Posted by Dogmann
Hi all,
Today at the Symbian Smart Phone Show Nokia have announced the next step for S60 with a Touch interface that can be used with fingers or stylus and also will have Haptics which gives tactile feedback. They also announced that they will be enabling their devices with Flash Lite 3 enabling rich web video on S60 which will allow access to Media rich web sites which so far has not been possible .
Here is a link to a short Video showing some concept devices and the things the S60 Touch UI will bring.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3uPxep2OIk
My personal feeling although i am no longer personally a great fan of Touch Screen interfaces is Apple and the other manufacturers that use Touchscreens will have some serious competition coming soon. Especially as the Haptics tactile feedback is going to move touchscreen to another new level of user experience IMO.
As these devices will be running an already well established OS they will be feature rich and of course should come with what we are used to both 3G and HSDPA hopefully with 7.2mbps support .
I am not sure if the wealth of apps available will all transfer easily or if apps may require some work to allow for the change of input methods. But i would imagine if they need conversion this will be done quite quickly to take advantage of these new devices.
The only thing to wait for now is the announcement of actual devices and when they will reach the market. But it does look like those that want a touch screen will have another range of devices to choose from soon, which IMO can only be a good thing for consumers and drive even greater competition and advancements in the devices we are offered.
Oh yes and the interface and devices do look very similar to the iPhone but then lets face it this is only so much that can be done with a large Touch Screen device and until we see the full specs we won't really know what else these devices may have. Nokia did say they didn't see anything wrong with copying a great idea, but obviously from the video clip these devices may not suit all as i didn't see any qwerty as an alternative input method so both TYTN users and UIQ with qwerty users may not find a device that suits there needs.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-16 12:54 ]
Posted by masseur
press release
S60 smartphone software evolves to enrich the user experience
October 16, 2007
Expanding the platform with intuitive touch user interface, sensor technologies and complete web video experience
Symbian Smartphone Show, London, UK - As Internet is entering into the core of mobile experiences, Nokia continues to implement new innovations for S60 on Symbian OS(TM), the market leading smartphone software, to develop the best possible mobile experiences for people.
S60 will introduce new features that enhance the user experience and enable manufacturers, developers and operators to design new types of mobile devices, applications and services.
The touch user interface in S60 smartphone software offers licensees the opportunity to develop devices with a variety of input methods, whether it is a touch screen with a traditional keypad, touch screen with a qwerty keyboard or touch screen alone, supporting both finger or stylus optimized input, in addition to the range of access options that already exist today.
S60 touch user interface comes with support for tactile feedback, which means that there is a physical pulse and feedback when the user taps on the screen. This provides better awareness of the device's response improving the user experience.
Existing S60 3rd Edition applications will run on touch enabled devices unmodified. Tools will be made available for developers to further optimize the touch experience of their applications.
From motion and orientation to proximity and light, sensor technology is expanding to new areas and shaping the future for mobiles. S60 brings sensor support to the platform as a generic solution enabling support for a range of sensors in S60 devices. These technologies open up a new kinetic world to the user and offer completely new opportunities for application and game developers.
Also, the new UI Accelerator toolkit will allow device manufacturers to develop rapidly and easily impressive graphical effects and new types of interactions, further increasing the user appeal and excitement.
S60 will be the first mobile software platform to deliver the complete Web video experience as Flash Video will be integrated with the Web Browser for S60. This allows people to view on the go Flash-enabled Web sites and Flash Video, such as YouTube, as they would do on their desktops.
S60 and 3, the mobile media company that launched the first 3G network in the UK, will demonstrate at the Symbian Smartphone Show in London X-Series devices based on S60, and the vision both share of creating great Internet experiences on mobile devices.
"We are constantly on the lookout for new innovations to enhance X-Series, our offering for Internet on the mobile", said Ken Johnstone, Director of Products, Global 3G Handset & Application Group, at 3. "The user experience is central to everything that we do, and we believe that X-Series provides the best-in-class Internet experience on the mobile."
