Posted by Dogmann
@WhyBe
Oh dear oh dear,
Slimmer sexier with a price to be paid in a less functional keyboard. It's a smart phone it isn't meant to or needs to be sexy it's performance is what counts. Not impressing people with it's looks just how shallow are you?
I told you i don't want need or like Touchscreens so whilst that may be good for you it isn't for me.
The E90 has a 800x352 but is 4" so is larger than the X1's.
Has faster CPU and you missed more Ram but because it needs it that's why. We will see when it launches just how it performs and if it faster or not than the E90.
You are wrong about the E90 only playing 24fps H.264 as all my media is converted @25fps and all plays fine and we will have to wait and see if the X1 does indeed play it or not.
Has a grown mans OS and may have an update to WM7 no one knows that for sure do they.
As opposed to the worlds best selling OS used by more people in more devices than WM by quite some margin.
More efficient battery use based on what? best time estimates from the manufacturer before the product is even finished counts for nothing I'm afraid. The E90 has 1500aMh Li-Polymer battery that is proven to give great battery life the X1's is unproven so again lets wait and see shall we.
Sorry but none of those impress me in the slightest as why i should wait another 4-5 months and upgrade to a device that is not even it's equal.
As sorry but the X1's keyboard is not as good and neither is the screen as large or as good as it's a touchscreen and that's just the price you pay for a touchscreen I'm afraid.
The Multimedia support is also better on the E90 and i much prefer S60 to WM and yes i have tried WM to reach my decision.
But if it's good for you get it but i won't.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-20 21:19 ]
Posted by Tigon
lol it's in spanish, the x1 will be a great device no doubt about that especially with touchflo, i did state so a while back that the orientation button will act as the touchflo activation key, more info on the validty of that claim soon.
[ This Message was edited by: Tigon on 2008-06-20 21:21 ]
Posted by WhyBe
@Tigon:
Thanks for the video link.
What would a "TouchFlo" key do?
@Dogmann
You stated yourself that your e90 doesn't play 30fps h.264 VGA. Well, the X1 does. I gave you the link a few posts back on the last page. Here it is again.
Don't fight the feelin!
Posted by Dogmann
@Whybe
Oh come on you can't really be serious just what do you expect any manufacturer to say about a rivals device then get real. Well i sure hope for those that get one they improve the speed from that video as boy is it slow to react. I went and made a cup of tea while it booted up as even when it opened the fist panel it was still not usable with the spinning Windows timer.
@tigon
No it hasn't changed my mind in the slightest it's far to slow and keyboard is a big disappointment it has far to much space wasted and i prefer performance over looks. If you or anyone else just wants something that's just pretty go for it. Personally will take function and performance over looks any day.
Listen no one says you have to like or want a E90 it's not a device for everyone but i will happily take it's extra size and weight for a 4" screen and 57 key keyboard with an extra 8 shortcuts. It runs Tom Tom Seven Push E-Mail and has one of it not the best browsers of any device, it plays all my Films and TV shows perfectly on it's 4" screen so far it is the best device i have owned and used.Oh and it boots in 27 seconds so sorry but the X1 just doesn't come close well not for me.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-20 21:40 ]
Posted by WhyBe
Dogmann, I'll bet you have on a tight shirt with a big capital 'H' on the chest...with a red cape blowing in the wind
Posted by dr.W
On 2008-06-20 22:19:02, Dogmann wrote:
@WhyBe
Oh dear oh dear,
Slimmer sexier with a price to be paid in a less functional keyboard. It's a smart phone it isn't meant to or needs to be sexy it's performance is what counts. Not impressing people with it's looks just how shallow are you?
I told you i don't want need or like Touchscreens so whilst that may be good for you it isn't for me.
The E90 has a 800x352 but is 4" so is larger than the X1's.
Has faster CPU and you missed more Ram but because it needs it that's why. We will see when it launches just how it performs and if it faster or not than the E90.
You are wrong about the E90 only playing 24fps H.264 as all my media is converted @25fps and all plays fine and we will have to wait and see if the X1 does indeed play it or not.
Has a grown mans OS and may have an update to WM7 no one knows that for sure do they.
As opposed to the worlds best selling OS used by more people in more devices than WM by quite some margin.
More efficient battery use based on what? best time estimates from the manufacturer before the product is even finished counts for nothing I'm afraid. The E90 has 1500aMh Li-Polymer battery that is proven to give great battery life the X1's is unproven so again lets wait and see shall we.
Sorry but none of those impress me in the slightest as why i should wait another 4-5 months and upgrade to a device that is not even it's equal.
As sorry but the X1's keyboard is not as good and neither is the screen as large or as good as it's a touchscreen and that's just the price you pay for a touchscreen I'm afraid.
The Multimedia support is also better on the E90 and i much prefer S60 to WM and yes i have tried WM to reach my decision.
