Posted by paul101
can i be a wet blanket??
yes!
The number one biggest problem with Windows Mobile is its UI.
i have owned the htc touch for over a week now (as a second phone) and here is my verdict. not on the phone. but on the os, that is windows mobile
One thing that irritated the hell out of me using Windows Mobile was trying to really close an application. Pressing the end button on the handset or clicking close does not close the application. It minimizes it and leaves it running in the background!! To close the application you have to go into the task manager and close from there. Keeping the task manager clean is vital if you have a crappy phone like the HTC Touch that likes to guzzle battery power
-The basic "contacts" look-up is painful to use. tiny buttons, and again, such a slow and sluggish interface that I make loads of mistakes using it. asides from that, when you try to type in a number, you have to use your fingenail. the keys are just too small. you end up with an elongated version of your phone number. (unless you use the keypad) secondly. as above. you expect, if the thing has a touch screen, you can stabb at it with your finger most of the time. no; for one, every icon is stupidly small. you need to use the stylus 90%of the time!
just sitting the phone beside my p1i it shocked me ill-thought-out and unsatisfying windows mobile is
and, surely if you buy a smartphone, it should expect it to have a web browser capable of viewing full web pages? meanwhile, "Pocket IE" is behind again, forcing you to stick with WAP pages. and who wants to trundle through wap pages every day? (making it even worse where you are forced to use the stylus because links are so small)
some more basic problems - It's slow. Slow to the point where even making a normal phone call is tedious. Even the delay between hitting the green "phone" button and the dialler app coming up is horribly slow.
compared to other smartphones, it just doesn't stack up against them. windows mobile is designed for "business" people. then why do most businesses people use blackberry's?
As an operating system. it sucks. it fails epically to a basic function of all operating systems, even that one you wrote in your first year of University/College. Windows Mobile is incapable of returning used ram and you are left with a mobile phone that over time reduces how much available ram there is for a program to use! i do hope the x1 has allot of ram
all in all WM is very tedious, tedious to use and just like its desktop counterpart, it is just as bloated and maintenance is needed to make it work smoothly. the UI is not exactly the best. in fact. its the worst ive used, period. the phone lacks several functionalities you come to expect form a smart phone like being able to secure (encrypt) files and just doesn't perform 100%. it feels half arsed most of the time and sometimes it works the way you want
ive been pretty biased about this, and for me WM did not forfill my needs as a phone. or as a computer (ish) device. there are good things about WM (and thats for another thread) but after using a WM device for a while (a week). i just dont like it. i still have high hopes for the x1. but i'm not holding my breath... yes, the x1 will eventually replace my p1i unless something else pops up.
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[ This Message was edited by: paul101 on 2008-10-31 17:49 ]
Posted by JD4341
Paul
I replaced tmy P1 last week with an X1 on tho be honest I am considering going back to my P1. It is just easier and faster to use IMO. There are lots of people out there who like WM and the X1 and thats cool. The P1 is, well, just easier to use. I have better hopes for WM7
Posted by thomas93
Put android on your touch
Posted by MWEB
Golden rule is, WM needs a 524mhz CPU to make it zip along comfortably, and the 1st gen Tflo on the Touch is shockingly unresponsive too, the Diamonds/touch pro's/X1's offer an almost completely different experience to what you've had
Posted by myth®
@paul
A pretty long list of complaints you have there considering the time you spent with WM (1 week).
But I would describe your comments as 'first impressions' rather than a 'conclusion', as any platform obviously requires a longer period than a week in order to get used to it and to lesrn how things work, more so WM, and while I agree that it's about time for MS to rework its aging UI and to provide a fresh, more user friendly environment, most of your complaints aren't related with the OS, but with the hw specs of a specific device, namely 'HTC Touch', which is not really aimed at heavy business users. It's more a device for those who want a small trendy device with WM and its abilities.