"S60 on Symbian OS offers a great platform to innovate with Internet services", said Matti Vänskä, Vice President, Mobile Software Sales and Marketing, Nokia. "We see experiences converging, and people demanding more and more of the functionalities that smartphones offer, both of which highlight the significance of ease of use. The focus of our strategy is to give people choice and simplicity - both key to delivering the best user experiences to add value to people's lives."
These technologies will be available for all S60 device manufacturers during 2008.
Posted by Dogmann
Hi Masseur,
Great additional information and has already answered some of the questions i had, looks like 2008 should be an exciting Year. I wonder if from the above this means 3 may have some of these devices as exclusives to start with as they have done with both Skype and Slingbox may be time to check out 3's deals and packages next Year.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-16 13:04 ]
Posted by Staska
Here's another video from today's Symbian Smartphone show presentation and also a video of presentation by Nokia's senior VP, describing touch UI in detail:
http://www.unwiredview.com/20[....]get-touch-interface-next-year/
Posted by Dogmann
Hi Staska
Nice find and that makes the whole Touch UI concept far more interesting, i don't know about anyone else but I'm glad i didn't get a iPhone after all. Still not sure i want to go back to a touchscreen or not but this may sway me.
I would also say it is impossible for all of this to have been done just since the announcement and launch of the iPhone, Nokia must of been developing this for quite some time can anyone remember when they bought the Haptics Tactile feedback license?
It certainly shows Apple aren't five years ahead of the field and if this launches Q1/Q2 2008 which it looks like they were not even a year ahead.
IMO this will really start to push innovation and competition between manufacturers which will drive delivery of even better devices for us the consumers. SE really needs to get a move on with it's P3 and it really needs to be something that delivers in all aspects and be special or there market is going to evaporate.
It may of taken Nokia a while to fully embrace Touch Screen devices but from what i have seen so far this added to OVI it seems they really are changing the game and expanding the boundaries. As the VP said they will be the first to include Flash Lite 3.0 something i have seen asked for on many forums for many devices and it looks like Nokia have got the jump on everyone else.
I must admit the fact that current S60 apps will run on this new UI means it will be a seamless transfer for any of us that decide to go touch screen nothing new to learn except for all the new additional features next year looks like it's going to be exciting. The only thing really left to see is if they will have the new OMAP 3 Chip and 7.2mbps HSDPA or not. But even if they only have the OMAP2420 and 3.6mbps HSDPA they will still be powerful enough and more powerful than most devices already announced or available.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-16 15:42 ]
Posted by Boinng
It's probably just me, but I think this leaves Nokia looking pretty weak. They've ignored the touchscreen market for years, while the likes of SE and all the Windows Mobile crowd have plugged away at it, but now Apple have swanned in with MultiTouch, Nokia have all of a sudden discovered "Touch", an amazing new way of controlling your phone through a "touch screen"... amazing! Not.
Any pretence that this isn't a knee-jerk reaction to the iphone is rather undone by the fact that the demo phone in their video looks like a cheap Chinese copy of the iphone...
I'm rather hoping they trip up on this one. If they can't come up with original approach to touchscreen interfaces, then they should carry on ignoring them.
Posted by C905
i´ve never like series60, but now the platform is far more interesting
good job nokia
Posted by batesie
S60 3rd edition is the first UI thats impressed me from nokia. add touchscreen and it makes it complete!
Posted by C905
On 2007-10-16 17:28:09, batesie wrote:
S60 3rd edition is the first UI thats impressed me from nokia. add touchscreen and it makes it complete!
you are absolutely right
Posted by Dogmann
@Boinng
You really think that Nokia have done all of this just since the announcement and launch of the iPhone and as knee jerk reaction you must be mad. As if so that would mean they have the most amazeing R&D in the world to be able to work in that sort of time frame it's virtually impossible to be done how ever much money you threw at it. If you love or hate Nokia you have to admire them for constantly bringing new innovations to market and i seriously doubt these devices will fail.
