Posted by tapojyoti
After 5..or maybe 15 billion years..the sun will expand..be larger in size..and the Mercury and The Venus would be roasted/boiled and the Great Earth which is inhabited by the most variety of species of life,would be the next one.Would the Earth survive..atleast a decade or so..?Our mother Earth had yet survived from being destroyed by a galactic cosmos..but has the Earth already met it?How and why did the species of Dinosaurs become extinct?Would Man be able to survive from fate?How many Big Bangs had already occured and Is there any limit?The ultimate question to add is...Did Animals come here?It can be like this that the species of mankind made a spacecraft with which they stayed at the farthest corner of the Universe and watched the Big Bang and came to the earth in the right time,then killed the dinosaurs to settle themselves?These questions wander around in the human mind(atleast mine)As we come closer to the invention of the Ultimate Universe.We'll discuss all these and related topic's here..coming back to reality..is anyone interested or do they think that we are born healthy&wealthy to die without improving the Knowledge of Mankind?
[ This Message was edited by: tapojyoti on 2008-01-05 18:36 ]
Posted by CookiCrumble
Those are a lot of questions you have there, frankly i don't know where to begin?interesting subject and one to think about for sure.
Posted by fatevdestiny
Waaaaaaaay to much free time on your hands mate
Posted by tapojyoti
[quote]
On 2008-01-02 19:59:29, fatevdestiny wrote:
Waaaaaaaay to much free time on your hands mate...Who Said?I've no more than 1-2 hours to think about this!Too busy with school+homework+studying.But you gotta point there-I do watch National Geographic and History Channel sometimes in my free hours.One thing that's true..NO CLOCK HAS the EXACT CORRECT time!It's either one milisecond or one microsecond fast or slow.And..I think that time is like the shape of the FIRST DISCOVERED and made clock-round.Which means that it had no beginning and possibly has no end.But who is The "Master Of Time"?It's man's dream to overcome the disturbing ease of the time's motion..which yet had not been achieved.(maybe)
Posted by CookiCrumble
[quote]
On 2008-01-02 20:11:00, tapojyoti wrote:
On 2008-01-02 19:59:29, fatevdestiny wrote:
Waaaaaaaay to much free time on your hands mate...Who Said?I've no more than 1-2 hours to think about this!Too busy with school+homework+studying.But you gotta point there-I do watch National Geographic and History Channel sometimes in my free hours.One thing that's true..NO CLOCK HAS the EXACT CORRECT time!It's either one milisecond or one microsecond fast or slow.And..I think that time is like the shape of the FIRST DISCOVERED and made clock-round.Which means that it had no beginning and possibly has no end.But who is The "Master Of Time"?It's man's dream to overcome the disturbing ease of the time's motion..which yet had not been achieved.(maybe)
I do like your way of thinking my friend only if more school kids were intelligent thinkers like you, don't get put off by people who are critical of you, its only because what they cannot achieve often frightens them.
Posted by Kryptik
Some really relevant questions that you've asked, Tapojyoti. I fear that it may ultimately prove to be the case that it won't be an expanding sun that destroys the Earth, but man himself.
Posted by CookiCrumble
What i've never really understood is why is the sun expanding?i've always held the opinion that the sun was burning itself out?
Posted by deluded
A lot of good questions here, but I disagree with the notion that no clock has the exact correct time. Time is a man-made concept, there must be at least one clock that has the correct time. How else would you know if the other clocks are accurate or not?
Posted by Kryptik
if what my good friend Deluded say is true, then a stopped clock must be one of the most accurate timepieces around, since it would show the correct time twice a day
Posted by tapojyoti
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Posted by deluded
@Kryptik bro, that's a good one!
On a more serious note, I think I have to agree that Man will ultimately cause his own extinction, way before any natural calamities can.
Posted by goldenface
@deluded
Our Sun has enough fuel to last another few billion years so I don't think we need to worry about that yet - unless of course we discover the secret of immortality. (Imagine reaching your billionth birthday
)
I am of the opinion that life on earth will continue long after humans have come and gone.