As for your running tasks, have you ever wondered what long tapping (instead of short) the close button would do ?
There is even a setting to change between short and long tap for closing apps.
As for the UI in general, I don't care about its boring default appearance, as I can change the text sizes and also mask the today screen and many other instances of the UI with lots of different menus, shapes, icons or whatever.
Possibilities are almost endless in WM..
Memory leakage exists afaik on any platform and I believe that it is normal up to a degree.
While WM is certainly not perfect, it has far less shortcomings than other platforms imo.
Posted by carrier1
Mweb is right. And there are loads of 3rd party programmes to make it do what you want it to do. And as with ms desktop os, you have to take care of the registry etc... Download a programme called MemMaid, it will clean all leftovers, and you can tweak your touch. It's not free, but the trial is fully functional
you could also install pointUI to replace the touchflo! I like wm, but it's not userfriendly! At www.freewarepocketpc.net you can find many applications that will make it better. And touchpal is good for textinput!
Enjoy it
Posted by voda_jon
try adding the following software to your win mo device, they enhance what is a very good system and make life a lot easier!
SPB Mobile Shell - replaces the windows mobile shell with their own which is more mobile phone friendly and is very very finger friendly! I have been using it now for about 2 weeks on my omnia and i defo wont be going back to the samsung menu or windows mobile menu lol.
Oh and when i click close it really closes as spb mobile shell tweaks it so press the x and it really closes!!!!
And finally another program is X1 tweak... Has some good things like being able to give yourself more memory for programs etc It also allows you to put the sms back to standard one txt etc and not sms chat style. also has lots more but i cant be bothered going into them.
For both progs PM me for more details
Posted by Jah
SPB, 3D Touch Flo and Panels do make WM easier to use for people with no previous experience of WM devices and people who don't want to fiddle too much. Devices like the X1 and Touch Diamond are targetted at the mass market and most consumers want a device that is easy to use 'out off the box' and therefore I can see that even the Panels UI may be too much for many feature-phone users. UI is where the focus should be for SE and others as ehe WM OS is reasonably stable now and the h/w is good enough.
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[ This Message was edited by: Jah on 2008-11-01 07:33 ]
Posted by carrier1
@jah
You are right.
But another problem that casual wm users such as paul here may easily miss is similar to what causes problems on MS desktops: one must keep the registry 'clean', empty the browser cache and temp files etc etc... On a java or s60 you can try out many apps, then uninstall them etc and hardly feel a difference. Doing that on a wm phone leads very quickly indeed to sluggish behaviour. Trying a few apps and browsing a bit using pocket IE or opera mobile can easily steal half the phone's mem in a couple of days, and lead to freezes.
The new, more userfriendly ui replacements can mislead wm noobs - the phones are easy to use, don't look like wm, and casual users such as paul don't feel the need to really familiarise themselves with the os, which leads to the misplaced anger and frustration. The X1 is nice, but I think wm noobs should maybe start out on a really basic device, to learn the ropes
A wm device can be your best friend or your worst enemy. It's what you do with/to it, that matters.
Posted by Jah
@carrier1
totally agree. Symbian OS is much more stable especially the S60 variety. As you may be aware Nokia abandoned two of its touch UIs, Series 90 and Hildon for the Communicator that was never released. So we have a rock solid OS in Symbian but with the demise of UIQ we have no mature Symbian touch screen UI (I await the S60 5th Edition with an open mind!).
Posted by myth®
On 2008-11-01 10:16:25, carrier1 wrote:
The new, more userfriendly ui replacements can mislead wm noobs - the phones are easy to use, don't look like wm, and casual users such as paul don't feel the need to really familiarise themselves with the os, which leads to the misplaced anger and frustration.