It surely proves Apple where not 5 years ahead of everyone else in fact it is Nokia that are ahead with the tactile feed back, Flash LITE 3.0 and all the existing S60 apps that will work on it from day one. You really think this makes Nokia weak personally i think it makes the other manufacturers extremely vulnerable as Nokia are not just releasing a iPhone style device but many devices including one with full qwerty. All on a well established platform with tons of both free and paid for apps and you can be sure it will be at least 3G, HSDPA, WiFi G and all the other things Nokia devices bring including fast new processors and graphics to make the most of these devices.
If any one is now weak and threatened it is SE as now Nokia will have a Symbian touch screen device to compete directly with them and if these devices launch before the P3 and the P3 is lacking in spec it will be game over for SE and their already small market share will be gone.
SE really need now more than ever to release the P3 fast and a stable well specified device as well. Personally i hope they do as they virtually invented the concept but don't kid your self if they don't that will be the end of their smart phones.
There is just to much competition out there right now even you have gone for a TYTN over a P1. You are not alone many others have also already either moved to WM6 or S60. Realistically they have one last shot to retake the high ground and win their users back and they better make it a good one.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-16 16:35 ]
Posted by bluechips
nokia is boring behind touchscreen technology, of course it has the money and technology is already everywhere, i am just puzzled how it cant release a decent touchscreen long ago if it has the edge.
Posted by Boinng
On 2007-10-16 17:35:17, Dogmann wrote:
@Boinng
You really think that Nokia have done all of this just since the announcement and launch of the iPhone and as knee jerk reaction you must be mad. As if so that would mean they have the most amazeing R&D in the world to be able to work in that sort of time frame it's virtually impossible to be done how ever much money you threw at it.
If you threw enough money at it, and had an obvious model to copy and compete with, and already had the base OS in place, of course you could do it. Nokia aren't short of resources, the whole world has known all about the Iphone interface since January, and in 9 months Nokia have developed a touchscreen interface for their already mature OS to compete with it - not exactly putting a man on the moon, is it?
If you love or hate Nokia you have to admire them for constantly bringing new innovations to market and i seriously doubt these devices will fail
Surely you can hear how ridiculous that sounds, in this context? New innovations?! An interface that couldn't be more like Multitouch if they tried (and they have), coupled with Haptics that the Razr2 has had for months - thank you Nokia! How would we manage without them?
It surely proves Apple where not 5 years ahead of everyone else
They never were, but anyone with any knowledge of smartphones already knew that, didn't they? The only people saying Apple were 5 years ahead, were the same people that thought the internet on your phone was a really neat new idea...
in fact it is Nokia that are ahead with the tactile feed back, Flash LITE 3.0 and all the existing S60 apps that will work on it from day one.
No, it's Nokia who are playing catch-up, and not just with Apple either. Honestly, a few months ago you'd have sworn blind that touchscreens were unnecessary and for a limited market, but now they're not just great, but Nokia invented them! Forget about it. Touchscreens aren't new, they aren't any more useful than they always were, and haptics aren't a new innovation either. Flash Lite 3? Well that's nice, but are we really suggesting that every other manufacturer isn't about to add that too, it being the natural successor to well, Flash Lite 2? And shouldn't we be directing the praise for that at Adobe, who created it, rather than Nokia?
As for all the S60 apps working from day one, well I'm sure they will, but I'm equally sure they won't respond to "touch" until they're recompiled for the touch interface. Because Nokia aren't that prescient - until somebody saw the iphone, there was no touch in S60.
You really think this makes Nokia weak personally i think it makes the other manufacturers extremely vulnerable as Nokia are not just releasing a iPhone style device but many devices including one with full qwerty. All on a well established platform with tons of both free and paid for apps and you can be sure it will be at least 3G, HSDPA, WiFi G and all the other things Nokia devices bring including fast new processors and graphics to make the most of these devices.
If any one is now weak and threatened it is SE as now Nokia will have a Symbian touch screen device to compete directly with them and if these devices launch before the P3 and the P3 is lacking in spec it will be game over for SE and their already small market share will be gone.