Posted by max_wedge
On 2008-01-03 01:39:25, CookiCrumble wrote:
What i've never really understood is why is the sun expanding?i've always held the opinion that the sun was burning itself out?
before a sun collapses in on it's self due to lack of fuel (burning out as you say), it's expands for several million years as the gas is no longer held so densely packed due to the sun's decreased mass compared to when it was younger. Lower mass, lower gravity, therefore less ability to hold in the remaining gas. Sun's such as ours do this, however some types of Sun's don't expand and instead just collapse without expanding. Yet others go supernova, destroying themselves completely in a dramatic explosion that takes only a only a few weeks to occur.
The giant sun however will be much less dense than the sun is now, and not as hot. Still hot enough however to fry away all earth's oceans as it expands.
By then though, my guess is Earth humans will have colonised planets orbiting other sun's. It seems quite probable to my mind that within several thousand years humans will have invented a viable form of insterstellar travel, and if so we have plenty of time to colonise our local galaxy and will no longer need earth to survive. Our home planet, and home solar system may even be abandoned well before the Sun expands to encompass the earth.
Posted by tapojyoti
@goldenface,It's not of man's immortality..it's about mankind's stay in the earth.@all,all the burnable gases in the sun's atmosphere make helium after combusting.Like when you burn a log and when it's almost completely burnt till it is completely burnt,The flame rises higher and after it's completely burnt,a gush of flame soars up and vanishes...Scientists say that the sun will also expand..but never trust words..
Posted by CookiCrumble
On 2008-01-03 13:55:50, max_wedge wrote:
before a sun collapses in on it's self due to lack of fuel (burning out as you say), it's expands for several million years as the gas is no longer held so densely packed due to the sun's decreased mass compared to when it was younger. Lower mass, lower gravity, therefore less ability to hold in the remaining gas. Sun's such as ours do this, however some types of Sun's don't expand and instead just collapse without expanding. Yet others go supernova, destroying themselves completely in a dramatic explosion that takes only a only a few weeks to occur.
The giant sun however will be much less dense than the sun is now, and not as hot. Still hot enough however to fry away all earth's oceans as it expands.
By then though, my guess is Earth humans will have colonised planets orbiting other sun's. It seems quite probable to my mind that within several thousand years humans will have invented a viable form of insterstellar travel, and if so we have plenty of time to colonise our local galaxy and will no longer need earth to survive. Our home planet, and home solar system may even be abandoned well before the Sun expands to encompass the earth.
makes sense now thanks.
Posted by goldenface
On 2008-01-03 14:10:00, tapojyoti wrote:
@goldenface,It's not of man's immortality..it's about mankind's stay in the earth.@all,
Oh, I believe the Sun will eventually burn out, but like I said, it won't be for hundreds of thousands of years.
Posted by tapojyoti
Ok...we've seen that we simply have to go away after a million years or sooner.Especially since we discovered galactic cosmos..See the first page for more info..So..ultimately a spaceship would be handy.So..what will the ship have to take and what features it'd have to have we'd try to figure out!Oh...if anybody wants to hold his science related question or another topic..you can post here as well!
Posted by max_wedge
I believe that we will eventually be immortal. It's simple really, science will eventually understand what makes us die - and find a way to stop it.
But we may decide we don't want immortality, or that we are happy just to life a very very long time, then choose to die of our own free will when we have satisfied our lust for life.
By then maybe science/religion will have combined and discovered reincarnation to be true, in which case will we need to live "forever" if it means we will never experience another body type? Maybe even if there is no life after, we will learn to change bodies as we change clothes? Maybe we will have cloned bodies ready and waiting for us to "move into" when we are ready to "die". Who knows what is possible.
Once it was believed the earth was flat. Now we know the universe is so large that their are billions upon billions of galaxies each with billions of stars in each. The horizon is always expanding, and so are the possibilities.