He is complaining about WM's UI (functionality of the close button, contacts, etc.), not about the TF features, while the 1st gen TF interface is a very light implementation, which imo does not prevent you from learning the basics of the default WM UI anyway.
but I think wm noobs should maybe start out on a really basic device, to learn the ropes
That''s what he has and is complaining about: the HTC Touch
Posted by paul101
On 2008-11-01 10:16:25, carrier1 wrote:
@jah
You are right.
But another problem that casual wm users such as paul here may easily miss is similar to what causes problems on MS desktops: one must keep the registry 'clean', empty the browser cache and temp files etc etc... On a java or s60 you can try out many apps, then uninstall them etc and hardly feel a difference. Doing that on a wm phone leads very quickly indeed to sluggish behaviour. Trying a few apps and browsing a bit using pocket IE or opera mobile can easily steal half the phone's mem in a couple of days, and lead to freezes.
The new, more userfriendly ui replacements can mislead wm noobs - the phones are easy to use, don't look like wm, and casual users such as paul don't feel the need to really familiarise themselves with the os, which leads to the misplaced anger and frustration. The X1 is nice, but I think wm noobs should maybe start out on a really basic device, to learn the ropes
A wm device can be your best friend or your worst enemy. It's what you do with/to it, that matters.
cleaning the regis...
???
i have better things to do with my time. you shouldn't need to do that with a PHONE
Posted by Nanu
Glad to see your "Copy & Paste" is working Paul!
Why don't you write a review using your own words and findings?
http://216.239.59.104/search?[....]nk&cd=2&gl=uk&client=firefox-a
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/wh[....]are-going-to-fix-it-333536.php
Posted by masseur
I've never cleaned the registry, I have done quite a few nice "tweaks" in the registry though! and thats something thats not too easy on other phones
Posted by fatreg
On 2008-11-01 14:21:27, Nanu wrote:
Glad to see your "Copy & Paste" is working Paul!
Why don't you write a review using your own words and findings?
http://216.239.59.104/search?[....]nk&cd=2&gl=uk&client=firefox-a
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/wh[....]are-going-to-fix-it-333536.php
teeheeeheeeheeheehee
Posted by carrier1
Oh, pity that paul just wanted to rant.
A waste of time.
troll
Posted by fatreg
On 2008-10-31 18:49:15, paul101 wrote:
can i wet a blanket??
yes!
I do love editing quotes..
Posted by Dogmann
Hi all,
Isn't this all beginning to get a little more than silly with those attacking an OS and those defending an OS all having valid points.
Why can't we all just realise that there is no perfect OS for all same as there is no perfect device for all. We are all different so what some of us find acceptable to optimise a device and make it run smoothly others just don't want to have to do this.
I have to just accept the fact that WM is not the best OS for me which doesn't make it bad or rubbish just not for me is all. If others find it suits them best fair enough but these are usually the same people that will claim S60 or UIQ is rubbish instead of just accepting it's not best for them.
At least i actually try a device and OS before deciding and if asked i can explain exactly why it isn't right for me but just because it's not right for me doesn't mean it isn't the best for others. Nor should what i like and find to be best be best for anyone or everyone else either.
This one manufacturer or one OS is always best for all is just totally absurd and unrealistic as quite simply if this was true we would all be using the same device and OS and there would be no need for all the choices we have.
Quite simply if you don't like a OS or device then just don't use it and find the one that suits you best and use that.
I really don't understand why anyone feels that what is best and right for them has to be for every body else and anything else automatically has to be rubbish.
Marc
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Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-01 17:23 ]
Posted by myth®
On 2008-11-01 18:19:43, Dogmann wrote:
there is no perfect device for all.
So you're saying that visiting a WM forum and saying 'WM is bullsh*t'' makes as little sense as regularly visiting a UIQ forum (for the past 1-2 years now) just in order to remind UIQ users what a useless piece of junk a device without HSDPA late 2006/2007/2008 is ?
I agree.
Silly or not, as long as there are attackers, there will always be some defenders.
Posted by carrier1
@dogman,
Your are right.