If any one is now weak and threatened it is SE as now Nokia will have a Symbian touch screen device to compete directly with them and if these devices launch before the P3 and the P3 is lacking in spec it will be game over for SE and their already small market share will be gone.
I think it makes them weak in spirit, and weak in moral fibre. You're probably right, S60 "touch" will be much stronger competition for UIQ as it now has one of the main selling points of UIQ covered, and people will ask (a) why do we need two different Symbian touchscreen UI's, and (b) why should I go for UIQ when the whole world already uses S60. And to be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't destroy UIQ - because we all know UIQ3 hasn't gone down well generally, and the P3i will have an uphill struggle selling UIQ4, or whatever comes next. And maybe SE will end up writing off the half of UIQ they still own, and go over to WM - perhaps, considering the deal they reportedly did with HTC recently, that's already underway.
The thing is, I think that's all extremely bad news for Symbian, and for S60, and for Nokia. Because ultimately, by destroying one segment of the Symbian market in pursuit of creating a cheap copy of the Iphone, they'll just end up making themselves and their choice of OS seem shabby and second rate in the process. In a pincer movement between Apple and the next major version of WM, are they still going to look so innovative even in your eyes? I doubt it.
There is just to much competition out there right now even you have gone for a TYTN over a P1.
Very true, because for me it was time for a change - but don't kid yourself into thinking I'd ever have considered a S60, touch enabled or otherwise.
Posted by bluechips
i'll never consider having a franchise to be nokia touch interface smartphone in the near future... i hope it wont bring chaos to s60.
Posted by QVGA
Its nothing new, whichever way Nokia puts it. But i'm glad touchscreen will be a part of nokia's phones.
Posted by gola
i think this is fantastic,it broadens the variety of choices...
Posted by londonlad123
Im gonna agree with qvga on this one. Also, I disagree that nokia are the ones that are gonna make the other manufactures take TS seriously. Apple already did that and then took it to another level.
Posted by bart
instead of joining UIQ once again nokia has decided to go solo.
well let them, lets hope the competition is strong enough for people to think twice and make a better choice.
Posted by Dogmann
@Bart
What possible reason would Nokia have to join UIQ with all it's problems especially when they have a far better choice that they already know and that requires very little if any modification for a Touch UI.
@Boinng
Where in any of my posts have i said i intend to go back to using a touchscreen in one of the other threads i have said it may be the one thing that does. But then i have said the same about UIQ and the P3 if it delivers, unlike you i would never say i won't ever use an OS just because of who makes it as that limits my options for no good reason other than what you hate Nokia your loss no one else's as in my experience S60 really is a great UI well i like it anyway.
Firstly maybe it has escaped your attention but Nokia are launching device's not just one, one of which will have a full qwerty so which Apple phone has that copied then?
Secondly Moto's' haptic is on 3 music control keys only not the whole touch screen so no it's hardly the same thing and who else has this on the whole touchscreen anyone?
I have already answered point three as to your incorrect assumption that i am converted to using a touch screen again or how brilliant they are either. As to Flash Lite 3.0 of course Adobe created it it's there app. But whilst all over the forums people want this Nokia are delivering yet again first and where did i ever suggest no one else will add it in the future all i pointed out was that Nokia will be first to market with it.
As for this quote
"As for all the S60 apps working from day one, well I'm sure they will, but I'm equally sure they won't respond to "touch" until they're recompiled for the touch interface. Because Nokia aren't that prescient - until somebody saw the iphone, there was no touch in S60."
Really like to let us into the secret of how you know this as i tend to have more belief in a Nokia VP's information than yours, after all this is a Nokia statement not SE.
You think this makes Nokia
" I think it makes them weak in spirit, and weak in moral fibre."
How and why? as far as i am concerned ever since the launch of UIQ3 this is the only position SE is the best at with out competition.
