Posted by paul5678
Aside from having and running a lot of third party software, what other advantages that a smartphone OS (Symbian, Windows, Linux) over the non-OS?
I was wondering because I just have recently used an N73 and found out that activating the camera took so much time that 'kodak' moments were lost before it was up (and it was just about the same for recycle time). So much for the Zeiss 3mp autofocus mechanical shutter thingy.
And I'm just not complaining about the camera either, overall the phone's speed cannot match my k750i, which has 1gb of memory, as opposed to N73 128mb (and no, the memory was not full when I was using the camera).
Multitasking? New phones (non-OS) have 'multitasking'. How many users do you know of would multitask anyway? And aside from listening to music while writing, or downloading, what else would you multitask?
Memory management? I've read of 'memory leaks'. Is that exclusive to OS phones? I had to reboot the N73 at least 5 times in half a day. Probably the same for my K750 in half a year.
I'm not bashing on brand, model or OS. In fact I'm considering a Nokia E series phone as my next phone, depending on how the next gen P series is.
I just wanted to know if buying an OS smartphone is worth it.
So discounting the fact that I can have QuickOffice on OS phones, what other reasons are there to buy one?
Posted by maggflodd
Can't talk about the n73's slow shutter, don't have one... What I can say is that my 4gb hard drive n91 and my e61 with 2gb are in every respect faster than my k750 and my wife's w810 (both only 512mb stick)! As to multitasking: which SE non-smartphone is it that lets you browse the internet using opera mobile and while you're at it you check your e-mail using pprofimail, edit the word attachment, send it back, all the while listening to music on the nice built in player, then someone says' I liked that last song you were playing, so while you listen to the next song, you bluetooth the one before to your friend's phone, then you edit your playlist - oops opera's still running, let's check on esato (music still playing)....ah, your friend wants to see that game youwere talking about, so you start that while music's playing, opera's running...ah, e-mail incoming... Meeting, oops, check calendar..... So, what was the se non-smarty that does that? Cause I'd like one if the shutter's still working while you do all that?!
Posted by paul5678
Thanks for your input. Unfortunately I can't tell you what 'se non-smarty' that does all that multitasking, as all I know about non-smartphone 'multitasking' is minimizing the app, then opening something else. Like minimizing the K750i radio then creating/reading a text message. I have no idea how many apps you can minimize in newer models (SE or not).
As for the speed issue, maybe the N73 I used needs a software upgrade.
Like I said, I'm planning on a Nokia E series phone for my next upgrade. I'm just having second thoughts if a Symbian (or any other OS for that matter) is worth spending what meager funds I have. I guess the question should be: What can I do with a smartphone that a non-smartphone cannot do?
Posted by maggflodd
Have no doubts about e-series upgrade, you will not regret it! E65 got great reviews, and check out e61i thread here at esato (and e-series thread...)!
As to n73...I honestly don't know - that seems to have had some fw(?) issues... But I've come to believe that it's actually good that voda-Ireland are so damn slow at releasing new models because at least the last 3 phones from them were flawless...NEVER had any reason to even consider fw-upgrade!!! So, there's good in bad (dito by the way their n73 - my colleague's is without fault and shutter speed's not an issue...)
Posted by Dogmann
@paul5678
Are you aware that all Symbian 9.1 devices whether from Nokia or SE suffer from RAM problems some worse than others. There is no way your N73 should need rebooting twice a day never mind 5 times, unless of course you just keep on opening things and never shut anything down properly.
A smart phone require a certain amount of user interaction to run smoothly maybe they shouldn't but in this less than perfect world I'm afraid they do.
I would advise making sure you have the latest firmware if your N73 is unbranded and look into getting a Task Manager Handy Taskman is the best IMO and maybe learning a bit more about how to get the best out of your phone.
As for what else does a smart phone do you mean besides automatically down loading your E-mail for you,keeping your calander and contacts in sync with your computer, reading word and excel Doc's and some even enable editing, some also play PowerPoint presentations, running Sat Nav software, playing your Music and films well not much.
Marc
Posted by paul5678
thanks dogmann
Well I've read about Symbian memory issues. How is this problem compared to other OS (i.e windows mobile)?
I had to reboot several time when using the camera. It simply locks up, after taking a pic and you press on back to take the next one. It doesn't normally require that much rebooting.