But if it's good for you get it but i won't.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-20 21:19 ]
First, how do you justify telling people to withhold judgment on the X1's battery, saying that though it is the same size as the E90's it may not be as good, but you come right out and say the keyboard is not as good-have you used the keyboard? Also, do you know the screen won't be as good as the E90's? True touchscreens are usually not as bright as non-touchscreens, but do we know for a fact that this will be the case with the X1? Unless you've used a final production version you are really just guessing here. Again, with multimedia support you are making blanket statements about platforms without ever having used the X1, you really don't know how it will perform in a multimedia capacity.
Here are two important areas in which the X1 is superior to the E90:
1 Its smaller and thinner, so easier to use.
2. It's 3G services will work in the US, where I live.
I'm not saying the E90 is not a great phone, if Nokia made a slimmer and shorter version of it with US 3G I would be tempted to buy it. I like touchscreens, they make navigating faster and easier, but that's personal preference.
On a side note, I just don't understand why you get so angry, or at least adopt an angry tone, about something as ultimately trivial as cell phones. You take people to task for making statements they can't substantiate but you are just as guilty yourself. What's the deal?
Posted by Humble
lol you lot give me joke, I do like both devices, tbh, i must also admit that I had in my possesion s e90 for aboutan hour (my friends), all i can rember that this was a power house device, i was watching David Attenborough it was very clear
and FAST!!! every time i clicked a button it responded very quickly yes it was a little big but liked it alot,
btw when you write a reply on the forum does your cursor jump to another line randomly
mine does lol
Posted by Dogmann
@Whybe
Now you are starting to quote me as saying what you say listen you believe what you want and we will see when it arrives how it performs. I don't hate it it just don't love the X1 or want one if you do fine get one.
@Dr W
I didn't claim anything of the sort about the battery and i keep saying lets wait and see how it performs. It is Whybe that suddenly thinks WM with all the panels running is going to use less battery not me. But i can count how many keys the X1 has and see how spaced they are as well as the comments from people saying it lacks tactile feed back and travel and that the top row are to close to the screen to be comfortable. Now compare that with my 57 keys nicely spaced and with great tactile feedback and that's how and why i say the X1's is inferior.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-20 22:29 ]
Posted by WhyBe
@Dogmann
Is there any chance that after holding an X1 in your hand and using it for awhile, that you would consider getting one?
Posted by VinnyP!
Please tell me one thing that the X1 offers that is better than my year old E90 has got? go on then just one and not the touchscreen as i don't won't one or need one.
A real monty Python moment. Tell me what the X1 has got that the E90 hasn't except not any of the things that the X1 has the E90 hasn't. Touch screens are good things for most users including me. WM has a wider set of better applications. The X1 has better battery life in a smaller package
Posted by Dups!
@WhyBe
Your loyalty is admirable it must be said. You must however understand that a lot of us who are unhappy with SE are former, and to a certain degree still are, supporters of SE. Hammering SE on their lack of innovation is telling them to do something about the current state of their lacklustre products.
I've been with SE since the Ericsson days (for approximately 10 years now) and I know what Ericsson is capable of. I also know what SE is capable of, I've owned the T610, K700 and F500. Now the only SE I have is the still superb P910i- the best SE I've ever owned- and is still in perfect working condition after three years. SE used to give us the best products that is why some of us are complaining when they fail miserably when compared to the likes of Nokia. Nokia was no match for SE before they released the N95, that was the turning point right there and ever since SE can't seem to be able to react to that moment.
I now use a Motorola V8 as my main line and the P910i as my business line. The V8 is my first non Ericsson/Sony Ericsson phone ever. The E90 was almost my first ever non E/SE phone but I found it big when I tested it. It must be said that it was one hell of a phone when I played with it and it really is a shame that an old phone like that is being compared to the yet to be released X1. I was set on getting the X1 despite not liking the Windows OS on it but the news that it was pushed back made me rethink my decision. Personally, I would love a UIQ version of the same phone with improved specs. Now that I would buy in a second provided it is stable of course
What some of us are saying is that SE can do better than this, it has for 5 and a half years. It does look like they're trying because certain things are changing, the Xperia brand promises great things and the first product from that line isn't necessarily bad but slow in release, the C905 is a nice product though it lacks a few features (nothing's perfect afterall) but overall it shows the direction SE is headed.
The mistake you and some members are making is to think that we want SE to fail, on the contrary we want what SE has always given us- Top specced products that are stable and brilliant to use. For me SE is underperforming hence people have lost faith in the brand even their market share has dwindled and they're number 5 behind LG.
I've waiting for a smartphone that would replace my P910i but there isn't any at this stage. The E90 was the one but the size. So, here's hoping that SE announces a high end UIQ smartphone within the next month or I guess I'm left with Nokia's next smartphone or even Motorola. I'm not the least bit interested in either LG or its cousin Samsung, they are really not and never will be products I'd consider in mobile phones.
Posted by WhyBe
@EMS06
Well stated. You and I have one thing in common: we own the p910 and believe
"fell off" after that. I agree that maybe are not making the greatest decisions in product design, but, it seems like the X1 is a return to the old p910 school of thought.
I don't know if
is having managment problems or just hired the wrong leaders, but now the G702 and Paris have been cancelled. Maybe that's good. Perhaps they will be re-introduced properly on another newer hardware platform?