Posted by tapojyoti
[quote]
On 2008-01-04 12:31:09, max_wedge wrote:
I believe that we will eventually be immortal. It's simple really, science will eventually understand what makes us die - and find a way to stop it....Whatever..the dark place..is near a corner of the universe...as I said...it is so DARK that light can't go there..I wonder what is BEYOND that DARK thingy.And about that...man would probably create a machine with responsing system which can obey the brain's command.That's very hard to make..plus..it'd work with some electrical power..it'd gotta have a responsing system that'd be able to respond to every command of every micro-metre part of the brain's command.Life would go quite transparent...
Posted by kenoby
Wow, just wow. Arthur C. Clarke was a little baby compared to you guys...
But I admire you guys having such a broad imagination..
Posted by tapojyoti
Imagination={(mind+motion)2}x0+{unknown quantity}..ok..I atlast understood how exactly black holes form.I think it'd happen at the sun too...but I think you already know and understand it..But..I'd again and again recommend you to see the first page.Or it maybe difficult to know the discussions..the sun'l also become a black hole after a brown dwarf..electro-magnetic radiation electro-magnetic gama rays..etc..Man would HAVE to move somewhere(like the close star and the planet which maybe capable of hosting life)..Still..can't post my thoughts directly here because of natural human selfishness..you won't possibly understand..
Posted by kenoby
^^^ Why are you so sensitive? I enjoy your writings, haven't said anything offending..
Posted by *Jojo*
I've watched somewhere that the SUN is like a burning-candle . . . sooner or later it's brightness/hotness will fade out . . . I think I've watched this in: National Geographic Channel . . .
Posted by BobaFett
http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/1997-03/853714295.Ph.r.html
Posted by kenoby
@Boba, quality read.. Thanx..
I wouldn't worry much tho. Cause long before Sun burns out we will suffocate in our trash and sh**t we are making now. Maybe before that mankind will have robotics developed enough to turn themselves and mankind into a Borg variation thatwill drift endlessly thru the ocean called Universe ....
[ This Message was edited by: kenoby on 2008-01-05 03:45 ]
Posted by Adz21
i dont think we need to worry about the sun burning out at all, a more likely threat is ourselves. we will nuke our planet before that happens! And if that doesn't happen we will have another ice age and we will all die anyway, we have had 4 major ice ages in the past and we will have another! Its natures way and we have no control over it! We may not be helping but our earth is warming up because its what it does, its a cycle, it gets really hot then really cold! its inevitable!
Posted by OffLineR
Is this really true? The cycle I mean.
If it really is I believe this time we have another chance to start over with all the technology we have.
Lot's of people will die I know but because of our cutting edge technology rich people will survive(or rich countries I mean
)
Posted by Cycovision
^^^
There's certainly a lot of geological evidence to back up the climate cycle theory so yes, you could say it's true I guess.
Personally I think the greatest threat to us other than war is a meteor strike of catastrophic proportions. After all, it's the most probable explanation for the extinction of the dinosaurs and, were it big enough, there would be no chance of survival no matter how rich you are. ALL life on earth would be wiped out.
Posted by fatreg
ahhh.... "The Theory" ties in nicely with the whole global warming facade and carbon footprint shenanigans.
The world as we know it has been through no less than 5 different cycles, each time wiping out certain things, and this time is no different to the last 5 times, some argue we aren't helping the situation with our CO2 emissions and the like but on the other hand there are some that say, it might be the same without us doing it, I'm from that school of thought, life as we know it, will at some time come under some serious tests and only very adaptive people will survive, I think the whole planet is either a) going to heat up to an unbearable temp or b) cool down to a freezing temp. In both cases, certain types of people will survive, if the planet heats up, I see no reason why Arabs and Aborigines won't survive, but the rest of us will get wiped out slowly, on the flip side if the planet cools down, it's only going to be the inuits that survive.