Your last point is just so wrong Nokia have more than just decided to change to a touch screens because of Apple what ever you may think it goes along with their belief of a changing Internet and Media experience and fits in with OVI user experience. This is the difference Nokia doesn't remain stuck it changes to adapt to the ever changing market and continues to improve the user experience by constantly bringing the latest tech to us all.
Marc
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Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-16 20:12 ]
Posted by Mr Miyagi
lol @ the doggman and Boinng debate. Boinng if i was you, i would give up on your debate. doggman does know his stuff.
Posted by londonlad123
Dont forget, the lg viewty has haptic feedback throughout the UI (not that one button with haptic feedback isnt haptic feedback, it is) and samsungs armani has too - its nothing new, maybe recent.
Posted by rockerZ
I can't wait too see the new TouchScreen sets that are gonna be released by Nokia
Though it's not gonna be anything much special , but its something new by Nokia , and it might turn out to be very good
Posted by BobaFett
now that will be interesting. i am not a touchscreen fan, but maybe it has to do sg with se uiq, what is terrible imo, but since i love nokia symbian os, maybe it will make me to like it
Posted by jortiz1200
this is great news. one of the main reasons i just cant buy a nokia phone,was for the lack of touchscreen(even though their hardware is a bit superior) i just cant imagine not having it...and the fact that flash will be supported is a huge plus. n800 has spoiled me with that(flash 9 and opera,oh yeah native skype to).2008 looks like it will bring good things.i only hope se can bring it with the p3...and soon!
Posted by Symbiangeeza
I agree with Doggmann, and completely disagree with Boing.I just hope Nokia don't make an absolute arse about face job of their new generation touchscreen phones as they evidently did with the terrible and flawed 7710
This message was posted from a WAP device
Posted by BobaFett
... or with 6708
Posted by razec
On 2007-10-16 21:58:32, Mr Miyagi wrote:
lol @ the doggman and Boinng debate. Boinng if i was you, i would give up on your debate. doggman does know his stuff.
Boinng is a good debater too, and he's got wide knowledge either. the only thing i always found deliberately repeated about dogmann's comments was that the famous sentence that begins with this phrase "Where in any of my posts have i said that..."
On 2007-10-17 00:33:24, BobaFett wrote:
... or with 6708
6708 is just a rebranded benq-p31. they did not manufacture the phone but they have just put that nokia logo on that bricked phone
[ This Message was edited by: razec on 2007-10-17 00:12 ]
Posted by Prom1
I TOLD YOU ALL that the UIQ lone smartphone was a just "feeler" testbed from Nokia as they've been out of practice and still working with intergrating things from S90 into S60. LONG overdue by their promise 2yrs ago now!
Haptics ... wondering if a pantent issue will arise as the Samsung Giorgio Armani has that "Vibration" feedback coming from touch (finger) input.
I'd ALSO like to see that Handwriting recognition that the S90 7710 had - simply superb.
Honestly I don't like touchscreen for my personal uses ... and LOATHE iPhone like touch ONLY devices. However I just got to see that Samsung Giogio model and it looks sleek, very small, svelte and promising. They where smart to include dedicated answer hangup buttons.
we'll see what the future brings. i'm still prefering UIQ3 Smartphone for a K850i like design.
Posted by Dogmann
@razec
Well if you could kindly stop people from making out i say things i clearly never have said, it would be my pleasure and a great relief to never have to start a sentence with what now appears to have become my catch phrase.
Trust me it annoys me a lot more than you that some are happy to make the most absurd statements about what either i have said or the fact i hate SE as well as numerous other things and not once on being challenged has anyone ever come back with a quote to prove otherwise and yes it really does annoy me and maybe that's why they do it.
@Prom1
Maybe i didn't post it clearly but i was actually asking a question as to if anyone knew of any devices that used it as i didn't. Although i am aware of the LG and Motorola versions of Haptics i don't believe it is the same.