Disliking
's direction is one thing, but constantly slamming an unreleased device based on incorrect rumours is hating. There has been no delay, no panel problems nor proof of either. The video playback even outperforms the e90 and Dogmann doesn't seem to want to acknowledge it...that's hating [ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-21 12:56 ]
Posted by Dogmann
@Whybe
Which bit of i don't like touch screens, i don't like WM and i don't like the X1's keyboard can you just not understand it is just not a device for me. If it is for you great buy it but even if you send me one for free it is just not my type of device please try and understand that simple fact.
As for that clip proving the X1 is better than the E90 oh please be serious that's a joke. As for the other rumors as you call them please explain how other peoples comments that have a unit are not valid but all BengleBoy says is as he only compliments the X1 just how does that work then?
Again i don't hate the X1 i just don't love it like you or make ridiculous statements about how brilliant it is going to be when you or anyone else just can't know all you can do is hope and wish it is.
@VinnyP!
What are you talking about a touch screen may be best for you but NOT FOR ME and others it isn't.
WM is better and has more applications? well that's really great if you like WM but i don't and the it's the quality of the apps as well as the quantity. S60 has all the apps i or most people need and it's the most successful and used OS not WM.
Again why has the X1 got better battery life? this is totally unproven as is based on estimated time and not based on actual use or a finished product. So at this time no one knows i never claimed the E90's was better WhyBe has claimed the X1's is and he or you or anyone else just can know this yet. So please be realistic and don't try and claim things i have said that i haven't or things about the X1 that no one yet knows.
That's it for me in this thread i will wait till the X1's released and see what it actually delivers and how well it works. Until then all this speculation is just pointless.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-21 13:36 ]
Posted by WhyBe
The iPhone isn't for me. It lacks a keyboard, video recording and it isn't fully featured. I think I'll go hang around some iPhone forums to let them know exactly how I feel.
Posted by tonyitalian
can anyone pls tell me when this will be available?? pleaseeeeeeeee
Posted by mode
On 2008-06-20 20:57:10, Dogmann wrote:
Please tell me one thing that the X1 offers that is better than my year old E90 has got? go on then just one and not the touchscreen as i don't won't one or need one.
I can name you at least 3 things off the bat on X1 that your sacred almighty E90 just can't touch
1. HSUPA
2. Touchscreen
3. Aesthetics
Posted by Dogmann
@Mode
Very good i said besides a touch screen as for me that really is not important it's even in the quote you used.
The fact it's feature is important for you just doesn't make it so for me.
Looks are a personal thing and i prefer the look and styling of my E90 by far and the keyboard to. Now if you prefer the X1 fine buy it.
Well done HSUPA is the one and only thing but seeing as i don't upload to a website and only really send E-Mail HSUPA is totally pointless and unnecessary. I wonder just how many will really use it and just how needed is for most users.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-21 23:44 ]
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-21 23:54:29, tonyitalian wrote:
can anyone pls tell me when this will be available?? pleaseeeeeeeee
@tonyitalian
I'm guessing Sept/Oct. There has been no official announcement except this right here. And this also.
@Dogmann
Don't forget CPU speed, memory, and memory expandability. And also speedy program switching--everything two presses away from anywhere.
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 05:30 ]
Posted by mode
On 2008-06-22 00:41:19, Dogmann wrote:
@Mode
I wonder just how many will really use it and just how needed is for most users.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
It is just such 'doubtful' attitude that caused SE to fall behind like when they thought HSDPA would not make a strong impact and omitted it from most of their phones till just recently. Trust me, I found the need for fast and reliable uploading as soon as I started using 3G and, it will find its importance and will be a start for SE to be a pioneer in at least this technology. I thought you didn't 'hate' SE and would be happy that they're beginning somewhere. You shouldn't be too harsh and bitter just because it has presented specs that isn't your thing like the touchscreen I mentioned. I mentioned it not to tailor to your needs but mine, just like aesthetics.
Posted by aksd
@mode
Agree with you on a few points. HSUPA is a mus, but remember this is'nt SE's doing its the Qualcomm chipset which supports it and the X1 is basically nothing but a HTC in SE clothing, wheather anybody would like to accept it or not is immaterial it is what it is.
@WhyBe
The CPU speed hardly influences it much, the OMAP2420 clocked at 350Mhz is more efficent than the MSM7200A due to excellent intergration between the processor and the GPU, a lot of the CPU load is taken by the PowerVR GPU. On the MSM7200A the 3D implementation is sub standard and most of the load is taken by the CPU.
To tell you the truth the E90 and the X1 might just have the same amount of RAM at bootup about 80-90MB. But the difference is that the X1 would already have the mediaplayer and other utilities loaded up on the RAM while the E90 wont. Remember all we are doing is speculating at this moment. You really cant tell which will have more free mem till the final product is out. Just because it says 256MB on paper does'nt mean the user gets more mem. A diamond with 19MB RAM has less free RAM at boot than my TyTn II with 128.
The two press thing is'nt just X1 specific, you can make any WM phone behave similarly, so many today plugins to choose from, your phone can look totally different every day if you please
.