However, you are so very diplomatic. I don't see the point of an obvious rant, when the original poster has absolutely no interest in what he is ranting about. If you read back, you'll find that almost every single reply made more sense than the rant by someone who probably just hates windows anyways. Paul, assuming he actually has a Touch, either just wanted his bad opinion of wm confirmed when he bought(?) the device and therefore made no effort to learn about the os. Or, in his opinion all phones should be exactly like the one he likes, only better
When s.o. bangs that much rubble on one side of the scale, you have to expect others to exert some extra pressure on the other side.
Your common sense standards are high and don't apply...
Unfortunately!
Posted by Mr Miyagi
One of my reasons for not going for the x1, omnia is windowz OS. Thats why I just prefer Apple
so much better than windowz. Sorry for the hijack of the threat. Just thought I throw in my thought
Posted by Dogmann
@Myth
I didn't just turn up in UIQ3 threads declaring it was rubbish and having never used a single UIQ3 device either. What i did do was pointed out why UIQ was no longer viable for me and what IMO it was missing something that i was not alone in holding that opinion on either. I was only countering the absurd declarations that UIQ3 was best and the many claims of how it was going to be better than anything else with mysterious devices that failed to see the light of day. Which after the recent announcement of Motorola canning their UIQ range we will never see.
Hell i loved and used UIQ right up to UIQ3 which to me was slow and missing much needed features. Now maybe over the last two years and as now i am not in so much pain i have mellowed a lot and my anger at being let down has diminished. As in life you need to evolve with the changing times and what our devices offer. Despite what many where happy to claim about me be being this huge Nokia fan i don't even own one and actually only used S60 for a little over 2 years.
At least i tried the X1 to see if it suited me or not and perhaps you have managed to miss all the positive things i have said about it and SE. So again I'm not quite this massive SE hater either but i do comment on how i find things not based just on who made them or what OS they are running.
Marc
_________________
Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.168, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-01 22:08 ]
Posted by myth®
Marc,
I did not miss your detailed and factual posts about the X1 and why, despite being overall an excellent device, it had to return in its box and I must say, I liked it.
I wish that you could've presented the same factual and positive attitude in the UIQ section, but instead you dropped in every once in a while and always told us the same story of how rubbish UIQ products are.
As you said, there is no perfect device for all, and if someone prefers to use a UIQ product despite its weaknesses or shortcomings, there must be a reason for it and you, dear Marc, should be able to show a little respect or simply ignore or stay away from the UIQ user group & forum and express your disappointments for SE elsewhere, as your comments in the forum really did not take us any further.
Posted by Dogmann
@Mtyh
Sorry but UIQ is now firmly in the past and all those things that were missing in 2006 never found there way into UIQ. So no it was not possible to compliment UIQ on getting HSDPA or faster processors or using larger screens as that never happened did it?
Hopefully as SE have shown with the X1 that they can deliver a well built device with all the latest spec's they will do this with their next Symbian based devices and they may still have something of UIQ in the UI as really that's the best UIQ fans can now hope for IMO.
Marc
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Blackberry Bold, V4.6.0.168, 8GB SDHC, Pin2553F455
Honoured to have Won Best Debater for the 2nd Year
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-11-02 15:42 ]
Posted by carrier1
I thought this was about paul hating wm?
???
Posted by Mizzle
I've maybe used the stylus 5 times during my 2 weeks with X1. It's not that bad
Posted by Nanu
On 2008-11-02 16:47:01, carrier1 wrote:
I thought this was about paul hating wm?
???
This was about Paul pointing out that somebody else doesn't like WM and that he agreed!
But forgot to give credit to the original author.
Posted by makbil
I've been a UIQ user since the P800 and still have my P990 and P1 as well as a Tytn II.