going back to the original point, yes the sun will burn out one day, it may be tomorrow, it may be in 100 years, it might not be until the year 1,000,001, but if that's the case, we will all have long gone, the human race as we currently know it won't exist. in the grand scheme of things, we humans are mere mortals: dinosaurs, Aztecs, Incas, Romans, Vikings, have all been before us, and others will follow, we will merely be remembered as a dysfunctional mess of a community. but the sun going I feel doesn't spell the end of all life, there are fish deep in the ocean that have never seen the sun and never will, the tides offer no benefit to them. If all other life around them goes, I can only assume they will turn to cannibalism to stay alive, after all, it is survival of the fittest isn't it? and from there the whole evolution process could start again, I just hope that should we humans evolve again that they make a better go of it, males don't need nipples and humans don't need a coccyx, we also lie, cheat, deceive and hate one another....
but hey that's just my thoughts, I don't expect of you to agree with any of them.
after all.. as Mitch Radcliffe once said:
"Computers let you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history, with the possible exception of handguns and tequila"
Posted by Adz21
On 2008-01-05 16:35:02, fatreg wrote:
but the sun going I feel doesn't spell the end of all life, there are fish deep in the ocean that have never seen the sun and never will, the tides offer no benefit to them. If all other life around them goes, I can only assume they will turn to cannibalism to stay alive, after all, it is survival of the fittest isn't it? and from there the whole evolution process could start again,
when the sun burns out there will be NO life on earth at all! Our planet and oceans will freeze, nothing would or will survive!
there are massive threats on our planet that will and are due to cause catastrophic events. There are few super volcanos the biggest under yellowstone park in america that has a regular eruption cycle of 600,000 years and hasn't erupted for 640,000 years so thats due to go bang, and will do 2,500 times more powerful than St Helens! It will affect us worldwide, there will be significant ash deposits over two-thirds of america. The massive amounts of ash, dust, and gases will cause seriously reduced amounts of sunlight to reach the Earths surface for an extended amount of time. There will be massive loss of life, loss of animals and plants and possible extinctions, crops would fail all over the planet, and we would find ourselves living in a mini-Ice Age for at least several years.
Then we have a threat of a mega tsunami which will no doubt hit at some point. The island of La Palma, in the Canary Islands off the coast of North Africa, was discovered to be in great danger of collapsing
It would be far bigger than any wave ever seen for thousands of years. 500 billion tonnes of rock are waiting to collapse into the ocean at terrific speed. The collapse would create nearly 5,000,000,000,000,000 (5 thousand trillion) joules of kinetic energy, which would be converted into a colossal wave 900 metres high with awesome speed - within ten minutes it would have moved 250 kilometres. The landslide would continue to move underwater, powering the wave as it goes.
No coastline in the North Atlantic would be spared. Britain, France, Spain and Portugal would all be badly hit North Africa would be hit by 100 metre waves, but the main wave would travel west. It would storm across the Atlantic in hours, hitting the Caribbean and Brazil badly. However, the real damage would be to the East coast of the USA.
By the time it had travelled the 4000 miles to America the wave would be lower and wider. It would now be just 50 metres high but many kilometres long, allowing it to sweep up to 20 miles in land, destroying everything in its path. Boston, New York and Miami would virtually be wiped off the map. Skyscrapers would be bulldozed as if they weren't there. Bridges would be ripped from their foundations. And virtually every human in these cities would be killed.
our planets great
_________________
I care so much and not at all about every living breath The sadness of this sentience, a sentence to my death.
[ This Message was edited by: Adz21 on 2008-01-05 16:03 ]
Posted by Cycovision
^^^
Yes, I feel much better after reading that
And, just to improve matters, let's not forget the possibility of a catastrophic solar flare. A big dose of solar radiation wouldn't do us a lot of good, if the earth ever happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time...
Posted by tapojyoti
Thanks,bobafett,for the info...so..Global warming can disturbingly wipe out ALL the waterbodies if is getting over 20(currently,it's close to 18 or something..in 2004,it was something like 16) Therefore(happening WITHIN the Solar System)The Sun..hydrogen+combustion of it=helium which increases the space causing the sun to get abit larger..And a satellite of the sun...The Earth..is currently hosting the most intelligent life in the Solar System.But the intelligent species is so destructive,it is harming mother Earth.The intelligent species has to use their intelligence in the green direction,the direction so close to us which is very easy to cross..but we can't see it.Instead we're going through the red way.Sometimes,to go forward,we need to go backwords too...which we are not doing...Later..we need to go OUT of the ss after we've started to solve the riddle here.I mean..what type of machinery can be used instead of another type..some using lower harm rate than others...