But i do remember the announcement quite sometime ago when Nokia purchased a license for the particular technology they are using. As i am pretty sure there is more than just one type of Haptics feedback for instance the Moto version causes the whole device to vibrate and my understanding of the version Nokia is going to use is it gives actual tactile feedback just from the single on screen key as it is pressed, which IMO is certainly not the same thing at all as the the whole whole phone vibrating. To be honest if using a virtual keyboard and every key press resulted in the whole phone vibrating that would make a horrible user experience as well as killing the battery of course, I don't know about the other devices mentioned do they work the same was as on the Motorola or not?
So i seriously doubt anyone will be able to sue Nokia as they are a legitimate user and License holder of the system they are using.
Marc
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-17 02:09 ]
Posted by Boinng
On 2007-10-16 21:11:23, Dogmann wrote:
Where in any of my posts have i said i intend to go back to using a touchscreen
LOL - where in any of my posts have I suggested that you will?! I've only commented on the fact that you've gone from a position of almost complete negativity towards touchscreen devices, to unbridled enthusiasm for Nokia's attempt at the same. The bias is a little transparent, if you don't mind me saying.
in one of the other threads i have said it may be the one thing that does. But then i have said the same about UIQ and the P3 if it delivers, unlike you i would never say i won't ever use an OS just because of who makes it as that limits my options for no good reason other than what you hate Nokia your loss no one else's as in my experience S60 really is a great UI well i like it anyway.
For me, it was a lousy interface up till now because it had no touchscreen support (a point you repeatedly refuted up till now, because in your view touchscreens weren't necessary, nobody wanted them, etc etc - don't go asking "where in my posts did I ever..." again because I'll find them). Now, it's apparently going to ape the iphone. Well, I place a value on genuine innovation, so if wanted an interface like that I'd buy an iphone, not an imitator.
Firstly maybe it has escaped your attention but Nokia are launching device's not just one, one of which will have a full qwerty so which Apple phone has that copied then?
That would be the iphone, whose interface it has stolen. You can't just bolt on a qwerty and pretend it's not still derivative.
Secondly Moto's' haptic is on 3 music control keys only not the whole touch screen so no it's hardly the same thing and who else has this on the whole touchscreen anyone?
A couple of others going by other posts, not that I feel that's important - haptics are haptics, they've been done before and they're not a Nokia innovation, as you were attempting to suggest.
I have already answered point three as to your incorrect assumption that i am converted to using a touch screen again
That would be the assumption I never made, then...
or how brilliant they are either. As to Flash Lite 3.0 of course Adobe created it it's there app. But whilst all over the forums people want this Nokia are delivering yet again first and where did i ever suggest no one else will add it in the future all i pointed out was that Nokia will be first to market with it.
They're the first to announce it, that doesn't necessarily mean that they'll be first to market. I just don't see why you're making such a big thing about something that was (a) developed completely independently by another company, and (b) can and will be implemented by every other phone manufacturer on the planet.
As for this quote
"As for all the S60 apps working from day one, well I'm sure they will, but I'm equally sure they won't respond to "touch" until they're recompiled for the touch interface. Because Nokia aren't that prescient - until somebody saw the iphone, there was no touch in S60."
Really like to let us into the secret of how you know this as i tend to have more belief in a Nokia VP's information than yours, after all this is a Nokia statement not SE.
"As for all the S60 apps working from day one, well I'm sure they will, but I'm equally sure they won't respond to "touch" until they're recompiled for the touch interface. Because Nokia aren't that prescient - until somebody saw the iphone, there was no touch in S60."
Really like to let us into the secret of how you know this as i tend to have more belief in a Nokia VP's information than yours, after all this is a Nokia statement not SE.
So find me the Nokia statement that confirms these existing applications will be "touchable" from day one? All I can see is confirmation that they'll "work" (as in, run), and that "tools will be made available for developers to further optimize the touch experience of their applications" - which sounds like re-compiling to enable the touch features to me.
You think this makes Nokia
" I think it makes them weak in spirit, and weak in moral fibre."
How and why?
" I think it makes them weak in spirit, and weak in moral fibre."
How and why?