Posted by drsilverworm
In a thread about the Xperia X1, all Dogmann has contributed is how the X1 just isn't the phone for him and his E90 is the perfect fit for him.
He has about 5 posts for every page, and hasn't said anything unbiased towards his own opinions yet.
How is this not trolling? Please leave Dogmann. You're making it harder for people like myself to read the actually interesting contributions other X1 enthusiasts have to share.
We get it, you're a Nokia fan. It got old after the 5th post.
Posted by mode
On 2008-06-22 07:46:04, aksd wrote:
@mode
Agree with you on a few points. HSUPA is a mus, but remember this is'nt SE's doing its the Qualcomm chipset which supports it and the X1 is basically nothing but a HTC in SE clothing, wheather anybody would like to accept it or not is immaterial it is what it is.
Well, apparently I meant a pioneer in the implementation of new technologies instead of development, since they have been quite reserved in adopting anything new for a while now. Yeah, we would all have to learn to accept that it's an HTC gadget by now
Posted by tonyitalian
does anyone think its wise to wait for the xperia till october?? or sgud i get the samsung i900 omnia??
Posted by >500
On 2008-06-22 09:45:04, tonyitalian wrote:
does anyone think its wise to wait for the xperia till october?? or sgud i get the samsung i900 omnia??
if the i900 fits your requirements, then go with that.
but its's really up to you to decide.....
im curious to see if any more changes are going to be made on the x1 just like 256mb ram was added.....
Posted by mib1800
@tonyitalian
imo, there is no point waiting for X1 as it will sometime before it comes on the market (worst case will be next year). Furthermore, it gonna be expensive. Well, HTC already would make a bunch of profit off SE on the hardware. It is much cheaper to buy from HTC direct instead of from middleman SE.
I am also looking at i900. I think the i900 is better because of larger screen, 5MP cam, haptic feedback, accelerometer and of course built-in 16Gb + card slot. If you like the X1 panels, I bet some hackers would ripped it off to be used on any WM.
[ This Message was edited by: mib1800 on 2008-06-22 09:01 ]
Posted by dalevil
yeah ur right guys... but the point there is what really fit on our needs... but i love the xperia... cant wait for that
Posted by >500
Yes the i900 does look very good. With the specs it has, it could very well be the best offering on the market when its released, providing everything functions smoothly of course. though samsung are usually reliable on that front.....
personally, i NEED a physical keypad/keyboard of some sort.
so if i HAD to choose out of ONLY those 2 phones, i would go for the x1.
Posted by aksd
The hardware in the i900 is just far out.
The processor is the new Marvel PXA310 @624Mhz it has video acceleration and can playback 700 and something videos which is better than VGA. It has OpenGL 1.1 support. A very efficent processor. SHould enjoy watching videos on it although it does'nt have a 3D gaming accelerator, not sure how it'll fare on the gamin front.
The only negative on the i900 is the wierd screen resolution of 400*240, applications might be a problem. Also since most WM apps are written for HTC based phone you might come across a bit of incompatibility. That problem does'tn exist on the X1.
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-22 07:46:04, aksd wrote:
@mode
...and the X1 is basically nothing but a HTC in SE clothing, wheather anybody would like to accept it or not is immaterial it is what it is.
Yes, but, SE is going to reap all the credit and brand recognition in the market for X1, not HTC. So all future Xperia devices, manufactured by HTC or not, will be credited to the SE brand name. Who's heard of the company that manufactured the p910 ?
@WhyBe
The CPU speed hardly influences it much, the OMAP2420 clocked at 350Mhz is more efficent than the MSM7200A due to excellent intergration between the processor and the GPU, a lot of the CPU load is taken by the PowerVR GPU. On the MSM7200A the 3D implementation is sub standard and most of the load is taken by the CPU.
The CPU speed hardly influences it much, the OMAP2420 clocked at 350Mhz is more efficent than the MSM7200A due to excellent intergration between the processor and the GPU, a lot of the CPU load is taken by the PowerVR GPU. On the MSM7200A the 3D implementation is sub standard and most of the load is taken by the CPU.
What are you basing that on...the TyTnII ?
To tell you the truth the E90 and the X1 might just have the same amount of RAM at bootup about 80-90MB. But the difference is that the X1 would already have the mediaplayer and other utilities loaded up on the RAM while the E90 wont. Remember all we are doing is speculating at this moment. You really cant tell which will have more free mem till the final product is out. Just because it says 256MB on paper does'nt mean the user gets more mem. A diamond with 19MB RAM has less free RAM at boot than my TyTn II with 128.
So far, as of the last ROM, the 128MB X1 has 33MB of free memory on boot. However, since we know the X1 is going to have 256MB, that leaves 161MB of free RAM on startup. It would be nice to see what type of mind blowing application
includes in the final unit that would consume most of the 161MB remaining memory .
The two press thing is'nt just X1 specific, you can make any WM phone behave similarly, so many today plugins to choose from, your phone can look totally different every day if you please .
.Can you give some examples of "two-press" app-to-app switching in other WM devices?
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-22 09:58:52, mib1800 wrote:
...Well, HTC already would make a bunch of profit off SE on the hardware. It is much cheaper to buy from HTC direct instead of from middleman SE...