Forgive my ignorance, but can't I automatically download email (is that called push mail?) from a non-smartphone (later models perhaps)? And as far as I know I can sync my calendar and contacts (although limited) with my K750.
How about PDAs? Do they have the same 'issues' with smartphones? Or are better because of hardware difference (if any)?
I just want to keep my options open. I mean if buying a PDA phone (although more expensive) means less problems, that could be an option.
Posted by maggflodd
On 2007-05-02 11:46:33, paul5678 wrote:
thanks dogmann
Well I've read about Symbian memory issues. How is this problem compared to other OS (i.e windows mobile)?
I had to reboot several time when using the camera. It simply locks up, after taking a pic and you press on back to take the next one. It doesn't normally require that much rebooting.
Forgive my ignorance, but can't I automatically download email (is that called push mail?) from a non-smartphone (later models perhaps)? And as far as I know I can sync my calendar and contacts (although limited) with my K750.
How about PDAs? Do they have the same 'issues' with smartphones? Or are better because of hardware difference (if any)?
I just want to keep my options open. I mean if buying a PDA phone (although more expensive) means less problems, that could be an option.
Posted by Dogmann
@paul5678
You don't actually need to have push e-mail you can configure the device to connect to your e-mail service between the hours you decide and at various configurable intervals so it requires no real interaction from you once set up. If you have a Yahoo account the N73 has Yahoo Go in the download section that will give a variety of easy to access services including Photo uploading, calendar, contacts and of course e-mil just as if it was on your computer account.
Their really is no perfect device as yet and personally i doubt there ever will be but they are getting much better and should continue to improve. A stand alone PDA without any phone functionality basically has less to go wrong so can be more stable. But then you can't achieve a lot of things possible on a smart phone with out having to use a mobile with it or a WiFi hot spot. IMO there really is no simple answer as to what device is best as it all depends on what is important to each user and what they feel they either want or need.
Really you need to work out what you want your device to do and list the most important factors to you and then look at which devices suit that criteria best choosing is never simple or easy.
Marc
Posted by paul5678
Sorry for late reply, but we have difference in time zone. But thanks to both of you for your help.
I'd probably go for a smartphone. I haven't really had one since my first cellphone way back in '92. Anyway I think any issues get sorted out one way or another.
I currently have my eye on the E65, but I'll probably wait for the p700.
Posted by maggflodd
On 2007-05-03 01:55:01, paul5678 wrote:
Sorry for late reply, but we have difference in time zone. But thanks to both of you for your help.
I'd probably go for a smartphone. I haven't really had one since my first cellphone way back in '92. Anyway I think any issues get sorted out one way or another.
I currently have my eye on the E65, but I'll probably wait for the p700.
Posted by paul5678
'just too many "greatest new things" around constantly...'
- it's either a good thing or a bad thing depending how you look at it. Technology moves in a pace where something you just bought is yesterday's model 6 months from now.
But then again just waiting for next big thing will get you nothing. I just hope that the P700 will not be disappointment, and doesn't cost an arm and a leg. I've always been 'biased' to SE phones, but that's just because I usually get more for what I pay for than other brands (although that may now only be true for earlier models). But I won't hesitate to get another brand if it suits me.
Thanks again.
Posted by Kikos
I know definitely that "smartness" is not what I want in a phone; I don't really like the OS thing in it.
I'd like to enumerate each feature, that is absent in my k750 and I'd like to have
- wifi
- full internet browser
- java multitasking
- built in skype-like application
- built in pdf, doc (office) reader
- more java heap (instead of 1Mb)
- maybe push mail
Note that none of these features make it necessary to use OS, each of them could be implemented in a simple phone UI, I'm sure it would be more convenient than any smart phone.
according to java multitasking, there is a way in k750 , though it can seem a little uncomfortable to use, but I use it always, and I'm able to chat on ICQ, to check e-mail, browse the web, listen to music, translate some words in a dictionary, and many other things simultaneously.
_________________
Kikos
[ This Message was edited by: Kikos on 2007-05-03 12:18 ]
Posted by mib1800
and many other things simultaneously
Only if those "other things" are java programs. You cannot multitask phone functions. (except for mp3 player)
Posted by maggflodd
On 2007-05-03 13:16:38, Kikos wrote:
I know definitely that "smartness" is not what I want in a phone; I don't really like the OS thing in it.