I've said how and why - they're jumping on a bandwagon in order to play catch up with a major new player on the scene, and they're doing it at the expense of the delicate Symbian eco-system. It's a careless land-grab at UIQ's share of the market, a market they steadfastly refused to recognise until the Iphone hit the scene, and I believe it will ultimately backfire on them.
Your last point is just so wrong Nokia have more than just decided to change to a touch screens because of Apple what ever you may think it goes along with their belief of a changing Internet and Media experience and fits in with OVI user experience. This is the difference Nokia doesn't remain stuck it changes to adapt to the ever changing market and continues to improve the user experience by constantly bringing the latest tech to us all.
Balls. The idea that it's just a coincidence they've come out with "touch" in the same year as the iphone, after several years of complete disregard for the touchscreen market, is just fantasism of the highest order.
Posted by bbasra
= N95 with touchscreen. Nice
Posted by londonlad123
On 2007-10-17 03:03:30, Dogmann wrote:
As i am pretty sure there is more than just one type of Haptics feedback for instance the Moto version causes the whole device to vibrate and my understanding of the version Nokia is going to use is it gives actual tactile feedback just from the single on screen key as it is pressed, which IMO is certainly not the same thing at all as the the whole whole phone vibrating.
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[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-17 02:09 ]
Are you sure you know what you're talking about, that nokias haptic feedback is going to give feedback at the point of touch on the screen and nowhere else on the phone? Tell us more, that is something big. How does it work?
Posted by Dogmann
@Boinng
Actually i do mind as firstly i have never held a completely negative attitude about touch screens especially as i have used them for so long with Ipaq and UIQ.
My position is and hasn't changed which is that Touch screens are not the be and end all for everyone, only if the user wants or feels he needs it, is it important. Which is not even close to what you are suggesting is my position is it?.
As for my unbridled enthusiasm and my bias is a little transparent i really don't see where you get this idea from as i haven't even said i am going back to using one. All i have done is reported what is happening and for those that want a touch screen this could be exciting for them which is no where near yet again to what you are trying to claim is it?
Your next points again are totally incorrect as you claim i have said
"because in your view touchscreens weren't necessary, nobody wanted them, etc etc "
Really again you are happy to tell me what i think and say but conveniently say you won't find where i have said it. Good choice because how ever hard you search you won't be able to attribute me saying the things you think i have said as i haven't.
A little bit of advice if you are going to challenge my opinions and what i say when attempting this how about trying to make sure these are things i have actually said not what you think or want me to have said.
As to be quite honest this constant you telling me my opinion is this or i am that or the other when you can't back any of it up just makes me keep on my making you look quite foolish and as though you have a problem with me and a vendetta to discredit my post's.
It also is not going to ape the iPhone it will be very different as there will be more than just one form factor to start with and it's OS and number of apps available make it a very different device indeed IMO. But lets be honest and sensible here if you are going to have a touch screen device with a large screen covering the whole of one side their really isn't much variation possible is their especially if it doesn't have any buttons or keys.
Again where i have suggested Nokia invented Haptics as i clearly mentioned they bought a license why would they buy a license from another company if i said they invented it so yet another wrong quote from you yet again.
On Flash Lite 3.0 i only reported what was said i never claimed Nokia invented this either and again the VP said S60 will be first to market with it so obviously they must of made a deal with Adobe to be able to say this. If not please direct me to any other manufacturer that has yet announced they will have Flash Lite 3.0 on any of their upcoming devices, go one just one will do if you can if not then yes this is a big deal.
As to previous S60 apps working go watch the numerous You Tube Video's of the event for your answer as what it may sound like to you doesn't make it correct just because that is what you think it will mean.
Now this statement really really is funny
"I've said how and why - they're jumping on a bandwagon in order to play catch up with a major new player on the scene, and they're doing it at the expense of the delicate Symbian eco-system. It's a careless land-grab at UIQ's share of the market, a market they steadfastly refused to recognise until the Iphone hit the scene, and I believe it will ultimately backfire on them."
