winmo tweaking is the order of the day.

I accept Dogmann's point's but I also have to say I've tweaked every winmo phone I own to get it to perform the way I like it. There always seems to be some major problem that has to be tweaked away. But yet I still count the winmo platform as my favourite mobile OS. A200 comes close second, and is actually better for a mobile phone, but if you want flexibility winmo wins out overall.


Posted by anonymuser
I think the problem with the X1 is it was pitched as a mass-market, consumer friendly phone, with SE supposedly waving their magic wand over WinMo and turning it into some super-slick interface with those brilliant active panels and SE style etc... and what's actually been delivered really is just a bog standard WM device. Yes the screen is good etc, but it really is just plain old WM underneath, with the same need for tweaks and fixes, the same user-unfriendliness in places, and the panels? Just a shortcut system, nothing more.

It's not (as some were hoping) an iPhone killer, it's not even a Touch Pro or a Touch HD killer, it's just another windows mobile phone with precious little SE influence.

[ This Message was edited by: Boinng on 2008-11-25 09:59 ]

Posted by MyP910
1. Am I using different phone ? I haven't done any tweaking to my xperia. Why must I tweak, when I have no problem with it ?

2. I don't know if doing the following is called tweak :-

a. I've installed tomtom navigator 7 and really really love it. Its very fast (maybe because I'm comparing with tomtom on P990). The GPS detection is very fast, faster than my Holux GPS receiver.

b. I've installed palringo for all my instant messaging (YM and MSN).

c. I've installed youtube and really love it. I can save the youtube file and can extract to MP3.

d. I've installed voice commander. I use quite frequently to check the battery level (because I want to hear the battery percentage).

e. I've installed SJphone and now I can use voipbuster to call abroad for free.

f. I've installed blackstone keyboard and start bar (finger friendly).

so, I'm not sure if the above is called tweaking. I've been using the phone for about a month....and running perfectly.

3. To talk about other winmo phone, my friend who use HTC touch pro is surprise with the speed of xperia compared to his phone.



Posted by max_wedge

On 2008-11-25 10:58:07, Boinng wrote:
I think the problem with the X1 is it was pitched as a mass-market, consumer friendly phone, with SE supposedly waving their magic wand over WinMo and turning it into some super-slick interface with those brilliant active panels and SE style etc... and what's actually been delivered really is just a bog standard WM device. Yes the screen is good etc, but it really is just plain old WM underneath, with the same need for tweaks and fixes, the same user-unfriendliness in places, and the panels? Just a shortcut system, nothing more.

It's not (as some were hoping) an iPhone killer, it's not even a Touch Pro or a Touch HD killer, it's just another windows mobile phone with precious little SE influence.

[ This Message was edited by: Boinng on 2008-11-25 09:59 ]

you are right but imho anyone who believes marketing hype deserves to be disappointed in my view. Why would anyone believe X1 is the next iphone?? I mean every touch interface lately is lauded as the next iphone, but so far none of them have come even close.

I don't think SE's marketing has been anymore or less inaccurate than any other OEM. I mean even the new Nokia Music Express touch screen is being lauded as iphone-esque but let's wait and see, what's the bet it's nothing like iphone.

I may be a bit harsh here but I haved learnt long ago, and I thought any rational reasonable human would have learnt also, that marketing is always a big fat lie to be ignored at best.

Spec sheet and user experience/reviews are the only useful ways to assess a new product before purchase (and a hands on demo if at all possible).

X1 IS a winmo, and to expect anything else is a little niaive.

Posted by Ves

On 2008-11-23 13:09:59, Dogmann wrote:
Hi all,

Now please don't get the wrong idea about this thread it is not about bashing the X1 it is about trying to understand it though.

Now i know most of these tweaks are quite simple and in fact due to the hard work of some they have even been combined into one package.

But my question is this why does the X1 need these in the first place when very similar devices like the Touch Pro or Touch HD don't. Both of those still have a need to be tweaked to perform better but they don't seem to need tweaks to address the same issues as the X1 has.

What i am talking about is the Tweaks and fixes like the ones below not the tweaks adding additional functionality such as Touch Flo 3D or additional keyboards or panles.


Bluetooth turning off with MortScript

Xperia Tweak not all of it but some of it.

Data connection/auto disconnect tweak.

As all three devices are running WM6.1 and have very similar hardware and this is why i can't really understand why some of these problems are only on the X1. Anyone have a good explanation of why?

Marc

_________________
Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.190, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year

[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-23 12:11 ]


The things your naming, don't happen to every X1 owner. Though the loudest voice their irritation about it, there are many who don't have these issue or all of them.


Posted by Dogmann
@Ves and My P910


Well if that's true the situation is even more strange then how can it only effect most but not all then? Maybe you are all getting different devices after all? Or just maybe some aren't even really using these functions so you don't notice or perceive these problems at all.

@My P910

In your list you don't mention one of the things that is effected and needs a fix. How about when Web Browsing can you get it to use your WiFi or will it just choose the 3G connection anyway? or do you just not care or know?


Do you use a Bluetooth Headset to even notice it doesn't hold a connection?

Do you have any E-Mail accounts set up? are they set to auto retrieve? and if so what Data connection do they use? and are you in control of when it connects or not?

Lastly is yours a Sim Free or branded unit?