I'd like to enumerate each feature, that is absent in my k750 and I'd like to have
..... according to java multitasking, there is a way in k750 , though it can seem a little uncomfortable to use, but I use it always, and I'm able to chat on ICQ, to check e-mail, browse the web, listen to music, translate some words in a dictionary, and many other things simultaneously.
_________________
Kikos
[ This Message was edited by: Kikos on 2007-05-03 12:18 ]
are you still talking about the Sony Ericsson k750i?
Posted by Kikos
I don't really need to multitask phone functions. I mean I don't need to minimize main menu, or something like sms, or gallery. I'd like to have minimize only on certain apps like pdf reader, and skype (if there were those), just like the same way as Media Player and My Friends have.
Yes I was talking about k750
_________________
Kikos
[ This Message was edited by: Kikos on 2007-05-03 14:03 ]
Posted by Dogmann
@Kikos
The things you would like to do is indeed exactly why people buy smart phones and most of those processes actually require both processing power and Ram. Even some smart phones such as the P990 have difficulties opening big PDF files and there are many complaints about the PDF reader in the P990 and that is a fully fledged smart phone. I suggest you look a bit more at smart phones and even the limitations they have with their processors and RAM as then you may realise that what you are expecting from a non smart phone isn't really possible. Running Java apps and minimizing them is hardly the same thing at all IMHO.
Marc
Posted by Kikos
I'm aware of all the limitations - of cpu speed, of power, battery performance, etc. I really read a lot here in Esato, and elswhere in the net.
My only idea is that k750 UI is already smart enough, with its volume, play/pause key, activity menu ... .
But imagine there was an SE phone similar to k750, with additional certain built-in applications (those I've written about), such phone would have very stable "OS", similar to samsung phones with their Picsel Viewer. In addition that phone can have powerfull Java platform for all other 3-rd party applications that can be stable or not, that would't be important very much, because after closing java application all the memory frees up, and there is no need to restart the phone. I think the battery performance of such kind of phone would be better than those in smartphones.
It seems to me such system could be close to perfect, and it really would be first a phone and only after it a PDA.
I hope I'm explaining clearly.
Posted by OluYom
@kikos: First off, ALL phones run one OS or the other. The big difference is that smartphones run "open" OS, enabling installation of 3rd party applications, while non-smartphones run "closed" OS.
Second, all phones have processors too; not just smartphones. But smartphones do have more powerful processors.
In the final analysis, the tasks you are looking to do on your mobile are only possible on a smartphone (at least for now). You may not be aware of it, but even java applications can be processor and RAM hungry; as anyone in the know will confirm. As such, looking for java as an alternative to full-fledged open OS applications may not necesarilly be a successful quest.
Cheers.
Posted by Kikos
i didn't say that java does not need cpu or ram, it uses even more resources thats why i keep java for the rest (not mandatory) applications, that are more or less simple apps. but in this case there is an advantage, as i've already said by only closing java platform we simply clear all the memory.
closed os has simple architechture that's why i like it. and it needs less resources beleive me.
Posted by paul5678
Multitasking needs I think really depends on the user. As well the ability to open/edit office docs. It may be true that majority of smartphone users do not know what their phones are really capable of, other than they read somewhere or heard from someone that their smartphone is a 'cool' model.
I really don't do much multitasking other than listen to radio/mp3 while doing other stuff, nor require to read office docs. But that could change, and it's better to have a phone that could, rather than whine about it when the time comes.
At least that's the way I see it.
Posted by Indiandawg
i really cant think of a normal phone am so addicted to smartphone now and right now i dont have p990i as its dead i cant decide what to buy now...!!
iv been thinking to buy p990i again cause that cell phone really rox man.. its got everything what i want from big features to small features... but then i dont want to waste money for may be 4-5 months or more... and then the new P series phone comes out..
i know p700 soon is going to be released but i want the proper P series phone with flip .. and may be i expect 5mp and lot other big features in the next Pxxx
coming back to the topic i cant think of a normal phone because it limits you... but not adding the application which can help you better day to day life... even if you say you got the java apps they are not upto the level of symbian apps and they can never be..
normal phones are all about games,videos,pictures,themes thats what i see in every non-symbian phones... and i'm tired of that iv used t68i,t610,k700i,w800i and i guess thats enuff now..!! p910i and p990i are the phones that i have always LOVED...!! even when p990i came out with a bad firmware i knew they would come out with the best firmware and they have..!!