Posted by deluded
On 2008-01-03 10:16:10, goldenface wrote:
@deluded
Our Sun has enough fuel to last another few billion years so I don't think we need to worry about that yet - unless of course we discover the secret of immortality. (Imagine reaching your billionth birthday
)
I am of the opinion that life on earth will continue long after humans have come and gone.
@goldenface, I think you may have misinterpreted my post. Here's what I said:
On 2008-01-03 09:58:00, deluded wrote:
On a more serious note, I think I have to agree that Man will ultimately cause his own extinction, way before any natural calamities can.
What you said actually means more or less the same as what I mentioned earlier.
Posted by tapojyoti
A Great link- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxy
Posted by max_wedge
On 2008-01-05 16:35:02, fatreg wrote:
but the sun going I feel doesn't spell the end of all life, there are fish deep in the ocean that have never seen the sun and never will, the tides offer no benefit to them.
when the sun expands into the red giant phase, it will encompass the earth and boil away all water on the planet and and all gases will evaporate into space. There will be no atmosphere and no ocean left. When the sun shrinks back down to a white dwarf, the earth will be left as a barren cold rock with NO life whatsover, not even microbial life.
The only life that will survive this is any life that has left the planet and settled in other solar systems besides our own. This maybe humans, or some decendents of existing life on earth that has become intelligent enough to invent intersteller travel without destroying itself or the planet in the process.
But any life not capable of interstellar travel, that is left on the planet at the time when our oceans and atmosphere are boiled away by the expanding sun, will be doomed. Even burrowing undergrouind would provide little protection, although it would enable life to survive for a few thousands years longer than on the surface, but eventually the entire planet will be heated through and all life will die.
One possibility is intelligent life may be able to move to pluto or a moon of one of the gas giants and live there underground, but with the energy supply of the sun gone heating will be a major issue and any life would rely on heating machines and fuel in the solar system would steadily be depleted. Eventually life will have no option but to settle on planets around distant suns.
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[ This Message was edited by: max_wedge on 2008-01-07 07:18 ]
Posted by tapojyoti
Defeated though I am..I may have to agree to the term that only ONE Big Bang happened and that dark matter will NOT cause the whole universe to break down...Still...coming into the solar system...the Sun may become a Black Hole after a white dwarf...but if it is that the big bang won't repeat itself,then humans have to build a spacecraft along with some kind of oxygen and some kind of co2 producers and lots of nitrogen.It needs a good system..whatsoever so that the gas won't get out when a human does...man needs to make a transporter!As in most alien stories..etc.Scientists believe it's not impossible...same as me..but the true concept-break down all the atoms and before doing so recording their arrangement.If they DO record it..they can scan them and make multiple stuff..!
Posted by max_wedge
our sun won't go blackhole - it doesn't have enough mass.
as to space travel and oxygen nitrofen needs - basically they build a biosphere within a spaceship - so all waste including carbon dioxide get's recycled back into air and food. The whole system can keep recylcing forever and ever.
Posted by tapojyoti
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Posted by max_wedge
true it would be a massive undertaking. But remember this will be in billions of years time. I'm assuming that this would only work if humanity (or whatever intelligent species exists on the earth at that time) has a highly advanced technology.
With an advanced technology, this sort of enterprise would be extremely doable.
Posted by tapojyoti
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Posted by max_wedge
If you notice, I said "assuming", meaning that IF there is intelligent life around at that time. I agree with you , there is no gaurantee that there will be any life on earth in a billion years, let alone intelligent life.
And if there is intelligent life, it's unlikely to be human, since evolution will have replaced us with some other species, which may be related to us like we are to early mammals, or may be a comepletely different species related to insects or reptiles (rise of the dinosaur?)