@mib1800
This would be true if we were only in it to purchase hardware instead of the overall phone design. The i900 is just a basic WM device with no extra work by Samsung on the software side. The hardware is obviously only a portion of the total X1 package.
This i900 demo doesn't look very elegant at all
In fact, let me be the first to say the i900 interface works like crap. I hope Samsung get their act together before releasing this thing.
Has Dogmann gone to bed and put you on duty?
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 14:49 ]
Posted by aksd
@WhyBe
The P910 was manufactured by SE, their low end phones at the time were manufactured by FlexTronics. True that the X1 will be thought of as an SE, even the chaps at HTC service center do not know the X1 is a HTC. But what I meant is give credit where it is due. SE have'nt done crap with regards to the low level implementation of X1 hardware.
Not everyone base mindlessly believe whats written on the net. Most of us base our opinions on what we experience and not make baseless statements while using tech thats over 3 years old. Why dont you take a moment of your time, which you spend arguing here, and read some posts on WM forums regarding the Diamond.
the MSM7201A has problem with the GPU implementation. This I gather from using a Diamond as well as from people who use the Diamond, if you even bothered to visit WM based forums you'd know this. ANd before you go on about the MSM7200A is different from the MSM7201A thats only with the video decoding bit and not with the OpenGL implememtnation or 3D hardware implementation. Qualcomm have removed any references to 3D hardware on the MSM7200 series of chipset as well. Just because you are quite ignorant when it comes to WM handset do not assume that the other members posting here are as ignorant as you are.
About the RAM, I suppose you are partly blind as well as being ignorant, I have mentioned in several posts why they needed 256MB RAM, its because off the apps associated with the panel, I doubt BengalBoys unit had fully functional panel with all of SE's intended apps.
There are several task switchers as well as Today screen plugins that allow you to switch tasks with even a single press. I have mentioned them in my earlier posts and I tire of repeating what I post, if you are interested search for them, or use google as normal people do.
THe hardware offered by Samsung make sup for the stupid childish today screen plugin they have.
[ This Message was edited by: aksd on 2008-06-22 15:06 ]
[ This Message was edited by: aksd on 2008-06-22 15:10 ]
Posted by WhyBe
@aksd
Touchy, touchy !!?
You rarely show evidence to support your "expertise"
On 2008-06-22 16:01:28, aksd wrote:
@WhyBe
...the MSM7201A has problem with the GPU implementation. This I gather from using a Diamond as well as from people who use the Diamond, if you even bothered to visit WM based forums you'd know this....
....Just because you are quite ignorant when it comes to WM handset do not assume that the other members posting here are as ignorant as you are.
Would you care to enlighten everyone here on the MSM72xx GPU implementation problem and how it affects the
X1?
About the RAM, I suppose you are partly blind as well as being ignorant, I have mentioned in several posts why they needed 256MB RAM, its because of the apps associated with the panel, I doubt BengalBoys unit had fully functional panel with all of SE's intended apps.
BengalBoy only has the 128MB unit right now. And it is running smoothly (graphics and all). He's getting the 256MB shortly. Here's what he specualtes the additional 128MB of RAM was for.
BengalBoy wrote: I really think that the device is moving up to the 256mb range to improve speed and support of very RAM intensive operations such as playback of streaming video.... see above... TV services are popping up on carriers and a device that is gonna be able to connect, download, and display this data seemlessly while other features such as phone, bluetooth, email, etc... are running in the background is gonna require additional RAM. Basically, I think that by next year all Windows Mobile Devices are gonna start carrying a 256mb RAM chip on-board so carriers can sell their new Multi-Media services to the public.
There are several task switchers as well as Today screen plugins that allow you to switch tasks with even a single press. I have mentioned them in my earlier posts and I tire of repeating what I post, if you are interested search for them, or use google as normal people do.
Hmm, PointUI and sbpmobile
So you can't come up with any huh? I said "two-press" app switching...anywhere to anywhere.
The hardware offered by Samsung makes up for the stupid childish today screen plugin they have.
This sentiment doesn't cut it in an iPhone world...
There's no more half - @ssing allowed.[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 16:28 ]
Posted by darknoob
Guys,
tell me what do you want to know about X1 I -may- try it tomorrow (
Posted by aksd
You really do know how to rile someone up dont you
.
I'm more of an expert than you at least
, Never called myself an expert, but from what I can see most persons using WM seem to agree with me, thats because I use the tech day to day, not just an arm-chair commentor. I also program on the platform and do have connection with the actual indsutry. You dont see me posting on something I'm not sure of so strongly now do you.
ANyway, regarding the MSM72 series chipset. It seems that when OpenGL tests we conducted on the Diamond it supported only 1.0. Also during gameplay when the touch screen was touched it slowed down the game considerably like on the TyTn II, some people reported that VGA @ 30fps played flawlessly and soem people mentioned dropped frames, I do not have the kbps it was encoded at but they were ususally avi files. Also the low level programmer on xda-dev have mentioned that after analyzing the drivers the implementation of the drivers on the Diamond are similar to that on the LG KS20 which is'nt fully hardware accelerated. There are certain apps used to check hardware acceleration and when used on the diamond still show that the 3D acceleration is mostly software based. Anything more required old chap
?