What are you on seriously jumping on the band wagon you really think they decided just 9 months ago lets copy Apple that's just ridiculous. Firstly when the announced OVI they said they saw a new future for Internet and Media and obviously this now fits into it. As both touch screen technology, processors, graphics and Data speeds have all got more powerful and faster which means now they can deliver a good enough experience.
As for
"and they're doing it at the expense of the delicate Symbian eco-system. It's a careless land-grab at UIQ's share of the market"
Really i thought they were in business to succeed and make profits as are all business's, if UIQ is having problems that is for them to resolve and quite simply not Nokia's fault or problem. I suppose you think they shouldn't dare compete with poor little UIQ and poor little SE just truly unbelievable you can even say anything quite so ridiculous.
As for your closing comment
"Balls. The idea that it's just a coincidence they've come out with "touch" in the same year as the iphone, after several years of complete disregard for the touchscreen market, is just fantasism of the highest order."
I'm pretty sure if this had been a UIQ and SE development you would of claimed it was absolutely brilliant and innovative, talk about fanaticism of the highest order this just shows just how much of a hypocrite you really are it also looks like you are the one devoid of any moral fibre not Nokia or me.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-17 22:46 ]
Posted by Dogmann
@londonlad123
The reason i say this is because i read it somewhere when i come across it again i will be happy to link it. But can you imagine if the whole device vibrates on every entry of a single letter that what make for a horrible user experience in my opinion and would explain so far why it has not been seen on the whole OS but just for certain functions.
If you can find out who supplies the License for the Haptics on the Motorola and other devices we can see if this is the same company as Nokia have a license from. I will try and find the company who Nokia have licensed it from and see if there is an any additional information on their web site.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-17 22:51 ]
Posted by Dogmann
@londonlad123
Here you go found the name of the company that Nokia have the License from and here are some more details of what they offer currently, i believe what Nokia have licensed is the next progression to what is found currently on the Web site.
Tactile Feedback for Mobile Handset Touchscreens
2007 marks the breakout year for touchscreen technology in mobile phones, as numerous high-profile product introductions have featured the use of a touchscreen to replace mechanical keys as the primary user input mechanism.
Now, with the VibeTonz System, mobile phone manufacturers have an inexpensive, robust way to radically improve usability of their touchscreen-based models. This embedded technology provides an unmistakable tactile confirmation to the user that their finger or stylus press on the touchscreen was accepted as input.
Here is a link to their Web site for further information
http://www.immersion.com/mobility/technology/
Marc
_________________
Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-17 23:13 ]
Posted by londonlad123
I cant find anywhere that vibetonz gives feedback on the point of touch like youve said. LG also use vibetonz. Its the point of touch part thats shocking, otherwise its normal haptic feedback.
Posted by Dogmann
@londonlad123
Well until i come across again where i read it was point of touch i can't really say much else. Maybe what i read is incorrect and has been removed but i will still reserve judgement until i see a working device. As if the whole thing device vibrates whilst typing for instance IMO that would be horrible and not such great a feature after all IMO.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-17 23:58 ]
Posted by C905
so, are there any rumours of the first phone with touchscreen?
indeed, it will be a flagship product but will it be a n-series or e-series device?
Posted by xnuo
@everyone: guys, don't forget about symbian OS 9.3's new demand paging technology... faster load times, less memory footprint...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?[....]nstrating_Demand_Paging_in.php
Posted by Dogmann
@k850 successor
No mention so far if it will be a N series or E series but i am guessing it may be an N series first as that has a larger market and the emphasis so far has been on Internet and Media.
But we may be lucky and see more than one device launched maybe one from each series which wold be nice. Having said that maybe a whole new series will be created it could be the T series and do both especially as i can't really see the need for a full qwerty on an N series device and we have been told one of the device's will have this.
Marc
_________________
Nokia E61, 2gb Sandisk, Fring, Tom Tom 6
Honoured to have won BEST DEBATER
[ This Message was edited by: Dogmann on 2007-10-18 14:42 ]
Posted by BobaFett
here is a new video
http://mobilarena.hu/hir/noki[....]s_60_touch_video_bemutato.html