The biggest advantage WM has is the enormous amount of software available for it, us UIQ users are not used to such big numbers
I have installed a number of programs on my Tytn II and as a result it is totally finger friendly and has almost none of the restrictions inherent in the Microsoft Mobile OS. I can even say that with three exceptions my WM device is easier to use than my P1, the exceptions being hand writing recognition, battery life and the number of fields in contacts.
As far as WM devices are concerned, I prefer to stick with HTC for the time being for the simple reason that HTC devices seem to be the standard on which WM is based, so there are no compatibility issues unlike most of the other brands. I have already upgraded my Tytn II to WM 6.1. I'm not sure if such upgrades will be possible for X1 based on past experience with SE.
Posted by mattiL
There's absolutely no need to clean the registry on the X1!
They have the excellent Hard Reset feature, seems to solve several problems on this phone...
I had problems with file transfer over USB being interrupted, crashes in different parts of the system (like file manager and other apps, fault reporter seems to work reliably though ; ) )
I've read somewhere that the reasons for some crashes may be SBP Mobile Shell (full version) and Hard Reset solved these problems.
After the last Hard Reset I installed the SBP Panel instead, no crashes yet (2 days and counting).
(of course, make sure you have a backup of your address book and other important stuff before using this feature)
Regarding general use of the phone, like trying to make a call. Yes, using the contacts list without the pen is a mess, especially as the virtual keyboard is useless without the pen. And the swedish phones lacks text recognition.
Scrolling the contacts list is nice looking, but it would be nice if the scrolling stopped a bit fasters (instead of scolling the whole list all the time).
No, I would say making a call or sending an SMS is no one handed task.
Way easier on my trusty p990i (or p910 or p800).
And I have not even started on the bluetooth #?!**!! funtionality yet..
Posted by carrier1
'no need to clean the registry', right?!
You are very much mistaken! Have you ever removed a program on xp or vista using MS's add/remove feature? Have ou ever checked afterwards for 'junk' using ccleaner or revo? That is exactly what happens with wm! Try a programme like MemMaid before you turn your wishful thinking into a stated 'fact'!
In fact, you don't need to remove a program from your x1 to create junk keys. All it takes is changing the order of items in the start menu. Etc etc etc etc... The 'w' in wm stands for 'windows'! If you don't want to see yourself whining about the sluggishness that's affecting your x1 in a couple of months, or the failure to start new programs or re-installed programs somewhere down the line, you better take off the pink glasses.
Your wm X1 will give you joy for some time yet, but YES: if you don't take care of uninstall junk etc, you will soon have a much slower X1!
And have a look at some samsung omnia forums, where peeps suddenly find their once fast phone strangely slowed down... It's not voodoo
Posted by mattiL
Hmm
Maybe I should explain what Hard Reset means.
It completetely resets the phone to what was delivered from factory, everything you used to have installed needs to be reinstalled.
I'm fairly certain the registry is clean too. ; )
Posted by makbil
Hard reset is not a unique X1 feature, I believe most WM devices have it, in fact, HTC Tytn II does have it for a fact, you just need to know the right key combination to activate it.
I'm not happy about reading so many problems on X1. My Tytn II, right out of the box with WM 6.0 was very stable, after installing WM 6.1 ROM it's even better, no crashes or freezes, all PPC applications install and work properly, in short, no compatibility issues.
Obviously, being a MS product, WM would display most of the bloated Windows behavior but it's not really any worse than UIQ3's present state.
I would recommend PocketCM, a contacts manager without a stylus - it's the best I've seen and it's free.
Posted by jalal
Got my X1 yesterday, it's beautiful, great to hold and very sexy looking. Everyone that see's it wants a feel and to know what it is, since its not on sale in Bahrain until the end of the month. One thing that killed the phone for me and I want to get rid of it ASAP! The damn OS, I knew I hate Windows mobile but still thought since this is an SE I'd give it a go. Sadly we'll have to part company, not worth keeping in my collection either, since its not a phone that I'll love. I wish that SE would release the same phone with Symbian, which will make a huge difference for me.