I have mentioned the apps before, one of them is dyanmo 2 for PPC. It gives you similar panels to the SE panels except its a task switcher, the panels are only of running apps. Very cool.
Next you have another task switch I forget its name, I posted it earlier. Then you have Point UI, in 3 clicks you can access a really cool task manager. For a diamond like plugin you can check out www.throttlelauncher.com and theres another diamond type plugin available, but I forget its name, its superior to throttle launcher I've heard but I have'nt used it. The you've got SPB Mobile Shell you can do anythign there with 2 clicks, task Man, Multimedia, etc. its all about how you set up the app. Then theres ultimate launcher, a cube for the today screen, the entire tday screen is converted into a cube and you can virtual access anything on your PPC just from the today screen. Then there RLTOday, again you can utilise the today screen and make it finger friendly, then theres the LG today plugin like on the KS20, and the Gsmart today plugin, very cool but works only partly. Lots of task switchers are available and sice I only use SPB I'm not too familiar with them.
A while ago when I set up my phone to be completely finger friendly, I wanted to take a video and show you that WM phones tday have decent finger friendly apps and not dependant on half arsed implememtnations from SE, but sadly I went a bit too far and messed up my registry. The next time I get some time to do will surely send you a video. If you've got the time, which I suppose you do head on over to xda and check it out.
None of the today plugins or apps cut it in a iPhone world
, the real competition the iPhone will get is from WM7 and Android. Stop thinking that the panels are a miracle, its just palin fancy. Like I mentioned before, you're making a corolla look like a Merc, still a corolla underneath .
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-22 17:30:45, aksd wrote:
You really do know how to rile someone up dont you
.
ANyway, regarding the MSM72 series chipset. It seems that when OpenGL tests we conducted on the Diamond it supported only 1.0. Also during gameplay when the touch screen was touched it slowed down the game considerably like on the TyTn II, some people reported that VGA @ 30fps played flawlessly and soem people mentioned dropped frames, I do not have the kbps it was encoded at but they were ususally avi files. Also the low level programmer on xda-dev have mentioned that after analyzing the drivers the implementation of the drivers on the Diamond are similar to that on the LG KS20 which is'nt fully hardware accelerated. There are certain apps used to check hardware acceleration and when used on the diamond still show that the 3D acceleration is mostly software based. Anything more required old chap ?
?How does any of this relate to X1 ? Let me guess, because HTC is the OEM, SE is going to automatically inherit all of HTC's software/driver/design flaws ? Suppose, for a moment, that HTC is indeed only manufacturing the X1 and
is doing everything else.
...None of the today plugins or apps cut it in a iPhone world , the real competition the iPhone will get is from WM7 and Android. Stop thinking that the panels are a miracle, its just palin fancy. Like I mentioned before, you're making a corolla look like a Merc, still a corolla underneath .
, the real competition the iPhone will get is from WM7 and Android. Stop thinking that the panels are a miracle, its just palin fancy. Like I mentioned before, you're making a corolla look like a Merc, still a corolla underneath .I'm actually looking foward to a complete suite of apps from
--not just their Xpanel task launcher. If Xpanels were all were adding to the hardware, then they would be doing only a little better than the Samsung i900 
I'm very intersted in the complete package of the X1...software and hardware. Their entire suite of apps. I'm anxious to see what the new SMS features has added to the latest ROM update (I text alot). BB say's they are new to any WM device.[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 17:06 ]
Posted by aksd
The GPU implementation of the Diamond and the X1 should be identical. Forget about it being a HTC, even the iMate has the MSM7200 processor and there is'nt a proper implememntation, the LG KS20 has another improper implementation, now if none of the manufacturers can properly implement the 3D acceleration then there must be something flawed with the hardware dont you think? THis is not pertaining to video acceleration but 3D and OpenGL.
This is getting tireing, I have explained several times over that the XPanel is like a fancy touchFlo, its got a whole suite of apps, A today screen, RSS Feeds, MediaPlayer, Image Viewer etc.. Now these are assocaited to the XPanel, as far as I've heard from SE source XPanel is fixed you cant add your own apps, its only waht SE provides. At boot up all these XPanel apps are loaded into the RAM, this is why the RAM has been increased. THe 128Mb versions of the X1 did not have these additional apps and even if they did they were not fully functioning , I hope you understand this.
Posted by drsilverworm
I can't remember a source, but I remember hearing that panels will be very easy to develop and openly ready to download. You will be able to have a collection of panels. You will choose 9 panels at any one time to be your activated panels.
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-22 18:16:26, aksd wrote:
The GPU implementation of the Diamond and the X1 should be identical. Forget about it being a HTC, even the iMate has the MSM7200 processor and there is'nt a proper implememntation, the LG KS20 has another improper implementation, now if none of the manufacturers can properly implement the 3D acceleration then there must be something flawed with the hardware dont you think? THis is not pertaining to video acceleration but 3D and OpenGL.