So you see it's all very well saying you have no problems if you just don't use any of those features as you haven't come across or noticed them. As from what you typed as your use i can't see why you wanted a smartphone either but of course it's your money and choice.

Now if you think it's only a few people that have had these problems or needed to use the Xperia tweaks i suggest you check out XDA Forum and http://www.xperiax1.net/ to get a more balanced view then.

Marc

_________________
Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.190, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year

[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-26 12:24 ]

Posted by goldenface
That link seems to be broken for me Marc.

Is it working for anyone else?





Posted by SE-Naz
THe link works for me

Cheers
ENJOY

Posted by Dogmann
@Goldenface


Should work now as i used a capital X instead of lower case as was doing it from memory and now copied and pasted.


Marc

_________________
Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.190, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year

[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-26 12:26 ]

Posted by MyP910
@dogmann

1. I browse web extensively with my xperia. I have wifi and Hsdpa/3G connection on (at home). I don't have any problem. At the office I use Hsdpa only. I browse internet a lot on the bed (before sleep) for blog reading and youtube.

2. I use bluetooth headset (HBH-IV835) and I don't have a problem.... but I have to switch on the bluetooth on my phone.

3. I use Gmail account with my xperia.... and to be honest, I've stopped using my pc for emails as the one on xperia feels like sms. I set automatic check email every 2 hrs. for the connection, same as answer for No.1. I only use email on the pc for downloading big attachement.

4. Mine is O2 branded phone.

... as I said earlier, I don't have any complain with this phone...



[ This Message was edited by: MyP910 on 2008-11-26 15:49 ]

Posted by Astral1
[quote]
On 2008-11-26 13:12:51, Dogmann wrote:
@Ves and My P910


Now if you think it's only a few people that have had these problems or needed to use the Xperia tweaks i suggest you check out XDA Forum and http://www.xperiax1.net/ to get a more balanced view then.

Marc

Interesting that you mention XDA forum.

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=451110

Keep an eye on this poll. It doesnt agree with you at the moment. 26/11/08 7:07pm.

Posted by Dogmann
@Astral1

I never said the X1 was bad rubbish or anything like that but to say it is perfect and works perfectly is also far from being true.

That poll also doesn't take into account if any anyone has applied the tweaks and fixes to their X1 or not before voting. Maybe i should start a poll of how many people have added the Xperia Tweak, The Bluetooth fix and the No Data fix so that their X1 runs smoothly.

Now if the X1 didn't have any of these problems why would all the different tweaks of been created and used by so many then?

Perhaps you should read the Xperia tweaks thread with all the users that are thanking the creator for his good work and making their X1's work better.

Some of these problems have been reported not just by VodaFone or 02 users either. As to why some users have these problems whilst others don't also makes very little sense but it is what is happening. If i had kept my X1 i would definitely of had to apply many of these fixes as my VodaFone version had all these problems. But none of these tweaks would of fixed the things that where problems for me and why i sold mine, but at least i had one and used it so could decide for myself.

Marc


_________________
Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.190, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year

[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-26 19:35 ]

Posted by mattiL
Come on now, Dogmann

Who's said X1 "is perfect and works perfectly" ?

It's a WM phone....

And yes, it has some problems like bluetooth (I really dont like this problem),
email (which I don't use yet).

And probably a load of other stuff which I can't remember.

But perfect? I seriously don't think anyones said that yet....

But perhaps with FW update #1. : )

Posted by MyP910
@dogmann

Up until this moment, I still dont need any tweaking. I've installed tweak 2.0 once. The reason is to have a default panel at startup. that is the only reason. To me, this is not a tweaking to a problem but more a tweaking to a preference.

However, after install tweak 2.0, my x panel button didn't work and I can't change to other panel. Then i uninstall this application and have to restore back to factory setting.

Do I need the tweak ? the answer is no.

Do I think Xperia is perfect ? the answer is no. There is no mobile phone that is perfect. But if you ask me, between iphone and Xperia, I definitely choose Xperia... no doubt.

[ This Message was edited by: MyP910 on 2008-11-26 20:34 ]

Posted by max_wedge
@dogmann, it's very common for one user of a particular handset to have certain problems but not others.

For example I have a W910, it has never ever not even once restarted on it's own, yet some people report that this has happened to their own W910's. Enough people have reported this (not the majority of users btw, but a lot of people nevertheless) that it has become a myth that ALL W910 have this restarting problem. It's not true. I have none of the commonly reported issues with my handset.

As others has said before and I agree, it's more likely that people complain about a problem than mention that they have a perfectly working phone. For example I never mention my W910 has no problems until people come along and say ALL W910 have problems (and even then I'm just trying to balance out the argument). But the people who have problems complain LOUD and LONG about it.

So the reported instance of problem handsets is in fact a disproportionate ratio of actual problem handsets.

You will notice that whenever people mention problem handsets, there are always people who come along and say their own phones are fine. When this is not the case, it's a legitimate handset wide bug (such as memory problems on the P990, purple fringing in the K850 photos etc). So you can pretty much assume, if people are reporting that they don't have a particular problem when a bug is reported, that it means it's not a global problem.




Posted by mattiL
Oh yes, I do have another problem with my X1.

When I connect it by bluetooth to my Audi, the address book is synchronised to the car, but swedish characters are replaced by things like [ / and "space".

This worked ok with my P990i.

Clearly a bug.

[ This Message was edited by: mattiL on 2008-11-27 19:29 ]


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