Posted by tapojyoti
First target(from now) is to make a co2 or cfc converter.Before that,a electric converter and BEFORE that,a evergreen pollution-free electric generator.And...I think an interesting program can be watched in the history channel at 11-30 gmt on www.historychannelindia.com...oh...and I edited the thread's name by editing my first post here.So no confusion needed.Let me work on my current problem...(which is very much related to science)...
Posted by msmmsm
If the cosmos interests you, the original television program from the 80's "Cosmos" by Carl Sagan is coming out on DVD Feb2008. I remember watching this when I was young...fantastic, you can view a few episodes on you tube.
Posted by tapojyoti
@all..sorry but I was unable to post here due to my exams and when I came back to Esato I couldn't find it because it had gone such a way down.. But found it atlast through google's search..
@fatreg,when the sun gets bigger ,it's surface will get closer and closer to the earth in spite of the heat that the earth gets when it's 150000 miles away from the sun's surface,imagine what the heat will be when it's 50000miles.More or less at that time the poles will reach the boiling point and evaporate...leaving the earth like a burnt cookie in a barren desert..after the sun gets to be a dwarf,the earth would just experience the life of a cookie in a barren desert at night.Though there's a thing..that as the sun is getting bigger,gravity is getting lower because of the continuous was between the expanding material and the gravity..so there's a chance that earth will get away from it's burning gleam..but another thing..our galaxy,the milky way,is charging towards our nearest neighbour the andromeda galaxy..and that also at more than 70miles per second..scientists predict that our galaxy and andromeda will collide more or less 3billion years later..successfully,our sun won't be eaten by the supermassive black holes..but will be one of it's tidal tails and let as have a grandstand view of the hole process with even our naked eye..that is..if we come to be their at that time...
Posted by KingBooker5
I don't know why every one is scared, with the way the human race is going, I doubt we will be around in even 50 years
If that 2012 thing is not true though lol
Posted by tapojyoti
Yeah..@above..Well..I won't be sure that after just 50 years we will be able to get the required knowledge for being immortal..and that skull of fire of Nostradamus is strange..if he knew that people were going to find then he knew we'd be able to do nothing or he may have known that we'd find the book he joked about?Or maybe it's not his at all?Why will Nostradamus write it?Maybe a note to global warming as I've already known that there are some other indications about fire and blah blah blah on that year..An old game (there is a sound circle of rock in which there is a hole..it's kinda like basketball but the basket{the rock with the hole}stands with the upper position to the left and lower to the right)The target of the players were to throw some kind of ball through the "basket"..but strangely,the only one who was able to throw the ball through the basket was killed..now it may be understood that it was taken that the "ball"was the earth and the basket was the center of the galaxy..which means,that in the year 2012,the earth may move there..sends chills down my spine..in the heart of our galaxy the milky way,there is a supermassive black hole..hope this won't happen but if it does,then earth with all it's contents would be compressed and then let out as dark dense plasma.But maybe all these folks were trying to scare or confuse us?..the question continues..
Posted by tapojyoti
Ok..lets rewind back some thousand million years..and goto earth's second nearest planet.. Life on mars is a kind of..mystery..because of it's heavy iron contents,even if it does hold water,the water would be too salty and contain battery acids and are liable not to help terrestrial life(life that can survive with the same living requirements we require)to survive.But maybe it'll we able to host extra-terrestrial life..Here,jupiter is big and the mystery is about the same as the mass..heavy storms and ...but it's moon Europa,on the other hand is cris-crossed with brown lakes which may contain water..which may again give curiousity a chance to welcome it's existence..then there's saturn..same story as jupiter..but Enceladus,a satellite of it's is currently being claimed as a hoster of water which arise from the lakes which might form from the cause of friction.Besides that there are other moons of saturn which may contain water.
Moon does not mean just our nearest satellite..it means all the satellites which revolve around any planet.By the way..the name of our moon is Luna
Posted by tapojyoti
Cookicrumble,deluded,goldenface,max,where are you all?All the people here aren't even interested in what will happen to their own species.huh.
Posted by tapojyoti
You're afraid of the truth.
Posted by goldenface
What is the truth and how can you be so sure that IT IS the truth?