Now that's some good logic right there
We'll have to keep our eye out for the results.
This is getting tireing, I have explained several times over that the XPanel is like a fancy touchFlo, its got a whole suite of apps, A today screen, RSS Feeds, MediaPlayer, Image Viewer etc.. Now these are assocaited to the XPanel, as far as I've heard from SE source XPanel is fixed you cant add your own apps, its only waht SE provides. At boot up all these XPanel apps are loaded into the RAM, this is why the RAM has been increased. THe 128Mb versions of the X1 did not have these additional apps and even if they did they were not fully functioning , I hope you understand this.
That's logical too! Well, more RAM is a good thing by most standards. I think the finalized software and panels provided by
and developers should really make the X1 special. I don't think the panels are a closed system, though.[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 17:43 ]
Posted by p85w
On 2008-06-20 22:37:05, WhyBe wrote:
@Dogmann
You stated yourself that your e90 doesn't play 30fps h.264 VGA. Well, the X1 does. I gave you the link a few posts back on the last page. Here it is again.
Don't fight the feelin!
I'm wondering if it will look bad. My LCD TV have 24-bit (16,777,216 colors) and the transition between colors can look strange in some cases compared to my 32-bit cert screen. So how will then the 16-bit Xperia X1 with 65,536 available colors look? Maby you won't notice it because of the small screen compared to 42" though.
Posted by Dogmann
Hi WhyBe
Well just came across a couple of interesting Video's on YouTube the first shows that perhaps besides the panels it's not quite as finger friendly as you seem to think as the guy seems to have to use the stylus a lot. As the standard WM selection boxes are to small to activate with a finger and need to stylus tip you can check it out here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJuzivsHJks&feature=related
Also you know you keep on saying one touch well it looks like when the panels respond some of them actually need double tapping not a single touch and one of them froze completely as it wouldn't open the app or side scroll through the thumbnails at all. As can be seen here in this video posted just a few days ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Qe_ohf0Re4
Marc
Posted by WhyBe
@dogmann
What, are you searching YouTube for the most negative looking videos
That first one was funny...I don't think the guy knew what he was doing
He also wasn't running any SE apps.
The 2nd video looked kind of nice to me. I'm impressed. I don't know about the touch response. Maybe he didn't touch hard enough or had bad aim?
Perhaps when BengalBoy gets his new unit, he will report on the touch resposiveness.
Posted by Dogmann
@WhyBe
Actually the link to YouTube came from the Web site you linked in the "When will the X1 be for sale in the UK" so i just looked at some of the other video's whilst there.
But as Askd has pointed out the panels are just links to the apps once you are there it is back to WM. Your assumption it is a whole new interface is just not correct it is an overlay to WM it is not replacing it.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-22 21:31 ]
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-22 22:30:28, Dogmann wrote:
@WhyBe
But as Askd has pointed out the panels are just links to the apps once you are there it is back to WM. Your assumption it is a whole new interface is just not correct it is an overlay to WM it is not replacing it.
When did I say any of that???
To clarify, the Xpanels plus SE's own suite of X1 apps (camera, radio, media player, pic browser, and so on...), plus any developers writing apps specifically for the X1 should be sufficient that you would not see proper WM interface with typical daily usage. With WM7 coming, this is a pretty moot point anyways
since it supposedly brings a new UI.
You and aksd are probably so frustrated because you read something totally different than what I am writing
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 22:44 ]
Posted by Dogmann
@WhyBe
Actually i think it's more you don't know what the **** you are talking about most of the time. Believe all you read is positive and deny anything at all that doesn't support what you want to believe. But anyway just another 4-5 months and then we will all no one way or the other. No i really must stop wasting my time with you as it's just pointless and arguing with an idiot only drags me down to your level.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E90,8GB SDHC, Fring, Seven, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2008-06-22 23:42 ]
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-23 00:42:16, Dogmann wrote:
@WhyBe
Actually i think it's more you don't know what the **** you are talking about most of the time. Believe all you read is positive and deny anything at all that doesn't support what you want to believe. But anyway just another 4-5 months and then we will all no one way or the other. No i really must stop wasting my time with you as it's just pointless and arguing with an idiot only drags me down to your level.
You know, they say "common sense ain't all that common"
They also say, "Never argue with an idiot, because they'll always win"
Whose the idiot?...I guess that's all relative
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-22 23:54 ]
Posted by aksd
You know, they say "common sense ain't all that common"
They also say, "Never argue with an idiot, because they'll always win"
Whose the idiot?...I guess that's all relative
I dont think being an idiot is relative, where knowing facts are concerned you're either right or you're wrong
.
See the X1 is using the same WM as any other WM phone, you wont have an app developed specifically for the X1 as then the dev targets an audience much smaller than what he could otherwise thus earning money. Now tell me which dev would spend days working on an app and then restrict its sales, stupid dont you think? Especially when thats his livelyhood. You will just have normal WM apps being developed now with a new display resolution support. Like I said not all the devs will btoher about porting their apps to a WVGA res as maybe the gains will be too little with respect to the effort.
What I find very strange is basically like Marc said most of the time you dont know c*** what you're talking about, but you do talk that c*** with such confidence. I wonder if its just to rile Marc and me up
.
Posted by mario2004
@WhyBe Sorry bud,what you are saying it just doesn't add up
You seem confused. Are you sure it was the 2-nd and not the 1-st of April you joined this forum? if I were you,I would run away and hide bud.
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-23 04:58:26, aksd wrote:
...What I find very strange is basically like Marc said most of the time you dont know c*** what you're talking about, but you do talk that c*** with such confidence. I wonder if its just to rile Marc and me up
.I use the information available about the X1, my tech knowledge and common sense, then draw a logical conclusion. I also smell BS from a mile away. I think what frustrates You, Dogmann and a few others, so much is that your crusade of anti-X1 BS doesn't stand up to my questioning--meaning your premises are very weak to begin with. One way to tell if someone is full of BS is when you question them, they get really defensive and upset...sound like anyone you know?
This is not to say that everything you say is invalid (I've learned a few things from you aksd, you make the most sense), just that some of the more negative stuff from you guys has no validity at all. The so-called release delays, panel bugs, and h.264 codec-ing among other things. It seems as if you guys are hoping for
failure on the X1.
I haven't seen any one of you guys properly quote me and show me I am wrong about something. Unfortunately, you guy's rants are always based on misquotes and misinterpretations. Maybe I should write clearer?
Anyway, let's face it...we're ALL speculating
Posted by aksd
You misunderstand WhyBe,
If I change my TyTn II in the coming months it will most probably be to an X1 or the Pro. But just because I like these two phones from the current crop of WM handsets does not mean they're the best, when somebody asks my opinion I give them the most unbiased opinion I can. We are not here to discuss our feelings but technology, and where technology is concerned there is no place for feelings.
BTW we have prooved you wrong on several occassions, its another matter altoghether if you want to accept it or not.
Now basically like I said, whatever said and done, wheather you want to accept it or not the X1 has shortcomings so does every other phone on the market some fewer than others.
Regarding the release delay, I dont want it delayed either, but certain persons in te industry predict that it is delayed, and until it is proved otherwise I will tend to believe that, looking at the market situation, SE are likely to put the bulk of their manpower behind the C905 that will end up generating them more cash flow in the long run. And methinks if the X1 is delayed it is due to this reason.
Who mentioned any panel bugs? What I've been pushing is that the panel is just a type of facelift, it does'nt change the core, all along, I cant help it if you cant understand a concept that simple. Earlier you thought or made the majority of the members reading your posts think that the X1 is some finger friendly wonder competing with the X1, which is complete BS. You may not have wanted to come across with that idea, but you did.
Regarding the H.264 playback, this we will never know until the final product is launched. Now the TYTn II plays back H.264 with coreplayer only, and a 22fps VGA vid is played back at about 17-18fps which is similar to its quality with divX avi. SO I guess logically playing back H.264 may not be such a big issue with 3rd party MediaPlayers as the X1 will have better implemented video acceleration than the TyTnII
You maybe speculating more than the rest of us, since many of us actually know what going on and not basing opinons on only what we read. A lot of which is Marketing BS. Like I said I've been asking a friend who works at SE who has or had an X1 in posession.
Posted by WhyBe
On 2008-06-23 06:09:42, aksd wrote:
You misunderstand WhyBe,
If I change my TyTn II in the coming months it will most probably be to an X1 or the Pro. But just because I like these two phones from the current crop of WM handsets does not mean they're the best, when somebody asks my opinion I give them the most unbiased opinion I can. We are not here to discuss our feelings but technology, and where technology is concerned there is no place for feelings.
Oh, so you were just acting??? What does it matter to you guys if I think the X1 is the best for the moment? Why does that iritate you so?
BTW we have prooved you wrong on several occassions...
I must've been on vacation...never seen the memos.
Now basically like I said, whatever said and done, wheather you want to accept it or not the X1 has shortcomings so does every other phone on the market some fewer than others.
Of course, but that doesn't stop me from feeling it is the best
Who mentioned any panel bugs? What I've been pushing is that the panel is just a type of facelift, it does'nt change the core, all along, I cant help it if you cant understand a concept that simple. Earlier you thought or made the majority of the members reading your posts think that the X1 is some finger friendly wonder competing with the X1, which is complete BS. You may not have wanted to come across with that idea, but you did.
I assume you meant iPhone. Yes, I do believe any smart manufacturer will design a smartphone product with the iPhone in mind. Hell, even Microsoft is designing WM7 being very mindful of iPhone (that should tell you something). By "like iPhone" I mean intuitive, finger friendly, smart features and a generous helping of eye candy.
From the beginning I've fully understood what the Xpanels are and where WM fits into the whole X1 equation. The
software design does not stop at the panels nor does it change WM...my point all along.
You maybe speculating more than the rest of us, since many of us actually know what going on and not basing opinons on only what we read. A lot of which is Marketing BS. Like I said I've been asking a friend who works at SE who has or had an X1 in posession.
Beep Beep Beep
BS detector going off.....
[ This Message was edited by: WhyBe on 2008-06-23 05:48 ]